Rabbi's shiur & sisterhood event problem.need advice

amother

OP ↓

Wed, Jul 24 2024, 7:19 am

During the summer, our Rabbi gives a woman's shiur in different locations. I think to encourage more people to come. The shiurim are currently outside at a table by a pool at different member's homes. These homes have beautiful pools and backyards. It is very generous to allow the use of their backyard especially when these women don't attend the shiurim regularly, just when they host the event. But, the attendees are not offered to swim after the rabbi leaves. This upsets some (many?) attendees as what is the point of us sitting in the heat and seeing the pool if we can't swim (and have women only swim time)after the shiur? It is uncomfortable for some (has been mentioned to me) to attend because it's a tease- here is a pool and you can look at it in the heat, but you can't use it. Also, at least one member offered her outdoor area for the shiur, but rabbi did not want it because it did not have pool. We tried to convince him but to no avail. This woman was very upset. At least one regular attendee won't attend when the shuirim are held at these locations. I know at least 2 women who attend the shiurim on a regular basis throughout the year who would like to host the summer shiurim but do not have pools. It upsets me that the rabbi is not aware of what is going on with this situation and does not realize how upset the woman was when he declined her offer to host at her backyard without a pool. I do not know how to approach this with the rabbi. or should I approach sisterhood? should I stay quiet? Any suggestions?

↑ SuperWify ↓

Wed, Jul 24 2024, 7:43 am

rachelbg wrote:

I don’t get it- why does the rabbi need a pool in the background in order to give a shiur?

Also, couldn’t an organizer ask the host ahead of time if she’d be comfortable inviting women to stay and swim afterwards?

You are correct the rabbis behavior is strange for insisting on a pool.

But… Is that a fair ask?

Last edited by SuperWify on Wed, Jul 24 2024, 7:45 am; edited 1 time in total

amother

Aubergine ↓

Wed, Jul 24 2024, 7:43 am

This is so confusing. Why insist on a pool when no one uses it. And just because they see a pool doesn’t mean they have a right to swim. They aren’t toddlers they can understand they are there to use the yard not the pool. I would straight up say why do we need a pool if no one swims. Tell him it’s offending people to refuse to use their yards with no pool. And tell the women to grow up it’s a shiur not a pool party.

watergirl ↓

Wed, Jul 24 2024, 8:11 am

Why is the shiur even outside, given that it's hot? That alone would be a no for me. I don't go outside in the summer, it's way too hot. So weird to me. The pool thing is socially off also.

OP this post reminds of the story where there is a shul with an age gap between members, and the older crowd was insulted that they were not invited to events for the younger crowd. I don't know why, but it sounds like a similar group of women who have expectations and hopes that are unreasonable.

Who would feel it's their right to use someone's pool just because they have the visual of it where they are? Do they go to the shiur with a towel and swimsuit just in case? Is the shiur advertised as Torah and Swim?

Is the rabbi really declining the pool-less home because it has no pool? Or because it's too small? Or because he wants it to be outside for some reason and the outdoors area is not comfortable?

↑ watergirl ↓

Wed, Jul 24 2024, 8:15 am

rachelbg wrote:

Sure, why not? She can say no. She can also say yes. You’ll never know until you ask. Sounds like it was never asked.

Ask culture vs. guess culture. Look it up.

It is not always ok to just ask, thinking "what's the worst that can happen, she can always say no". "It can't hurt to ask". It's not true. Asking CAN hurt. You should not ask someone to do something that will matriach them in any way, it's putting the onus on them.

If the pool is not offered, it's not right to ask.

ra_mom

Wed, Jul 24 2024, 8:31 am

amother OP wrote:

Stay quiet. If there are women who don't want to attend because there is a pool in sight, they don't have to. If they want to host they can speak to the rabbi directly and if he says no they can ask him why directly. It's not a good look to always be the one speaking out especially when it's for someone else.

amother

↑ OP ↓

Wed, Jul 24 2024, 8:36 am

rachelbg wrote:

Rabbi likes to do something different in the summer and he likes to be outside and hear the pool. I think it is to entice more people to come to the shiur. It is just upsetting that it is held only in homes that have a pool, yet we can't use it. My friends want to host at their homes, but he said no. And if can't use pool, why are the shuirim there? These women attned regularly while the hostess only join shiur when at their homes. It is upsetting that he does not "get" the situation.

↑ watergirl ↓

Wed, Jul 24 2024, 8:36 am

amother OP wrote:

This upsets some (many?) attendees as what is the point of us sitting in the heat and seeing the pool if we can't swim (and have women only swim time)after the shiur? It is uncomfortable for some (has been mentioned to me) to attend because it's a tease- here is a pool and you can look at it in the heat, but you can't use it. Also, at least one member offered her outdoor area for the shiur, but rabbi did not want it because it did not have pool. We tried to convince him but to no avail. This woman was very upset.

I wanted to point out one last thing here.

A women graciously offers up her home to host a shiur. And her thanks for that is that the women say lashon hara about her? For her great offence of not offering up her pool?

Perhaps the shiur should focus on hilchos LH, especially during the three weeks.

OP, why are they coming to YOU to put down the hostesses? Or is this part of a group LH fest?

↑ SuperWify ↓

Wed, Jul 24 2024, 8:36 am

rachelbg wrote:

Sure, why not? She can say no. She can also say yes. You’ll never know until you ask. Sounds like it was never asked.

Because it’s big ask. Your putting her on the spot.

She won’t want to be known as the mean one who doesn’t let the women use her pool so maybe she’ll be forced to say yes.

Don’t you think it already occurred to her that the women would want to use her pool?

Last edited by SuperWify on Wed, Jul 24 2024, 8:37 am; edited 1 time in total

↑ SuperWify

Wed, Jul 24 2024, 8:39 am

amother OP wrote:

Interesting rationale. Me, I’d prefer to be near the air conditioning. But that’s just me.

Rutabaga

Wed, Jul 24 2024, 8:42 am

What a strange situation! I also wouldn't be interested in attending a shiur outside in such hot weather and insisting on a poolside setting just for the visuals is really odd.

Is there a rebbetzin you can bring your concerns to? Maybe the rabbi will listen to his wife or maybe she would just have a better understanding of the social dynamics and explain things to him better?

amother

Seashell

Wed, Jul 24 2024, 8:45 am

Has it been presented to the rav as explained here, that women are feeling left out from hosting and other women are feeling frustrated by always having shiur by a pool on a hot day? He may not understand, may have been told that women would love this in the summer and is insisting because of that, maybe to broaden attendance. Has he been told about the discontent?