Not invited to my brother's Shabbos Sheva berochos...

amother

Snowflake

Wed, Oct 02 2024, 8:16 am

Chayalle wrote:

Ah, so it's ok for your parents to do this?

FTR we were invited along with our single and married couple to my 2nd SIL's Aufruf. And grandparents. They offered to put us up for the whole Shabbos. Ladies and Men's kiddush, all meals, etc....

I'm not saying anyone has to do that. But if you are expecting standard for Shabbos Sheva Brachos, this is standard for Aufruf.

I think the standard is to put up the men and boys for aufruf. Not invite the whole
I was only invited to one out the 10 we had on both sides. My in-laws did invite my whole family but they are extremely generous and gracious ppl
The standard for shabbos sheva brochos is to invite the siblings
I think OP has the right to feel disappointed and sad.
Trying to convince her it is the norm doesn’t really help
I personally think it is coming from being their first wedding
My MIL said she regrets that by her first child’s wedding she didn’t know the norms.
Once her sons got married she says she realised how many balls she dropped.

↑ 2429

Wed, Oct 02 2024, 8:25 am

watergirl wrote:

Yup. They paid for it, she clarified. So they get to come.

I disagree with this.
My brother is having an afruf the week after sukkos
My aunts are helping with the cooking ( we all help each other with simchos)
They are not coming since there isn’t room.
When we help relatives we don’t get rights because we helped. Even if they cooked the family should have invited Chosson siblings first.
I have helped cook for so many simchos I wasn’t invited. I have set up for many simchos I wasn’t invited.
This is a very transactional and non family way to behave.

Simple1

Wed, Oct 02 2024, 8:26 am

amother Mustard wrote:

I'm not putting you down. I'm putting down the idea that you think someone should go into debt for you to go to a meal.

I didn’t read the whole thread but I would make cheaper food etc rather and include those who want to participate. This might be cultural and that is how are family does it.

We’ll whether or not they’re in the right, I feel for you OP. Being left out in a small family doesn’t feel so good.

Last edited by Simple1 on Wed, Oct 02 2024, 8:27 am; edited 1 time in total

amother

↑ Babypink ↓

Wed, Oct 02 2024, 8:26 am

Making a small in house sheva brachos is something that should be encouraged. Too many in our community go into 8-10k of debt or tzedaka money to make a shabbos sheva brachos is a hall that they can’t afford. In this case the aunts are helping pay for the sheva brachos so it is essentially their sheva brachos as well so of course they will attend. OP is disappointed but the other side is doing nothing wrong. Life doesn’t always conform to our plans and OP should accept that, or be prepared to sponsor a hall so she can be accommodated.

patzer

Wed, Oct 02 2024, 8:29 am

I want to add that if it were my niece getting married, and I knew that my presence at the Shabbos Sheva Brachos meant that the chosson's siblings couldn't attend, I would absolutely insist on staying home, and tell my sibling to invite the chosson's siblings instead.
I had my turn to celebrate my siblings' weddings, and, believe me, I did so with a full heart. Now it's the chosson's siblings' turn.
And yes, I understand that in this case the aunts are paying. But....are they paying with the intention of funding their own meal, or do they genuinely want to help their sibling?

amother

↑ Petunia

Wed, Oct 02 2024, 8:33 am

SuperWify wrote:

Maybe not worth it for you. But I’m sure that hurt your husband.

Of course he was hurt. I was hurt too. My point is that not everyone does what’s “done” and op can’t really expect something just because it’s what people usually do.

amother

Hosta

Wed, Oct 02 2024, 8:33 am

patzer wrote:

If the aunts aren’t invited they’re probably not helping fund it, so the siblings won’t be invited then either….

↑ Chayalle ↓

Wed, Oct 02 2024, 8:33 am

amother Snowflake wrote:

It's not the norm. But neither is the wedding (by OP's admission) and this is what the Chosson/Kallah want. So it's a changed venue. I get OP's disappointment, but sometimes you have to live with what is.

amother

↑ Molasses

Wed, Oct 02 2024, 8:33 am

SuperWify wrote:

Nah. An aufruf is usually just a Kiddush for the chasson and anyone can walk over. A Shabbos Sheva Brachos is for the couple once they are married. A whole Shabbos. Yes, the whole immediate family on both sides should participate before any extended Aunts. Otherwise it feels like- my side and her side and not very United.

On imamother people love vilifying op. It’s very easy to do this behind amother. But if this happened in real life to you, you would be scandalized and hurt. Admit it.

I don’t know. I live in lkwd.

I was invited to every brother in law auf ruf in town snd out of town. Very Simple yeshivish families.

The other side might be hurt they weren’t invited and just assume to do the same.

It really is standard in most communities to invite to auf ruf same as sheva brachos.

It is assumed auf ruf is chosson expense same as sheva brachos is kallah expense.

