Lakewood bubble | Imamother

4pom

Wed, Jun 23 2021, 12:22 am

Crookshanks wrote:

I learned this from my super sheltered, doesn't want any negative influences mother. She always schmoozes with the cashiers in every store we go to, and is careful to greet them by their names. Being sheltered, and having kavod habriyos are two separate things.

Me too.

My mother taught me the same.

Notsobusy ↓

Wed, Jun 23 2021, 1:03 am

amother [ Brass ] wrote:

I don’t live in Lakewood but I am going to blow all of your minds.
My next door neighbor is not Jewish. Crazy - huh? And here’s where it really get wild…. Our kids play together. Boys and girls together. Boom 💥 mind blown!!!

ETA-and everyone treats each other with respect.

(❤️,Sienna)

Now it's my turn to blow your mind!

I live in Lakewood and we used to have non Jewish neighbors with kids, and the kids all played together! My dds best friend was a mixed race girl who was living with her grandmother because her mother was a drug addict!

We don't have non Jewish children in our neighborhood where we live now. But we have some older people. We're all very friendly. We shmooze all the time. One couple called me over when they had a medical emergency and weren't sure what to do. They've also asked me to come help them with paperwork sometimes.

And my husband used to learn in BMG! And he only wears a white shirt!

Is your mind blown yet?

small bean ↓

Wed, Jun 23 2021, 1:03 am

amother [ Brass ] wrote:

I live in lakewood and don't have any Jewish neighbors on my block. We all get along nicely.

So is Lakewood now diverse?

amother

↑ Tuberose ↓

Wed, Jun 23 2021, 1:15 am

amother [ Cyan ] wrote:

This post made me laugh!

As someone who grew up out of town and lives in a (different) out of town community... Yes, I am indeed concerned that your children may not grow up open-minded.

That being said, my guess is that there are many of your neighbors who would see that as a positive thing. But I completely disagree with that, I don't feel it's a Torah hashkafa (but I'm not a rabbi).

There are positive ways to give your children a worldly upbringing. Go on road trips and visit other communities for Shabbos. Spend time visiting (kosher) museums or reading books to your children and teaching them about all kinds of different things. Talk to the non-jewish cashier about how her day was or learn the names of your cleaning lady's kids and ask how they are doing. Etc. Basically showing them that kavod habriyos and taking outside of your dales amos is a value.

I’m not sure how not diverse = not lacking manners.
Just bec I don’t have a neighbor on my block who is MO doesn’t mean I snob out the cashiers.
I actually find old time lakewood ppl super friendly to everyone. In many ways friendlier and reaching out more.
My in laws have lived in lkwd forever and they literally take care of everyone - doesn’t matter who you are or what you look like. Many ppl here are like that.

amother

Chocolate ↓

Wed, Jun 23 2021, 1:28 am

I don't see the Lakewood bubble so much. I grew up very sheltered, but my friends ran the gamut, from tights at age 9 to not currently Jewish (reform conversion).
We all have family that is not as religious, so I don't see even sheltered children not knowing that there are different types of Jews. I turned out fine, this doesn't worry me very much.

amother

Cerulean

Wed, Jun 23 2021, 2:25 am

amother [ Snow ] wrote:

Rolling from this! I live in Lkwd with my lil children. We have loads of OOT fam. This past week we met up with fam members at the beach. One of my relatives invited a friend who lives near the beach town. She doesn’t cover her hair and was wearing a swim suit. After we left my daughter asked me if she’s Jewish Laugh

Anyway to answer OP- it’s funny how we all have our concerns.. NO! I’m not worried about a bubble, they go to camp, the have friends, classmates with exposure etc (plus our own OOT fam) plus with social media the whole words is at our finger tips. What I’m most concerned about are the pressures. Especially being financially in a good place and trying to raise children who understand the value of hard work and realize how dumb lavish simchos, fancy cars and houses are and how those things are almost always done just to impress the next person. Makes me sad cuz I have no doubt my teenagers iyh will def feel peer pressure and idk what I’ll do about it...

The fact that you find this funny shows just how diverse it actually is Sad

amother

Stone

Wed, Jun 23 2021, 3:02 am

As someone who lived in Lakewood for 26 years, I can say, it’s diverse in that we have all type of mostly yeshivish people (ultra ultra to JPF). We do have a few MO and non-Frum Israelis who send to Hillel and Shalom but they are maybe 2% of the population.

I just moved away to a different community that is by far much more diverse. (Think LA, Baltimore, Flatbush type.)

amother

Broom

Wed, Jun 23 2021, 6:47 am

Here’s a different perspective. I live in a large community that would be considered OOT as it’s not in NY or NJ. Recently, some of my nieces from Lakewood came to visit. And there were so many things in our community that shocked them. Girls wearing nail polish to school, girls wearing short socks, frum girls with smartphones. . . They were especially surprised my kid’s schools actually assign secular novels as homework assignments. “You’re allowed to read non jewish books???”
So yes, I have to assume that your kids are growing up in a bubble.

