If I'm meant to have money to buy clothes, H' will provide..

amother

↑ Tomato ↓

Sun, Jul 21 2024, 10:10 pm

amother OP wrote:

Amotherburgendy above explains this point so well.

It's actually the hardships that often show us the Yad H-shem. I'll give you an example. I had a child who had various complications at birth. It was an extremely difficult time, we were suddenly thrown into the scary world of illness, ICU, doctors, diagnosis's, hospital stays, home nursing care and more. All at the same time as trying to keep our home running as normal, we had a large by then.

Sounds hard, right? You bet! But, we saw so many chasadim along the way, like H' was saying 'It's hard, but I'm here for you.

just one example out of many:

-I had to travel to a hospital 2 hours away for some tests which needed a particular speciality. Usually, DH and I would drive down together, and once dc was awake from the anesthetic, I would stay until discharge, whilst he would go back to the rest of the kids. On one occasion however, my teen ds had a siyum for fathers and sons, which we decided dh would stay behind for. We tried to keep things as normal as poss for the kids during this time, and we decided that on this occasion I would travel alone.
I took the train, as dc needed tube-feeding, and oxygen etc which I couldn't do whilst driving. I was trying to be brave, but it was hard. DC was miserable, she wasn't allowed to drink because she was undergoing anaesthesia, her paraphernalia was bulky, and I was done! I sorely regretted turning down my brothers offer of a lift... Just then a friend of my Mom got on the train. Now, this particular train line was off the beaten track between the frum cities where I live, in fact I'd been traveling to and from this hospital for over a year by then, and had never met a Jewish person on this particular route. Honestly, it felt like a miracle! She was so good to me, helped me without being asked, without asking any questions. She got off at the same station as me, asked me if I was going to the hospital, and said 'great, I'm also and suggested we share an uber and split the cost. She came with me, helped me in and out the taxi, and walked me my ward, then left.

I was so grateful, she really saved me, and it was only later when things were settled that it crossed my mind that it's a children's hospital, so she definitely did not have an appointment there!

A week later, her son got engaged. I called to wish her mazel tov, and thanked her again for helping me out that day. She then told me that she had actually travelled to that city to meet her future dil, it was half way between their home-towns, and since it's off the beaten track, they weren't likely to bump into anyone they knew!

I shouldn't have attempted that journey alone, and have never done so since, but on that day when I was stupid, H' sent someone to help me.

So was it easy? Nope. Did H' show me He cares? Yep.

Maybe I shouldn't say anything here but I'll try. I've spent years thinking about these types of things and stories and I've come to the conclusion that they really don't make sense to me. Who knows, maybe I'm wrong.

It seems like you're saying that even small things that work out within a larger crisis or problem is hashem showing his love for you.

Am I mistaken that anyone that's ever lived can make this claim? How many times have the most terrible, horrible, antisemites, have small things work out for them during a painful time. The answer is many. Does this mean hashem loves them? Saddam Hussain escaped 7 assassination attempts. I'd imagine after each close call he said gd loves him. Every gentile in the world has experienced some good during pain. Every single one. Does this mean hashem loves them?

Are our stories different than theirs? Are our challenges different than theirs? Where do we see hashems love for us? Exclusively us on an individual basis?

amother

↑ Burgundy ↓

Sun, Jul 21 2024, 10:12 pm

amother Tomato wrote:

We say Hashem loves us because we know it's true intellectually.
These stories just help us feel emotionally when we already know intellectually.
They constitute emotional proof, not intellectual proof.

amother

↑ OP ↓

Sun, Jul 21 2024, 10:25 pm

amother Tomato wrote:

It's a complicated topic. Also encompasses tzadik v'ra lo. I posted above about my experience with a sick dc. It was HARD, and at the time I couldn't see 'point' of it, why would He make my child, I and my family suffer?

I can only speak for myself, about how I personally gained from my hardships. I saw how Hashem was always there, giving me hugs so to speak. It 1,000% helps me cope with life a whole lot better.

For one thing, I don't worry so much like I used to. I also feel less alone with my struggles, because He is always with me. I've learned to 'let go and let G-D'. It's very powerful.

amother

↑ Tomato ↓

Mon, Jul 22 2024, 7:52 am

amother Burgundy wrote:

How do they constitute proof? To me there's a gigantic gaping hole in this proof.

You're saying that when hashem does little things during difficult times he is hugging you and showing he loves you.

Hashem is constantly doing little things for every evil person in the world. The terrorist that is about to blow himself up to murder Jews had his favorite breakfast this morning.

The antisemites on the college campuses screaming to kill the Jews was late to their hate rally- but hashem arranged the bus also be late so they can get there anyway.

By your logic hashem is hugging these evil people and showing them love.

amother

Amaranthus ↓

Mon, Jul 22 2024, 11:48 am

I'm not sure I understand why it's a problem to say I see Hashem's involvement in my life, or that I feel Hashem's love for me when I see hashgacha pratis in my life.

Yes, Hashem is involved in my life and it's comforting. And yes, Hashem is involved in everyone's life, Jewish or not, good person or not.

Yes, maybe Hashem let Saddam escape 7 times, why does that negate that I see Hashem in my life and am feeling good about it? Hashem has a cheshbon with Saddam, and that is non of my concern.

HaTzur Tamim Pa'alo means that we believe in Hashem's perfect justice for all of us, both in this world and the next.

