How do I handle this?

amother

OP ↓

Fri, Aug 09 2024, 12:26 pm

Wasn’t sure where to post. Someone I know does things with her kids that seem a bit dangerous. I really am not here to judge just wondering if I should just live and let live or say something and if so what.

The two things I’ve seen: 6 year old siting in the front seat. Hiring a babysitter who is 10 years old to take kids to the park. Again everyone has different standards. My kids are much older so I don’t know what’s normal these days but I know 10/15 years ago this wasn’t ok. Even my youngest didn’t go in the front until 13 because she was short. Maybe this is normal idk (not standard in my country to put young kids in the front).
Thoughts?

amother

↑ OP ↓

Fri, Aug 09 2024, 12:54 pm

SuperWify wrote:

In some countries it’s ok provided the child has a booster and the air bag is turned off.

Where is the park? How far from the home? How little are the kids?

In our country (USA) kids don’t sit in the front.

I don’t really want to give more identifying info, but it just concerned me the tiniest bit. The children are little (I think under 3). It’s a long time since I’ve had kids that age so maybe things have changed.

↑ mummiedearest ↓

Fri, Aug 09 2024, 12:57 pm

amother OP wrote:

Each car has different recommendations for weight/height depending on airbag position, etc. Age is not the issue. I would assume the parents have decided it’s ok for whatever reason.

And I can see a responsible 10 yr old being fine with kids at the park. It’s not a question of things changing, it’s an individual situation with parents deciding what works for them. It’s not really an issue.

amother

↑ OP ↓

Fri, Aug 09 2024, 12:59 pm

mummiedearest wrote:

Are you sure that is correct about the car? From what I always thought it has to be a certain weight and height which is never the weight and height of a child that age. Not car specific.

Anyways ok, thanks for the help

amother

↑ OP ↓

Fri, Aug 09 2024, 1:04 pm

amother Oleander wrote:

What do you mean thanks anyways? U were asking if you should be nervous answer is no. You got the answer

Where did I say thanks anyways? 🤔

I appreciate the help and I got the answer yes thank you

Oh now I see. I said anyways ok. Meaning I’m moving on from my rant about the car to your helpful advice about the park (and the car).

↑ mummiedearest

Fri, Aug 09 2024, 1:04 pm

amother OP wrote:

Car manufacturers do put out guidelines. States also vary with car seat requirements. My state specifies age or weight, whichever is first. Medical communities have different recommendations. It’s not so clear cut.

FTR, I’m short and not recommended to sit in the front seat of some cars based on height. I don’t check before getting in a friend’s car.

amother

Forestgreen ↓

Fri, Aug 09 2024, 1:11 pm

Kids die from sitting in front seats. Most 6 year olds need a booster and do not fit in seat belt without it. I’d give her the info. I have given car seat/ seat belt info to many people. Most say thank you I had no idea. A few get mad, but at least I know I did what I could to save a life. After that it’s in their hands. 10 year old’s can be responsible so I’d ignore that.

amother

↑ Forestgreen ↓

Fri, Aug 09 2024, 1:12 pm

mummiedearest wrote:

Once you hit puberty your spine can handle a car crash a 6 year old cannot.

amother

↑ Forestgreen ↓

Fri, Aug 09 2024, 1:14 pm

amother Natural wrote:

My 4 year old sits in the front.

Where I live a lot of ppl have a small car and they have no choice when doing carpool.

I can see a mature 10yo taking kids out

You always have a choice. You don’t have to drive carpool. And risking your child’s life is not allowed halachically. 4 year old’s need to be in car seats, boosters aren’t appropriate before 5/6 forget seat belts and front seats. Please stop playing with your child’s life, they deserve to be taken care of properly.

amother

↑ OP ↓

Fri, Aug 09 2024, 1:15 pm

amother Forestgreen wrote:

Kids die from sitting in front seats. Most 6 year olds need a booster and do not fit in seat belt without it. I’d give her the info. I had given car seat/ seat belt info to many people. Most say thank you I had no idea. A few get mad, but at least I know I did what I could to save a life. After that it’s in their hands. 10 year old’s can be responsible so I’d ignore that.

That is what I thought about the car. It doesn’t seem right that it goes by car manufacturer

amother

Clover ↓

Fri, Aug 09 2024, 1:31 pm

30 years ago, kids weren't sitting in booster seats and 6 year olds sat in the front all the time.
While I would never do it myself (except in an emergency situation), it's really not on a high enough danger level for you to butt into another's business. When I started reading your post, I thought you were going to write a toddler/baby in the front seat or on the parent's lap. Unfortunately, I have seen that happen. Had I known the person, I think that's a high enough level of danger to speak up.

And keep in mind, if you DO say something, there is almost zero chance you will change their behavior. She'll just write you off as a "Karen".

amother

↑ Forestgreen ↓

Fri, Aug 09 2024, 1:38 pm

amother Clover wrote:

This is nonsense. It’s very high on the danger list. I live in a place where people don’t care about car safety. I am so angry about the amount of frum kids that die in stupid car accidents. Not even serious crashes, but kids are thrown through the window from not being in seat belts or sitting in front seats. Kids being internally decapitated because they are in seat belts instead of car seats and boosters. No one likes when it’s posted on the threads of their deaths. So I’ll talk about it here instead.

So I’m going to say it harshly. Do not be the person who kills their kid because you couldn’t be bothered to care about basic safety. Laws changed because kids were dying. Cars are not new things anymore we know the risks. The risk is death. You literally can’t get higher on the danger list.

And speak up when you see it. I’ve taught many people and they changed. As Jews we have an achrayis to inform people of danger. We don’t get to walk away and say not my problem.

amother

↑ Clover

Fri, Aug 09 2024, 2:20 pm

amother Forestgreen wrote:

By the way, the average 6 year old doesn't weigh enough to trigger the airbag on in a front seat. So ironically, it might be safer to have a 6 year old sit there than having a 10 year old.

And you didn't address my last point. I can almost guarantee that the perpetrator will completely laugh off any mussar.
I've been driving carpools for 10 years. Many times I've had 6 or 7 year olds ask to sit in my front seat or in the back without a booster. They say their parents let all the time (and they're not lying). I refuse and say this is my car, you follow my rules. But I guarantee you that if I would tell their parents what to do in their own cars, it would fall on completely deaf ears. I don't believe in giving mussar when I know it won't be accepted. And hopefully shomer pesaim Hashem. Eating grapes and hotdogs can also dangerous, but I won't tell other parents what to feed their kids.

amother

↑ Forestgreen

Fri, Aug 09 2024, 2:26 pm

amother Clover wrote:

I addressed it 20 times. I constantly educate people and 95% listen. You don’t give people enough credit. And it’s not mussar to save a Jewish child’s life. The air bag is not the issue in the front, being ejected which is what happens when the air bag doesn’t work is the issue. It’s ignorance to even compare fatal car accidents to eating grapes. Stop down playing the horrible negligence in our communities. We are responsible to educate and make sure children are not being put in harms way and risk of death. Do better.