Someone is "stealing" desserts (or, help my son

amother

Wheat

Wed, Sep 25 2024, 12:49 pm

amother OP wrote:

Thank you, everyone, for letting me know that it's not just me! I really like this idea and might do it.

Is it really normal for kids to take food that is obviously not meant for snacking, though? At what age? Do they feel any guilt about doing it (as in, they realize they shouldn't), or is it just the norm, anything in the house is fair game to eat?

To me, it's the same thing as if they see a closed package on the dining room table. I would expect that they should not open. They might be tempted to open it, feel curious about it, but if they did open it without asking whose it was and if they can look, they would feel guilty about it and know they did something wrong, wouldn't they? To me, this is the same thing...What am I missing?

I grew up in a home where you ate three meals a day and could eat only healthy things between meals, like a fruit or something, without asking. Snacks were for school lunches, or treats on Shabbos, or given by a parent as a special treat for something. Home-baked goods were not for noshing on -- they were for family desserts unless my mother wanted to get rid of them for some reason (before Pesach, for example).

I don't have a lot of extra time to bake, nor do I have teenage girls to fill up my freezer, nor do I want my kids snacking on garbage all day. I could eat a whole bag of homemade chocolate chip cookies in a sitting, but I know not to. I'm not sure this kid would have that "stop" button. Am I really unusual? Do most people with older kids just have an open freezer, and they even have to mislabel foods, otherwise they actually disappear? And they don't think there's an issue with this?

I don't have an open freezer but I allow my kids to snack on some baked goods by always have a cookie jar with something in it. You are right not to allow them to eat food you specifically made for yom tov but maybe have more snack options around. I don't think only healthy snack options is so realistic.

↑ giftedmom

Wed, Sep 25 2024, 12:50 pm

amother OP wrote:

Store bought snacks are a lot more garbage. The good thing about homemade is that you control what goes in. You can use whole wheat flour and make recipes that have protein and will fill them up more. You can use organic ingredients etc.

mushkamothers

Wed, Sep 25 2024, 12:53 pm

I used to go downstairs into the basement freezer and shave off slices of 7 layer cake until the whole cake was finished lol. My mother always teased me about the mouse in the basement!

amother

Milk

Wed, Sep 25 2024, 1:03 pm

My mother used to “hide” cakes and cookies from us. Anything special like chocolate (which was rare) was hidden. We only got a rationed amount as a special treat or dessert on shabbos. Nothing was ever put out in the middle of the table. Small amounts were given out. We basically hardly ever had sweets. Of course the older we got, the more we craved it since we felt so deprived.
When something was too big to hide, my mother would take it to her bedroom and lock it inside.
One time she accused me of eating her cookies. Her proof was that she found cookie crumbs in the cushion of the couch. Eating on the couch was a big no no in our house so this was a double aveira.
And I didn’t know what she was talking about because I didn’t do it.
Turns out, we later realized that the “crumbs” on the couch were pieces of the stuffing/foam that was falling apart.
I felt terrible that I was accused that I still remember this incident many years later.
The whole thing came from hiding food and us not being allowed to have cake and cookies when it was in the house.
All of us are grown now and we all have a weight problem because now we can eat whatever we want with no policewoman.
We don’t know how to eat normally.
In my own house I let my kids eat sweets almost unlimited (unless it’s meal time) and they aren’t even excited about it. They are more excited about salad and watermelon.
I don’t believe in hiding food and confronting kids to see if they took.
And these days I even let my kids eat on the couch too!
Just make an announcement that you made things that you plan on serving on Yom Tov so no one should take anything from the freezer without asking.
Don’t accuse anyone. No one was trying to be bad.
Someone was just hungry and likes your recipes.

amother

Banana ↓

Wed, Sep 25 2024, 1:13 pm

Different houses have different food cultures. You know the culture in your house and you know if this kid knows they're doing something they shouldn't be or not.

Also, different kids have different relationships with food, and you know if this is normal preteen munchies, or more of a compulsive eating kind of issue.

amother

Salmon

Wed, Sep 25 2024, 1:15 pm

I'm really not understanding why a teenager would need to feel guilty about taking a snack from the freezer in his house. Sure, if you don't like it and want to save it, tell your kids. But he's not doing anything wrong by taking if he's unaware you don't want him to.
But then again, I also don't understand the parents who freak out about their child 'stealing' a 20 dollar bill from their purse.

amother

Junglegreen

Wed, Sep 25 2024, 1:17 pm

I'd involve him in baking and try for some more wholesome recipes that are separate from the y"t desserts.
The idea of restricting food from my kids is very foreign to me (the lock Surprised

)

amother

Impatiens ↓

Wed, Sep 25 2024, 1:18 pm

I’d out a lock on the downstairs freezer. Even with saying it’s for Yom tov don’t take they will probably take.

amother

↑ Seashell ↓

Wed, Sep 25 2024, 1:28 pm

amother Impatiens wrote:

I’d out a lock on the downstairs freezer. Even with saying it’s for Yom tov don’t take they will probably take.