When I am worried about paying my rent, and the next day an unexpected check comes in the mail that covers my rent exactly, it makes me feel Hashem in my life and I am comforted. And if the terrorist has something good happen to him also, that's also Hashem giving that person what he deserves. It's all how Hashem runs the world.

amother

↑ Tomato

Mon, Jul 22 2024, 1:07 pm

amother Amaranthus wrote:

Hashkacha pratis as you're applying it is very logical. You feel loved when hashem works things out for you. So do I.

But if you're using that logic then we should also use it with everyone. The Hamas terrorist miraculously escaped getting killed today. Does hashem love him?

I guess my question is this: From a logical and explainable perspective, how would you explain why when something good happens in your life it's hashem hugging you, and when something good happens in a rasha life it's not a hug?

ShishKabob ↓

Mon, Jul 22 2024, 1:12 pm

amother Tomato wrote:

Hamas does not have hashgacha pratis. That is reserved for am yisroel.
When Hashem 'saves' a Hamas or does something beneficial to him/her, it has a cheshbon. Either they did something good in their life and Hashem wants to repay them so that they get paid back in this world, or Hashem is saving the person because he/she is needed to do something good for am yisroel, or Hashem is saving them for more humiliation.
We don't know the cheshbonos of Hashem.
We do know, that there is a cheshbon and Hashem is Just and Right, even if we cannot see it or comprehend it.

amother

↑ Amaranthus

Mon, Jul 22 2024, 1:39 pm

I would not say that when Hashem does something good for me it's a hug, but when Hashem does something good for a rasha it is not a hug. It is. I would say that I feel it's a hug for me and I wouldn't consider myself someone who knows how to explain something good happening to a terrorist. That is Hashem's plan, Hashem's cheshbon, not mine. If that rasha wants to feel it's a hug from Hashem that's fine. If he received good from Hashem, then it was deserved.

What I would say is that I don't bother myself with questions that I can't answer. I know Hashem controls the world, I know Hashem gives good things to bad people, and that doesn't mean that I can't feel it's a hug to me when I get what I need. I don't see those things as incompatible at all.

amother

↑ OP ↓

Mon, Jul 22 2024, 3:00 pm

ShishKabob wrote:

Just want to add, that Hashem may have a plan of how to get you clothing, He may get you other clothing, He may get you different clothing. You have to trust that Hashem will get you what you need and even what you want, although He may have a different way of getting it to you.
Lots of hatzlocha!!!

Thank you for your kind post... I'm struggling...my house is a mess, I had a difficult day at work, am working extra hours tomo, and my teens are gonna want 'fooood' tonight-that's after supper food-because they're fasting tomorrow...

I keep logging in to my basket...should I? Shouldn't I? Am I calling in a cleaning agency...or will I buy some clothes?

I wore my nice new 2-for-1 skirt today, I felt soooo good, a few people complimented me..I DON'T WANT to go back to my ratty black skirt tomorrow.

If I could call an agency cleaner for one hour, I would, but they only do 3 hour slots min. On the other hand, I hear my kids tidying up downstairs...the same ones who will want 'fooood' later!

It's so stupid, I'm only talking about $100 max! For an entire wardrobe (I don't need much). I'm going downstairs to tidy up, then yep, I've decided, I'm placing my order.

Thank you all for letting me drive you nuts.

amother

Electricblue

Mon, Jul 22 2024, 5:36 pm

amother OP wrote:

Good for you! And maybe we have the same cleaner Smile

mine is also away for a month now. I'm missing her terribly already. It's been almost 2 Tuesdays now without. Hatzlocho!

amother

↑ OP ↓

Mon, Jul 22 2024, 5:36 pm

Hi. I've come to update, I've put my order through!

Okay...I was doing car-pool earlier, and met a lady who runs a non-profit. I have a side hustle, a service that baalei simcha and non-profits need. It's not been my main job for a couple of years now due to my family dynamics. Pesach time, this lady called me and asked if be able to provide the service like I had in previous years.
I explained that I'm not doing it much anymore but would help her out at cost, charging her for materials only, which I did.

She emailed me shortly after pesach asking me to send her the bill, which I then promptly forgot about, till today! It was only $120...but it was exactly what I needed!!

Of course I was owed the money, and it would've come at some point, but I feel that because I was looking for a way to buy clothes, and asked H', He 'happened' to make our paths cross today.

I actually think that it also helped me view my frustration with my AWOL cleaner with positivity!

Thank you all for bearing with me Very Happy

amother

↑ Burgundy

Mon, Jul 22 2024, 5:41 pm

amother Tomato wrote:

I guess I wasn't clear. The intellectual proofs aren't based on what happens in this world. They're based on what we learn in the Torah.
What I'm calling emotional proof is not actual proof. It's a feeling we get emotionally. Because even though we know something is true intellectually, it can be hard to feel it. When these things happen. It makes it easier to feel what we know already intellectually to be true.

There is no way to prove Hashem's involvement from what you see around the world nowadays. And that's perfectly intentional. We believe in hashem's province because of the Torah. Not because we got a nice bill in the mail.

But maybe the bill helps us feel. But we already know to be true. Because they say the largest distance in the world is between the head and the heart.

The only actual proofs of God's involvement through events was yetis mitzrayim, kris's yam suf, and Matan Torah. It's been a while since Hashem has shown Himself so clearly. Which is why we constantly remember these events because they're meant to last all of history.