How to deal with 15 yr old son

amother

Tue, Jul 02 2024, 10:40 pm

I just don't know what to do with him.
We are yeshivish light family.
My son is going in a direction I really don't like.
Hanging out with friends I'm not happy with, wearing clothing I don't approve of.
I don't want to push him away further but I need to set some boundaries.
We just had a huge argument he bought t-shirts with his own money which I don't approve of. We made a deal that he would only wear them to camp but he just told me he is going out with friends and he was wearing the t-shirt.
I asked him to change into a white shirt which he did but I know he will take it off and put his t-shirt on.
He keeps telling me that his friends wear t-shirts so he wants to also plus I can't tell him that he can't wear it because he paid for it.
He refuses to wear normal pants and shoes.

He went out with friends and he either missed maariv or maybe he did go but without a hat and jacket.
I honestly am at a loss as how to handle it.

amother

Eggplant

Tue, Jul 02 2024, 10:58 pm

I have a 17.5 year old like this.
I would not allow a 15 year old to be going out with this type of friends at 11 PM.

What I did in this situation is to change his yeshiva to be away from his friends. To make new friends. It's not the tshirt or the pants but the overall attitude they adopt that goes along with it.

If a boy is headed in this direction, nothing you can do will stop him. He has to make the ultimate choice of how he wants to lead his life. It is very scary and painful sometimes.

But right now when he's still younger, you can have different plans than his friends. Different yeshiva, different camp.

amother

Junglegreen

Tue, Jul 02 2024, 10:59 pm

I wonder if you're scared about what path he's going down and you're trying to control it by fighting over the t-shirts.

Hint: That's not the best way to do it. Focus on your goal, and get some really good guidance on how to help him change his direction.

amother

Winterberry

Tue, Jul 02 2024, 11:00 pm

You need to be showing him *why* he should choose the lifestyle you want from him. Don’t push rules that he doesn’t understand. Very normal for teens to be rebellious. Give him love, understanding, show him the good of your derech and in time iyh he will see it. And daven daven daven. The power of a mother’s tefillah is incredible.

amother

Tue, Jul 02 2024, 11:06 pm

Its not so much the actual articles of clothing but the attitude towards it.
To me dressing in a refine way makes a person act a certain way and wearing a t-shirt to go daven and no hat or jacket makes it feel more casual and disrespectful to the davening if that makes sense.
I dont have a problem with his going to a friend in a Tshirt but I don't like him going out to stores in them because we aren't that type of family and if he would go out to a friend they would for sure go out to the store.

amother

Eggplant

Tue, Jul 02 2024, 11:16 pm

amother OP wrote:

A little piece of advice: whatever it is you show that bothers you, that's what they'll do just to get to you. It's a very tricky tightrope to walk.

amother

Tue, Jul 02 2024, 11:21 pm

amother Eggplant wrote:

We are considering sending him away but the problem is he has ADHD and has never really developed a love for learning. He was thrown out of yeshiva in 8th grade because he couldnt sit still and the rebbi and principal couldn't handle him. Im afraid all the yeshivos that would take him will have the same type of boys he is hanging around with now.
Yes it is really painful to watch and not be able to do a thing about it.

amother

Burntblack

Tue, Jul 02 2024, 11:22 pm

Speak to a wise Chinuch mentor

“Our family doesn’t do that”

What if he does?

In three years he’ll be an adult, can choose his own path. If you sacrifice your relationship for the sake of some externalities, you might end up with a son who doesnt dress the way you like AND you don’t have a relationship with him.

If you can figure out how to accept him (with some boundaries for physical safety ie be home at let’s say 10:30 PM) then in three years he may or may not dress the way you want but at least you’ll still have a good relationship!

justforfun87

Tue, Jul 02 2024, 11:23 pm

I'm sorry but you need to get a grip and talk to a chinuch expert. Arguing over a t-shirt is going to just hurt your relationship. He is 15. Show him you trust him. You can tell him how refined he looks in yeshivish garb but I would be very very cautious about picking your battles. It's a t-shirt, it's 2024. Be happy it's not drugs.

amother

Junglegreen

Tue, Jul 02 2024, 11:25 pm

amother OP wrote:

If he was thrown out of yeshiva a few years ago, then he likely feels the society you chose and you belong to has already rejected him.

I can't imagine him being interested in keeping the culture of that society by wearing that type of shirt.

Focus on what counts. Safety. Emunah. Middos. Responsibility. Your relationship with him.

IYH You will see much nachas from him, no matter how he chooses to dress.

chestnut

Tue, Jul 02 2024, 11:33 pm

amother OP wrote:

Which one from the bolded is worse?

amother

Eggplant

Tue, Jul 02 2024, 11:51 pm

amother OP wrote:

8th grade was not so long ago for him. Boys don't need to love learning to settle down in yeshiva. I'm in different circles but if there is anyone you know you can ask for advice in yeshiva placement, perhaps they can get you in to a more understanding yeshiva.
What you can do is to give him a ton of positive attention to bring out the best in him. He only has one mother and he needs to feel your pride in him. Not that he'll admit it.
See if there is a deal you can make with him about his hat and jacket, or about davening, or about dressing appropriately. After the summer when he's home from camp. The deals I have with my 15 year old sound totally ridiculous to a mature person's ears but they work and that's what counts.
For now you want him only to feel so special and important to you, as he leaves for the summer.

camp123

Wed, Jul 03 2024, 12:00 am

amother OP wrote:

He's living in a society where your love of learning and success in it makes you a success. He probably feels like a failure and wants at least to fit in with his friends. He needs you to build up his self esteem and show him you love him unconditionally . Fighting over a hat and jacket and clothes is just going to turn him away. Build a loving relationship with him and stop worrying about what your neighbors think. Hashem gifted you this child to help him through his struggles, and not for your own ego. Think about success in the long term and not a short term win.

amother

Peach

Thu, Jul 04 2024, 12:25 am

You must must must find a yeshiva that caters to his type, yes they won't be the masmidim and mitzuyanim out there, but in a place thats right for him he'll fly. If you are trying to push him to be something he isn't it's only going to backfire. Yeshiva for him should be warm and fun and loving and really cater to ADHD boys and you should continuously tell him how proud of him you are and how amazing he is. You are taking the wrong approach. Its about the friends not the t-shirts.

amother

Sunflower

Thu, Jul 04 2024, 1:06 am

With teenagers you gotta pick your battles carefully.

I save my fights for screen time limits and not missing school.

If you choose to fight about minyan and clothing then you have to give in somewhere else.

amother

Tiffanyblue

Thu, Jul 04 2024, 8:10 am

So he's already had trauma from the "good" part of the community for being himself (with adhd). They reject him. Don't have a place for him to be good. The signs he is showing mean he found out that there is a place that will accept him for who he is & you aren't going to like it.

I'd get chinuch guidance asap from those who work in this specialty. I'm sorry I don't have specific contacts to give you.

But many times know that you doing the opposite of what you are doing (and logically think make sense) is what works on getting the result you want.