And most kids know how to pick the freezer locks, it's not rocket science lol!

amother

↑ Impatiens

Wed, Sep 25 2024, 1:30 pm

amother Seashell wrote:

And most kids know how to pick the freezer locks, it's not rocket science lol!

That’s not true I meant one with a combination and no it’s not so easy to pick it. And if after showing your kids it’s truly off limits and they break it open anyway, it’s time to get your kid very serious help. That’s a sign they have issues that will only grow larger.

amother

↑ OP ↓

Wed, Sep 25 2024, 1:50 pm

I feel like I'm part of a different world.

Forget about whether all foods should be available to kids at all times. Setting that aside, if you have an area of your house that you don't want your kids going into, for whatever reason, and you TELL them so, you would really expect them to go in anyway? So much so that you'd have to lock it up? And then people are saying that their kids would actually break the lock, rather than listen to you?

I don't know. My kids are not angels. (Hey, I wrote this post, didn't I?) But honesty and respect are things that are really important to us. If someone says not to touch something, you don't touch it. If you really want to, you sit down and talk to them about it, explain your reasoning, fine. But you don't just ignore them and do it anyway.

That would be true whether it was a parent or a friend or a sibling or whatever. My kids have their stashes of candy that they got from simchas torah, or shalach manos, or prizes in school, or whatever. It's not locked up. It's easily accessible, but none of them would just go and eat stuff that didn't belong to them.

Is putting boundaries like that down for kids really that strange? Is it just because this is food that is for the family eventually? Or because he might not know that it's for yom tov? Would your responses be the same if it was about things that "belonged" to someone else?

Trying to understand why the responses on this thread seem to think I'm crazy or overbearing, when I think I'm pretty reasonable. (Doesn't mean I don't have to change the way I've been doing things now...I admit that. Just trying to understand this very different mindset. Is it just a matter of having a different outlook on food? Or also of having different expectations of how kids should act/are capable of acting?)

boysrus

Wed, Sep 25 2024, 1:52 pm

mushkamothers wrote:

I used to go downstairs into the basement freezer and shave off slices of 7 layer cake until the whole cake was finished lol. My mother always teased me about the mouse in the basement!

thats too funny! Smile

amother

↑ Antiquewhite

Wed, Sep 25 2024, 1:52 pm

amother OP wrote:

Put the boundary 100%. But don't induce shame or guilt.

ETA: You didn't write that you had already told them not to touch. Just that someone was eating from the downstairs freezer.

amother OP wrote:

I have a freezer downstairs, in a room off the basement. One of the things I keep in it are desserts -- desserts that I've made ahead of yom tov, or if I double a recipe for Shabbos one week, I'll put the other half in the freezer for a future week, etc. Also if we make a batch of cookies and eat a lot of them but there are some left, I freeze them and we pull a few bags like that out another week for a sort of "buffet dessert" with a few different options.

This past Shabbos, my husband went downstairs to get a few bags for this sort of "buffet," and one of the bags was almost completely empty, with only a bunch of crumbs left. That was strange, as we normally wouldn't freeze a bag unless it had a decent amount (at least maybe 5 cookies?) in it.

Then today I noticed that there were a few cupcake wrappers in the basement garbage can, the kind of wrappers that I used recently to make muffins for yom tov. We didn't eat any of them yet, and they're a pretty distinct type of wrapper.

So someone is eating from my downstairs freezer. I have a couple of teenage boys, one of whom I'm sure it was not (he doesn't snack like that, is not a big eater). The other one does eat a lot, but I stock up on snacks that he likes and he's welcome to eat them whenever he wants, as long as he's not tempting the younger kids (toddler and preschooler) right before dinnertime or something. So I really hope it's not him, I hope he'd just let me know that he's craving something different and ask me to get it for him.