Mommyg8

Wed, Jun 23 2021, 9:00 am

Diverse does not only mean Modern Orthodox. Diverse literally means "all types" and I'm sorry, but certain communities do NOT have a large Chassidish or yeshivish population, so they are diverse in one way, but not in another way.

And IMO, it's just as important to be open to and accepting of frum people who dress and act differently than you - aka yeshivish and Chassidish - as it is for someone to be accepting of MO.

I don't think Lakewood is turning Modern Orthodox any time soon simply because there is no infrastructure here to accommodate them, but other than that I do think it's pretty diverse, albeit in a more RW way.

In any case, I moved to Lakewood to raise my children in the "Lakewood bubble" and I don't apologize for it.

amother

↑ Goldenrod

Wed, Jun 23 2021, 9:05 am

Mommyg8 wrote:

That’s fine and honest.

Bluepink ↓

Wed, Jun 23 2021, 9:07 am

amother [ Broom ] wrote:

Surprised with you and all the other posters who assume one family= everyone in Lakewood. You are subtly mocking Lakewood for being judgmental and narrow minded with your story above, aren’t you being narrow minded by assuming that the entire Lakewood is just like your nieces?

amother

Ballota

Wed, Jun 23 2021, 9:11 am

A definition of diverse which includes only those are are Orthodox Jewish is not what is commonly meant by a diverse environment. It is deliberately NON-diverse.

People are arguing nuances of diversification in the same way as Eskimos have 38 names for snow.

amother

↑ Brass

Wed, Jun 23 2021, 9:27 am

small bean wrote:

I live in lakewood and don't have any Jewish neighbors on my block. We all get along nicely.

So is Lakewood now diverse?

My point is not that I think I am so diverse or a lot having a competition for diversity. It is sad that that is how the statement is being read. The fact that that is how you are reading the situation says a lot of not positive things about the reader. My point is that if one thinks Lakewood is diverse, that is so absurd and so indicative of how close minded some people are.

Chayalle ↓

Wed, Jun 23 2021, 9:38 am

amother [ Lemon ] wrote:

Not true. There are so many yeshivish kids in my kids schools, the difference is its a pressure to be "modern" unlike lakewood where its a pressure to be "yeshivish". But yeah, there is still way more diversity here(five towns) than lakewood- in lakewood while all dif there is a range- here it just goes from extreme RW (and yes, there is!) all the way to MO

it doesn't seem like the diversity is encouraged much though. My niece sends her kids to TAG, and I hear the classes are set by neighborhood. She is moving B"EH, and her daughter will have to switch to the class of her new neighborhood. Seems like the goal is to keep girls within their type.

I grew up in the tristate area, not Lakewood, and in the school in my town, there was a "yeshivish" class, a "modern" class, and a "regular" class (and for reference, I was in the more modern class....and married a Kollel guy and settled in Lakewood). I don't feel that diversity was celebrated much.

By contrast, my girls go to Bais Faiga and there are no such attempts at social engineering.

As to raising my kids in a bubble, I come from a pretty diverse, extended, yet close-knit family. We have members who are MO and relatives who wear shtreimels. So my kids get enough exposure to different types of frum people across the spectrum.

↑ Chayalle ↓

Wed, Jun 23 2021, 9:46 am

amother [ Broom ] wrote:

That is an anecdote about YOUR nieces. Not about the rest of Lakewood.

(I'm gonna guess they don't go to the same high school my girls attended)

amother

↑ NeonBlue

Wed, Jun 23 2021, 9:51 am

Bluepink wrote:

Yes, I believe it’s called reverse snobbery.

↑ Notsobusy ↓

Wed, Jun 23 2021, 9:59 am

Chayalle wrote:

I agree with much of what you wrote, I just want to point out that in the elementary school my dds go to the classes are split, yeshivish vs baalei baatish. It took us a while to figure it out. We used to think it was split by neighborhood, but that didnt always make sense. As the divide grows in Lakewood between the really yeshivish and not, it's more obvious that this is how they're splitting it.

↑ Chayalle ↓

Wed, Jun 23 2021, 10:18 am

Notsobusy wrote:

I guess it's coming to Lakewood huh.

I don't see this in Bais Faiga. All of my girls have been in mixed classes, with a spectrum of very yeshivish, not so yeshivish, and working/JPF.

amother

Magnolia

Wed, Jun 23 2021, 10:21 am

Oldest wrote:

Honestly, this is why dh and I plan to move out before my kids hit school age..

Just curious where there is a true diverse community...
As in all different types including those not so religious and those ultra chassidish?

(ETA: asking as a chassidish poster who wanted diversity and moved to a different area and found out that “the buck stops here” chassidim need not apply. I don’t consider that open minded either: to have tolerance for those on the left but none for those on the right)