New rules for cell phone stores in Boro Park

Elfrida ↓

Yesterday at 6:58 am

amother Magenta wrote:

Am I the only one who thinks it’s amazing?
I live in Canada and it’s always such a headache to get my new device filtered… if it can only come filtered!

I think it irks people to have it dictated to them.

גדול המצווה ועושה יותר ממי שאינו מצווה ועושה

amother

Cappuccino

Yesterday at 7:04 am

I really dont understand why all the critisism on this site for this. This is actually a potential loss tot he owners which are agreeing to this (unless the rabbonim raised money from our pockets and are paying them a lot for it) because they want to be carefull other people dont get trapped in shmutz and other things (just look at how many threads here there were with husbands watching filth)
Like mentioned above if someone really still wants they can order online etc (I am sure T mobile verizon and the others are not going to go for this deal otherwise it would mean mashiach is here)

I think this takana would mostly protect those who are raised in shletered families etc who want it to stay that way which is a tremendous thing.

Happens to be in israel its like that already for years and no one screams communism there

the world's best mom ↓

Yesterday at 7:43 am

I have mixed feelings. I can understand that people are upset because it feels controlling.

But on the other hand, they aren't doing this because they are out to get you. They are doing it because there is a real danger out there, and they are trying to make it easier for us to have a filtered phone. They see so many people without filters on their phones, and they are concerned for the spiritual wellbeing of those people. I applaud them for that.

People who davka don't want a filter for some reason can still get their phones in Flatbush or online. But there are people who don't object to a filter but never take the time to get themselves one. Or people who don't really want one but they'll take it if that's all they can get in BP. And of course, people who would only have a filtered phone and now don't have to go to TAG and get it filtered.

I understand why they wanted to enforce this, but I do think people will feel controlled and resent it.

↑ Elfrida

Yesterday at 8:02 am

amother Cappuccino wrote:

Happens to be in israel its like that already for years and no one screams communism there

Where in Israel? I've been buying phones here for years. I shop in chareidi areas, but none of my phones have come with a pre-installed filter, and the shops have never even suggested to me that I get one. If, and what kind of filter I want to use is entirely at my discretion.

amother

↑ Denim ↓

Yesterday at 9:19 am

I fail to see the issue. In my city I'll only buy from a place that sells ready filtered devices, my kids as well. Why ever not? Better safe then sorry, we need protection.

My Internet went off last week out of the blue. Turns out I'd got a new card but hadn't updated TAG of my new details, so they couldn't take the new month's payment.
Rather then leave me with an unfiltered device they blocked the internet completely. Seeing as my teens are on the same payment plan, I thought this was a very clever way of protecting us.

All these posters calling 'communism', do you not know the dangers of unfiltered internet???

amother

Coffee ↓

Yesterday at 9:25 am

amother Denim wrote:

We know. We are adults who can manage this on our own. We manage all other yiddishkeit stuff on our own, we are capable of managing this on our own too.

amother

Daffodil

Yesterday at 9:40 am

amother Coffee wrote:

We know. We are adults who can manage this on our own. We manage all other yiddishkeit stuff on our own, we are capable of managing this on our own too.

Ignorance is bliss.
How many frum men and teens do you know who have a cheeseburger problem? Guard your eyes has tens of thousands of frum men and boys, many as young as 11 or 12 who went down the rabbit hole of p0rn and needed help to extricate themselves.

Nuff said.

shabbatiscoming

Yesterday at 9:43 am

amother Cappuccino wrote:

Happens to be in israel its like that already for years and no one screams communism there

Im sorry but Ive been living in Israel for almost 22 years, before smart phones were a thing Smile

I have never bought a smart phone that was ever filtered. Maybe in your community or maybe in charedi cell phone stores, but NO, this is not how it is for years here in Israel, in the general population.

amother

↑ Coffee ↓

Yesterday at 9:46 am

amother Daffodil wrote:

Managing this on our own doesn't mean ignorance. It means we can choose the appropriate devices for our children ourselves. It means we can install appropriate filters ourselves. It means we can employ appropriate methods ourselves. We don't need someone to dictate and control us, it simply means we are mature enough and capable enough of doing right all by our very own selves.

amother

Lime

Yesterday at 9:47 am

amother Daffodil wrote:

I’ll add, women and girls too. I watched p-rn compulsively for several years from when I was 11.