If the chosson side isn’t paying for auf ruf then maybe they can offer to pitch in do everyone can go to sheva brachos. Especially if it means so much to everyone.

amother

↑ Babypink

Wed, Oct 02 2024, 8:33 am

amother OP wrote:

She's their only daughter so yes you go into debt if you have to, to keep up with the norms…yes they would need to accommodate whatever that looks like.
…..hiring a hall and going into debt.

NO, JUST NO. This is why so many in our community are struggling in the first place. It is time to stop pressuring people to go into debt to keep up with norms created by others who are themselves going into debt.

This is wrong and unfairly burdens our families, communities, and tzedaka organizations, and leaves do many with little or no retirement savings and no plan after loading up debt for multiple $90,000 chasunahs for the kids just as they are about to hit retirement age, just to keep up with the “norms.” Enough is enough.

amother

↑ Midnight ↓

Wed, Oct 02 2024, 8:34 am

I can't believe this is going on for 6 pages. Op has every right to be disappointed but enough already get over it. To think they should go into debt for you is beyond. you can argue from today till tomorrow, whether this is the norm or not it really doesn’t matter time to grow up get over it and move on.

↑ Chayalle ↓

Wed, Oct 02 2024, 8:37 am

2429 wrote:

Agree, I have happily made things for family's Simcha that I was not invited to.
But every family has it's own dynamics and we can't know what the Kallah's mother's needs are, and her relationship with her siblings.

notshanarishona

Wed, Oct 02 2024, 8:47 am

I would probably be slightly disappointed but looking back I am happy for people who don’t go into debt to conform to norms. I am one of 12 siblings. For most of the younger weddings, the choice were no siblings or have it in a hall. Most people don’t have space in their house for 50+ people. I didn’t go to most of my siblings sheva brachos, I mostly went to 1 -2 for each sibling.

↑ Chayalle ↓

Wed, Oct 02 2024, 8:48 am

teachkids wrote:

OP, if it means so much to you, you can volunteer to pay the extra costs that would allow your whole family to be invited. Otherwise, you can’t spend other people’s money

It's probably also about space, since they are making it in the house. I have a close relative who lives in a neighborhood where there are no Simcha halls, and when she makes a Simcha she literally uses every square inch of her dining room and family room with no extra space. And even in a big house, it's crowded.

mha3484

Wed, Oct 02 2024, 8:59 am

Chayalle wrote:

This. I dont live in the suburbs and I assume OP doesnt either. If you cant fit into your house most people here use a shul social hall but the vast majority of them require you either cook in the shuls kitchen or used an approved caterer which makes it less convenient and much more expensive.

I come from a family where my grandmother set an amazing example of getting along with the parents of her children's spouses even when they were not the kind of people she would gravitate towards socially. So to me that colors my perception of normal. Saying that, I am not sure you can insist they make a simcha that they dont want to have family unity with a group of people who sorry aren't there family. The chosson yes, his parents and grandparents yes but are you going to have anything to do with these people the week after the wedding. No you wont. Now I am ducking for the tomatoes....

Hamayvin Yavin ↓

Wed, Oct 02 2024, 9:03 am

OP, I’m sorry you aren’t invited. I’d be upset too.

It is not normal to expect people to go into debt so that you can come. It’s become expected that people should go into debt but that doesn’t make it normal.

My parents went into debt and did a similar situation as your brothers mechutanim except they accommodated everyone. They managed to squeeze in about 60 people into their apartment. They could not afford it. It took years to pay it off

My aunt’s also chipped in by paying for food and cooking some of it. Everyone was invited so this wasn’t an issue, but I would 100% have understood inviting them over a sibling from DH’s side since they took a critical part in making shabbos Sheva brachos happen.

Op, if you want to come, offer to sponsor part of shabbos. You know that they’re struggling financially, it isn’t right to expect them to host you for free under these circumstances. I agree with Watergirl that I wouldn’t even be able to eat knowing someone is going into debt on my cheshbon.

↑ Hamayvin Yavin

Wed, Oct 02 2024, 9:05 am

Hamayvin Yavin wrote:

I also want to add that my in-laws knew my parents were struggling and offered to send the younger kids plus the grandchildren to eat by a relative from their side to save us money. My parents were too ashamed to do that and ended up inviting everyone

amother

↑ OP ↓

Wed, Oct 02 2024, 9:32 am

amother Hosta wrote:

If the aunts aren’t invited they’re probably not helping fund it, so the siblings won’t be invited then either….

I didn't say that the kalla's side are poor, they can't afford to do 2 big meals in a hall. Doesn't mean that they're struggling financially. Afterall they're also making a wedding!
They chose this much more expensive hall for the wedding. Everything costs much more for both them and my parents as everyone is adding on much more to the cost of everything because it's not a local hall. My parents are going along with what they want.

I wonder if we'll be invited to any that their side are making. The only other one is the first one being made by these said aunts! 😭 I'll also be upset if we don't get invited to that first one.
It's a weekday so it would be without the kids.