That would leave my sixth grade son and elementary-aged daughter, since my toddler and preschooler are too short to reach the freezer (and would have more of a mess if they tried to eat down there anyway). I feel awful saying this, but I'm guessing it's my son. He's kind of...a secretive type. I don't know how else to say it. He has a hard time communicating with me when something is bothering him. I have to notice on my own and very very gently encourage him to talk to me, and sometimes even then it can take weeks for him to open up. Recently I noticed that something seemed to be bothering him, and I mentioned it to him and asked him if there was anything he wanted to talk about, sometimes talking it out could help. (Last time this happened it was about a year ago, and he was having some issues with a kid in his class...B"H, we addressed it and all has been well since then as far as I can tell.) He didn't bite, said everything was fine.

I'm torn about how to address this now. If I just say "Did you take anything from the freezer?" I know he'll feel all defensive and be forced to lie and deny it, so that's not an option. Of course, there's always the possibility that it's not him. And maybe there's something else bothering him, and taking the treats is just a symptom? How do I get a kid like this to open up?

The other option I can think of is to tell him that since he's getting older, he might get hungry at night (that's just a guess about when he's doing that), so I want to let him know that he's welcome to take a snack from the pantry at night if that ever happens. And then see if the sneaking stops. But again, if there's something underlying that's bothering him, that will just be a bandaid, not really helping whatever is bothering him.

Also, it really bothers me that he can't communicate when something is wrong, that he bottles it up like that. It's not just that he won't talk to ME, I understand that I'm his mother, and he's turning into a teenager, and teens often don't turn to their mommies for help. But if something is bothering him, say, about a good friend, he won't tell them about it. It's like something is stuck and he gets so nervous about it. I don't see anxiety in him in general, just when it comes to communicating his feelings. Is this normal preteen boy? (His older brothers are not like this -- one of them gets a bit anxious about talking with friends but is very open with me and dh, and one of them is very confident socially and shares his feelings without even thinking twice, sometimes a bit more than he should...)

I'm sorry for this whole megillah. I guess it's not really about taking treats. It's about how to help my son. I know communication is so important for his future -- for friendships, work, family, and iy'H marriage -- and I wish I could help him in this area. Open to any ideas...

amother

↑ OP

Wed, Sep 25 2024, 2:29 pm

I didn't tell them specifically not to touch. I do think that he knew not to touch it, the same way that he knows not to put the keys into the ignition of my car and turn them, even though I've never specifically told him that.

But posters are saying that even if I do tell him, it's pretty much an invitation to him to take, so just let him, and mislabel the bags of the things I don't want him to eat so that he won't realize what they are. Others are saying that I need a lock. Some are even going so far as to say that a lock won't even work, he'll just break it (!!) and take stuff anyway.

That's what was so surprising to me. Which is why I'm wondering where the disconnect is. Why this is considered a normal part of preteen development. Why my expectations seem to be SO different than the other posters on this thread. Am I really crazy to think that kids should be able to respect boundaries?

amother

↑ Sand ↓

Wed, Sep 25 2024, 2:40 pm

amother Impatiens wrote:

I dont think locking food items is a,smart way of developing healthy habits in Many ways

amother

↑ Seashell

Wed, Sep 25 2024, 2:44 pm

amother Salmon wrote:

Taking a $20.00 from a mothers purse without their knowledge is considered stealing, even if it's $1.00 it's considered stealing. I'm not sure why you would think otherwise, unless a parent told their child in advance that they can take whenever they need.

Bnei Berak 10 ↓

Wed, Sep 25 2024, 2:49 pm

amother Junglegreen wrote:

I'd involve him in baking and try for some more wholesome recipes that are separate from the y"t desserts.
The idea of restricting food from my kids is very foreign to me (the lock Surprised

)

There's a huge difference between restricting *food* and restricting *treats for YT*.
Locking up YT treats is fine.

↑ mizle10

Wed, Sep 25 2024, 2:49 pm

OP do you have junky snacks in the kitchen for taking or only fruits and veggies?

↑ Bnei Berak 10

Wed, Sep 25 2024, 2:52 pm

amother OP wrote:

If you don't communicate with your kids then how on earth do you ecpe t them to know the things you baked are for YT? They can't know unless you *tell them*
Do you expect people to read thoughts? No. I didn't think so.

ShishKabob

Wed, Sep 25 2024, 2:57 pm

amother OP wrote:

They respect boundaries but it takes some of them longer to fully grow into it. You are not the same person as you were when you were a teen I hope?
Yes, it's a normal thing for teenagers to do. I can understand that it's a culture shock for you if you were so not like that when you were younger. But it's a very normal thing to happen and it occurs on a daily basis almost all over.
And maybe your kids think that you are so forgiving, you for sure wouldn't mind if they take a few treats here and there.
It's understandable that you are thrown off by this if you never encountered this before. Hugs