$300k IS NOT ENOUGH!!

amother

↑ Holly ↓

Wed, Dec 18 2024, 6:52 pm

amother OP wrote:

You’re twisting this. I did not lie about our salary or expenses (actually I listed expenses lower than what we actually pay). The only thing I omitted was that we have a lot of money in savings precisely because we have been earning this income for a long time, before our expenses were high. Most people don’t have that situation.

The reality STANDS that $300k can barely cover average middle class living for a frum family with 6 kids. There is no bait and switch.

Most people earning 300k didn't get there overnight. I assume they were earning along time too and putting away savings for a time like this. This is not the case for low income earners. Either way, what's the point?

amother

↑ OP ↓

Wed, Dec 18 2024, 6:52 pm

amother Holly wrote:

Sorry if I misunderstood. It sounded like you were spending on those things not not including it in your budget.

Tell me, do you go on vacations? Do you have cleaning help? How often do you buy a sheitel?

Did you read my follow up post about my true financial situation? Just making sure so you can read my answers to your questions in the right context.

We usually spend about $3k a year on vacations which covers about a 5 day vacation for my family, if very cheap flights are bought. Can cover more, or cost less money, if we do a road trip vacation.

I have cleaning help one day a week for 7 hours. $120.

I am married 10 years and have bought 1 new sheitel and 1 new fall.

amother

Birch

Wed, Dec 18 2024, 6:53 pm

Agreed. I feel like people are getting stuck on the number 300K, which sounds like a lot. I’ll be another to say that for a frum family of six children living in town, without prior investments / savings you’ll be downright tight if not in the red with this amount.

amother

↑ OP ↓

Wed, Dec 18 2024, 6:54 pm

small bean wrote:

You need a financial counselor because you should be better off then that on 300k.

Feel free to give me a budget to show me how I can actually be doing so well, I can’t wait to hear it! Make sure you include all necessary expenses. I really am serious, please show me what’s so obvious that I am missing.

(Regardless, we are doing well due to savings, but a budget assuming we didn’t have those).

amother

↑ Cerise

Wed, Dec 18 2024, 6:55 pm

mig100 wrote:

Most people paying 60k tuition. At least 5 or 6 kids in school hopefully bought a house more than 5 years ago.

It's not so likely to have both 60k intuition and a 6k mortgage.

m

Where I live, 60k is 3-4 kids without a discount (tuition is 15-20k depending on which school you send to)

amother

↑ Holly ↓

Wed, Dec 18 2024, 6:55 pm

amother OP wrote:

Yes I did and I was even more put off.
I don't understand your point of this thread. Like I wrote before, you aren't the only one who earned a steadily high wage over a number of years.
People don't jump to 300k overnight

amother

↑ OP ↓

Wed, Dec 18 2024, 6:55 pm

amother Gold wrote:

Why don't you help her? Show her which expenses she can cut.

Yes, exactly! So many people are saying this but I’m so curious how they would actually accomplish it (without living in a poverty stricken lifestyle, since that isn’t the point we are trying to make).

amother

↑ Gold ↓

Wed, Dec 18 2024, 6:57 pm

amother OP wrote:

I don't call living on savings, making it. Savings should be put aside for big ticket items such as weddings iyh and retirement.

I think you're right, OP, you're not making it (I work in the finance sector where everyone is focused on saving as much as they can so maybe I'm biased).

amother

↑ OP ↓

Wed, Dec 18 2024, 6:57 pm

amother Holly wrote:

Why are you assuming they put away so much money? Most frum families actually don’t. People tend to spend what they have, no one I know with our income saved/saves as much as we did. That’s a big point I’m trying to make.

Plus, many times savings are depleted once you buy a house, ESPECIALLY these days.

amother

Poinsettia

Wed, Dec 18 2024, 6:59 pm

We make around this much out of town and would not be getting by without some parental help as well. We don’t live especially frugally but also not extravagantly. We are primarily paycheck to paycheck though and don’t have much leeway to save much at this point either.

amother

↑ OP ↓

Wed, Dec 18 2024, 7:00 pm

amother Cerise wrote:

m

Where I live, 60k is 3-4 kids without a discount (tuition is 15-20k depending on which school you send to)

Yes, I totally believe that!

