Kicking someone out of your seat

oohlala

Mon, Oct 07 2024, 4:33 am

amother Goldenrod wrote:

Sometimes, people misread the seating chart and sit in the wrong row. I agree to leave something like a sweater there by Kol Nidrei and overnight- best way. The woman, whether she sat there by mistake or planned to stay until the seat owner came, would likely feel horrible that she ended up taking your seat.

Agreed. Pple sometimes misread the chart and make a mistake. I’m sure they would be upset to know they took someone else’s seat and it’s 100% the right thing to do to inform them that it’s your seat, politely of course.

amother

Pink ↓

Mon, Oct 07 2024, 4:49 am

We put machzorim at our seats and no one took those seats. Also most people just walked to their seat and the person looked up and said is this yours? And then moved it didn’t require a lot of talking.

amother

Mocha

Mon, Oct 07 2024, 5:03 am

I had this situation and was so uncomfortable about it. Someone was sitting in my seat and I since I only came for shofar I figured ok I'll let it pass this time.. I'll have my husband leave my machzor after so tomorrow will be obvious that it's my seat... But I ended up standing for a really long time because they ran super late... Then I tried to be as polite as possible and asked for my seat but I felt awful about doing that. The woman was pregnant and she had a toddler.. I wouldn't want to do that ever again. I pretty much bought the seat so would have it for shofar because I don't come much more than that ..

Ruchel ↓

Mon, Oct 07 2024, 5:10 am

The pregnant woman is one of the exceptions... If there was NOWHERE ELSE to sit I might let her there. But see. I'd also be very very angry to pay hundreds?? And stand. I would probably consider this money tzedaka though so ultimately someone would get less...

amother

↑ Pink

Mon, Oct 07 2024, 5:12 am

amother Mocha wrote:

Most people sit fully expecting to move when the the paying person arrives. If she needed a seat badly she would have paid. Just because someone is pregnant doesn’t mean they aren’t able to stand for 5-10 minutes of shofar.

justforfun87

Mon, Oct 07 2024, 5:38 am

And this is why I 100% think that sitting in someone's seat is stealing. MANY people don't feel comfortable asking people to move.

amother

Cantaloupe

Mon, Oct 07 2024, 5:41 am

Last Rosh Hashanah I went with my teenage dd to my parents' shul. I didn't have an assigned seat as my original plan was to daven at home since I had a toddler. However, dd wanted me to join her. My mother wasn't in shul but she had an assigned seat, although (I wasn't sure which one was her seat and) I wasn't comfortable looking for it and throwing someone out of her seat so I could sit there. Instead I stood the entire hour or two I was there because there were no vacant seats in shul. I was pregnant , and yes, a young girl offered me her seat, but I always feel very awkward taking away someone else's seat.

amother

Taupe

Mon, Oct 07 2024, 5:53 am

I find it to be the same way , I pay for tickets to go see a local performance, h.s play and I come lateish, after doors opened, I always tell the person sitting there that this is my seat.

On rh There was a lady sitting in my seat, I told her very nicely, sorry, I want to pit my 2 yr down in my seat and she moved..

amother

Quince

Mon, Oct 07 2024, 6:15 am

Totally fine to ask for your paid seat, in a nice way of course.
I made it to shul only for mussaf and someone I knew was in my seat. As soon as she saw me, she offered to get up, but I told her to stay and I sat in someone else's seat who hadn't come. Were she to show up, I would have asked the person to give me my seat.

imanotmommy

Mon, Oct 07 2024, 6:28 am

You need a poll asking what we think you SHOULD do
I'm like you and probably wouldn't say anything Smile

but I think you should if the alternative is standing

amother

Plum ↓

Mon, Oct 07 2024, 7:50 am

Elfrida wrote:

My shul works on the assumption that anyone who has paid for a seat is going to use it. It is written very clearly next to seating plan that no one may sit in a seat which does not have their name on it, and the owner if the seat has the right to request someone else leave their seat at any point in the davening, and signed by the Rav.

In some ways it's rigid, but it saves a lot of misunderstanding and hurt feelings. And who wants to cause hurt feelings on Rosh HaShana?

Last year the seat next to me on Yom Kippur was empty the entire day, and no one asked to sit in it. She came for five minutes at the end of Ne'ilah - and her seat was waiting for her.

But what a waste of that seat (especially since we generally stand at the end of Neilah). It would be far better to say that one may sit in another's seat as long as they get up when asked.

Chayalle ↓

Mon, Oct 07 2024, 7:56 am

amother Plum wrote:

But what a waste of that seat (especially since we generally stand at the end of Neilah). It would be far better to say that one may sit in another's seat as long as they get up when asked.

If there are empty seats then there's no need to sit in someone's paid seat.

It's very uncomfortable to ask someone to get up from your paid seat.

amother

Clematis

Mon, Oct 07 2024, 8:05 am

A few years ago, I approached the woman who was in my seat. She refused to move, saying that someone else was in her seat. So I listened to shofar and left and went home. Next year I made my husband go to shul early and make sure to put stuff on our seat. I was so uncomfortable, never gonna ask anyone to move again.

amother

↑ Plum ↓

Mon, Oct 07 2024, 8:05 am

Chayalle wrote:

If there are empty seats then there's no need to sit in someone's paid seat.

It's very uncomfortable to ask someone to get up from your paid seat.

Agreed. My shul's women's section fills up a lot on Yomim Noraim and at some point is standing room only, so I didn't consider a shul with extra empty seats. If there are those, definitely don't touch someone's reserved seat.

But if there aren't empty seats, it seems a shame to me to leave a seat empty all day because of a shul culture that dictates that you can't use it even when its "owner" isn't present.

I guess it comes down to a question of how full Elfrida's shul is and whether there are extra seats available.

↑ Chayalle ↓

Mon, Oct 07 2024, 8:07 am

amother Plum wrote:

It's not because of a "shul culture". It's because those seats are actually paid for and belong to someone, and you don't take something that's not yours without permission, even if it's just sitting there.

amother

Almond

Mon, Oct 07 2024, 8:09 am

this is why when my young healthy adult daughter wanted to buy a seat so she would be able to sit during davening, I told her not to. the shul is known for being full and someone would definitely sit in her seat and she would not have the guts to tell an older or pregnant woman to get out of her seat. then she would be resentful of having paid and not gotten to sit. and that is not the way to start davening on RH.

amother

↑ Plum

Mon, Oct 07 2024, 8:11 am

Chayalle wrote:

I don't disagree with that in theory. I just think that IF it happened that women stood all day while a seat sat empty except for five minutes during Neilah (when its owner presumably stood too!) that is a real shame.

amother

Dimgray ↓

Mon, Oct 07 2024, 8:12 am

amother Cantaloupe wrote:

Sorry I would’ve asked that person to please move seats. It’s your mother’s seat I’m sure she’d have been very happy to know you’re using it.