I find this policy so silly. I used a laptop, not a smartphone. And all this will do is make people stop shopping local which will hurt the store owners and employees.

amother

↑ Denim ↓

Yesterday at 10:18 am

amother Coffee wrote:

We know. We are adults who can manage this on our own. We manage all other yiddishkeit stuff on our own, we are capable of managing this on our own too.

Your local Kosher butcher doesn't sell treif meat. Why not? Why can't he sell non-kosher meat and you can chose for yourself whether to buy or not?

amother

↑ Denim ↓

Yesterday at 10:22 am

amother Coffee wrote:

What about the person who buys a device, with the full intention to have it filter it, but comes across something before then? And it goes downhill from there?
Why leave an opening for the yetzer hora to get in? Please don't be naive by saying it doesn't happen, it does.
Most people who fall down this rabbit-hole don't plan it. So why not protect yourself and your kids as much as possible???

amother

↑ Coffee ↓

Yesterday at 10:38 am

amother Denim wrote:

What about if I buy a supposedly filtered phone, and the filter doesn't work. What about if my kid is smarter than the filter and gets around it. What about if my kid buys a phone on his own. What about if someone accesses the internet from a laptop. What about this. What about that....

You don't control society by managing all the the 'What abouts'. We do though for children. We are adults here and we don't appreciate being treated as children. If you don't trust us to do right, how do you trust us to do right about anything else. Do you trust us to have a kosher kitchen, or are you going to demand supervision in every house so that you can ensure we do right when a milchig spoon is used in a fleishig pot? Or how can you be sure we are doing TH right? Should we appoint a supervisor for every family to ensure we are doing the bedikos right?

If you are in a position where you can't trust the adults in your very own community, then there is something very wrong in that community. Either the education system is ineffective or the rules are inherently inappropriate.

amother

↑ Coffee ↓

Yesterday at 10:41 am

amother Denim wrote:

Why do you think I don't protect my children as much as possible? I am capable of protecting my children without needing someone supervising me.

As an aside, this new rule won't do anything to protect my kids more. If anything it may send a kid to help himself outside of the community.

giftedmom

Yesterday at 10:42 am

amother Denim wrote:

Yeah that’s why our teens don’t have any internet at all

amother

↑ Denim ↓

Yesterday at 10:43 am

amother Coffee wrote:

It's not about trust, the fact is that internet is a huge nisayon so why not send your kids to a kosher place if there is one?

amother

↑ Denim ↓

Yesterday at 10:45 am

amother Coffee wrote:

There are always gonna be those who will go to a place outside the community, but what's wrong with providing a kosher place for those who want? Why does it bother you so much? Sorry I don't get it.

amother

↑ Denim ↓

Yesterday at 10:46 am

amother Denim wrote:

There are always gonna be those who will go to a place outside the community, but what's wrong with providing a kosher place for those who want? Why does it bother you so much? Sorry I don't get it.

To add to my post. Why is it any different from tosfos shabbos, where we bring in Shabbos a little early to prevent chillul shabbos, after all we are adults capable of telling the time...

amother

↑ Coffee ↓

Yesterday at 10:59 am

amother Denim wrote:

There are always gonna be those who will go to a place outside the community, but what's wrong with providing a kosher place for those who want? Why does it bother you so much? Sorry I don't get it.

Bec this will have the opposite effect, cause people to frequent less the kosher place. When you wield such tight control, it sends many people elsewhere.

There should be options for people to choose from, not forced upon you. Just like when you go to retailer, they offer a range of options to you. So too should the kosher places do here. Offer filter options, levels of filters, other services etc, and let the adult choose what works for them. The benefit of a kosher place should be that all kosher options are readily available for you to choose from. It shouldn't be that this is the only way we sell a phone to you and if you don't follow our rules, we will shut your services down.

Can you explain to me how offering the kosher options to customers isn't sufficient for us. Are you suggesting that we will only do what's best for our family if we are forced and controlled? The end result of such rules is that it will simply control and inconvenience those who would have gone for the kosher options anyways. Because those who don't want any options, will just go elsewhere now. So I fail to see how this benefits anyone other than a fake illusion of some control.