But the majority of mainstream Brooklyn/monsey/lakewood schools are not that high, those are the locations I specified in my my original post.

Although recently, more and more mainstream Monsey schools have $15k full tuition.

amother

↑ OP ↓

Wed, Dec 18 2024, 7:02 pm

amother Holly wrote:

What are you saying, that $300k actually is enough to cover the expenses for my family and I’m just bad at math? Or are you saying that all families making $300k are doing fine because they have savings to live off of? None of that is true. And for the record, livings off of savings is just one small step away from going into debt. It means you are not covering your expenses.

amother

↑ Begonia ↓

Wed, Dec 18 2024, 7:04 pm

amother Gold wrote:

Um really? Noone here is getting Obamacare? Noone here is getting Medicaid? Noone here is getting section aid or food stamps or WIC or "tax returns"?

Who's money do you think it is? Where do you think the government gets money from?

If 14% of your FEDERAL tax bill goes to Medicaid, 3% of your FEDERAL tax bill goes to food stamps, and section 8 and WIC are together a fraction of a percent, how much did you spend on taxes toward others' living expenses? And if the total budget for Medicaid is $607,000,000,000 and for SNAP $123,000,000,000 then what fraction of the overall bill did your portion cover?

amother

↑ Begonia

Wed, Dec 18 2024, 7:06 pm

amother OP wrote:

It sounds like you are living off of your gains, which is a perfectly fine way to live. I, too, lived off of income plus gains until we ran into some rough patches and the principal was gone and at that point, it is very difficult to dig yourself out.

amother

↑ OP ↓

Wed, Dec 18 2024, 7:08 pm

amother Begonia wrote:

Not entirely true. This is the first year we relied on gains to cover expenses. We don’t anticipate having to do that next year or in the years to come.

Edit: impossible to predict the future of course but if we do end up needing to rely on gains, BH at least they’re there!

amother

↑ Pewter ↓

Wed, Dec 18 2024, 7:32 pm

amother OP wrote:

I never said I’m paying for landscaping. My list of barebones expenses did not include landscaping or anything in that category, and income still didn’t cover this basic expenses.

BUT

As you can see from my recent post my income actually does comfortably cover landscaping. HOWEVER, if not for prudent financial planning early on and Mazel, I would’ve be able to.

And you’re forgetting, most people making $300k a year don’t have a lot of extra time for things like mowing the lawn.

Sorry, it sounded like those other things were things on your list that you pay for you but you didn't include the costs for.

Earning a higher income is not necessarily equivalent with more time spent working. Take and hour or less and mow your lawn once a week if you can't afford to pay someone.

amother

Hotpink

Wed, Dec 18 2024, 7:35 pm

amother Coral wrote:

Don't buy an $800K house
Why the heck should that be the norm?
OOT you can get a nice house for half that amount.

not in Cleveland a small house maybe but not a regular size house

amother

Orange

Wed, Dec 18 2024, 7:43 pm

amother Cornsilk wrote:

We make less than half of what OP is making and have double the amount of kids. I don't find these threads offensive at all. It's actually encouraging to me, that it's not like we could avoid struggle by earning more money. Challenges in parnasa are had by pretty much everyone, so we can stop second guessing our hishtadlus. We are doing our best, and Hashem will decide how difficult finances will be.

We make about a 6th of OP with a family of 6 kah and struggle just the same our expenses in every single category are so much lower but the struggle is real down here too. I dream about the days we’d make more money but I guess it’s a pipe dream

amother

↑ Holly ↓

Wed, Dec 18 2024, 7:51 pm

amother OP wrote:

I still don't see your point of posting. Don't pretend you don't know 300k is the higher end for most of us

amother

↑ Gold ↓

Wed, Dec 18 2024, 7:59 pm

amother Holly wrote:

I still don't see your point of posting. Don't pretend you don't know 300k is the higher end for most of us

I really wonder what you are trying to say.

Are you implying that you don't live in a frum community, you have subsidized medical, you don't buy clothing, you eat beans and rice for supper? No this is not standard at all in the frum community.