Origin of name Nechama

LiLIsraeli ↓

Wed, Dec 18 2024, 10:45 pm

I was thinking about the psak by R' Chaim Kanievsky zt"l, that girls shouldn't be given names without a mesorah, and so many girls named Shira ended up changing their names. Then I was thinking about Nechama - what's the mesorah for this name? Does anyone know?

amother

Impatiens ↓

Thu, Dec 19 2024, 2:45 pm

I'm relatively sure there's a long mesorah for Nechama, Tova, Bracha, Yaffa, Chaya

amother

Alyssum ↓

Thu, Dec 19 2024, 3:26 pm

Chaya, Bracha and Nechama are from the oldest Hebrew names that don’t come from names of people in Tanach. They’ve been around for hundreds of years. The male versions, Chaim, Baruch, Nachman and Menachem are also names that have been used for centuries.
Tova and Yaffa are 20th century names, mostly used in the U.S. and Israel starting in the mid 1900’s after WWII to name after people with the Yiddish names Gitel and Shaindel.

amother

Steelblue

Thu, Dec 19 2024, 3:32 pm

amother Alyssum wrote:

A rav told me that Chaya is the same name as Chava (“am kol chay “)

Ruchel ↓

Thu, Dec 19 2024, 3:45 pm

What do you consider a mesora
I Have an India Toba (Tova) bat Avraham bat Elias Cohen, passed in 1919, 84 yr old

another one, but can't guarantee it's not a Toba

ASHKENAZI, Tovah

1666

spouse
Mosheh ASHKENAZI
Hasköy Sefarad Musevi Mezarlığı /
Istanbul / Turkey

Austria: Turkish Community of Vienna
Eskenasi, Helene Jaffa
30-Jul-1851 (it's a birth)

Izmir (Turkey) Marriages - 1820-1933
5600 F HASSAN YAFA VIDA

amother

↑ Impatiens ↓

Thu, Dec 19 2024, 3:49 pm

Ruchel wrote:

WOW

amother

↑ Impatiens

Thu, Dec 19 2024, 3:51 pm

amother Alyssum wrote:

I'll be honest, I consider it the same name if it means the same thing. I've also read somewhere that Tova was used as a name since biblical times but cannot confirm.

amother

DarkMagenta

Thu, Dec 19 2024, 3:52 pm

LiLIsraeli wrote:

Nechama is definitely a name with a mesorah. It's in seforim.
You can always ask your local rav.

amother

↑ Alyssum ↓

Thu, Dec 19 2024, 4:35 pm

Ruchel wrote:

Toba is not Tova, though I know families that named Tova after someone who was Toba.
Toba is a Yiddish name. It ends in aleph. It means dove. A name given after Toba is sometimes Yona, Yonit or Yonina. Yona means dove.
Tova ending in heh means good.

imaima ↓

Thu, Dec 19 2024, 4:37 pm

Ruchel wrote:

Isn’t Toba = Toyba, yiddish for dove

amother

↑ Alyssum ↓

Thu, Dec 19 2024, 4:44 pm

amother Impatiens wrote:

I'll be honest, I consider it the same name if it means the same thing. I've also read somewhere that Tova was used as a name since biblical times but cannot confirm.

I would be curious if it was a reliable Jewish source that told you Tova was used in biblical times. Biblical times are the times of the Tanach. No one in Tanach is named Tova. The word Tova, the feminine form of the word Tov, good, appears in Tanach. AFAIK the name Tova doesn’t appear anywhere in mishna or gemara either but you’d have to ask a rabbi to confirm that.

amother

↑ Alyssum ↓

Thu, Dec 19 2024, 4:46 pm

imaima wrote:

Isn’t Toba = Toyba, yiddish for dove

It has a lot of pronunciations depending on where in the Ashkenazi world people lived. Toba, Toiba, Tayba, Taybel, they’re all dove.

↑ LiLIsraeli ↓

Thu, Dec 19 2024, 4:52 pm

amother Impatiens wrote:

I'm relatively sure there's a long mesorah for Nechama, Tova, Bracha, Yaffa, Chaya

So am I, since they have been used for that long. I guess I'm just wondering exactly what that mesorah is, and what defines a mesorah? Like how long does the name have to be in use for to become acceptable? Why are these names okay and not Shira?

(I'm asking specifically about Nechama because the person I was talking to about this is named Nechama! It applies equally to the other Hebrew names mentioned that are not names of people in Tanach)

↑ LiLIsraeli

Thu, Dec 19 2024, 4:56 pm

amother Alyssum wrote:

I know this. I guess I'm just wondering how it is that names came into use. I mean, Gitel and Shaindel were definitely not used in the time of Tanach. So what makes these names okay and not Shira?

amother

↑ Alyssum ↓

Thu, Dec 19 2024, 5:19 pm

LiLIsraeli wrote:

I know this. I guess I'm just wondering how it is that names came into use. I mean, Gitel and Shaindel were definitely not used in the time of Tanach. So what makes these names okay and not Shira?

You would really need to ask your own rabbi about this. There are some people that think it’s fine to give the name Shira. Others say that not only is Shira not okay but they add other names too that you shouldn’t use.

amother

Aquamarine

Thu, Dec 19 2024, 5:27 pm

The Chacham Tzvi had a daughter Nechama.
It's not biblical times but enough of a mesora for me to be comfortable naming and no current day rav is on a higher madreiga to negate the name.

amother

↑ Alyssum ↓

Thu, Dec 19 2024, 6:24 pm

amother Aquamarine wrote:

The Chacham Tzvi had a daughter Nechama.
It's not biblical times but enough of a mesora for me to be comfortable naming and no current day rav is on a higher madreiga to negate the name.

… which is probably why no current rav ever said not to use that name.
Shira on the other hand - maybe we should make it an imamother challenge. Find a rabbinic family that had a Shira more than 100 years ago. Extra points if you get to more than 200 years.

Elfrida ↓

Thu, Dec 19 2024, 7:44 pm

Interestingly, the word Nechama only appears once in Tanach, in a rather obscure context, I think in sefer Yeshayahu. The shoresh does appear in various forms.

I know this because when we were looking for a pasuk with the name, there were none to be found, and we ended up having to use a quote from the midrash or gemara (I don't remember which). In that context it was used as a word, not a name.

It may have originated as a feminine form of Nechemya.

Last edited by Elfrida on Thu, Dec 19 2024, 7:52 pm; edited 1 time in total