I think Rachelli was just starstruck by Akiva. She was fascinated by this frum famous artist whose show she went to. Then she saw what a good father he is and became even more attracted to him. Notice how she was considering writing him the letter until she heard that the other option is for him to get married. I didn't notice this until I rewatched the episode with someone else. I think she really just wants to be married to him.
I think Rachelli was just starstruck by Akiva. She was fascinated by this frum famous artist whose show she went to. Then she saw what a good father he is and became even more attracted to him. Notice how she was considering writing him the letter until she heard that the other option is for him to get married. I didn't notice this until I rewatched the episode with someone else. I think she really just wants to be married to him.
You make a good point about her refusing to write the letter, because she would rather get married to him. When Akiva throws out the idea of getting married, She says, yes that makes much more sense, when there's a mother in the picture. She didn't only mean for the revacha but for Akiva and Devorale as well.
I don't agree that she was starstruck. I don't think that fits her personality. She is a confident young lady and doesn't think Akiva is some prize. But when she gets to know him better, she falls in love with him. He is not an arrogant famous artist, but rather a humble jew trying to deal with life's challenges. This arouses her mercy and then she slowly finds herself attracted to him .
I think its painful for her to know that to Akiva, she is not even on his radar because he is still mourning his dead wife. When he comes to her for help, it is the furthest thing from his mind to ask her to stand in as a wife. By offering to marry him, she hopes to plant a seed in his mind, to look at her as a marriage possibilty.
You know what would be funny? In season one and two we see Akiva chasing after his heart's love..Elisheva (and later Libby,) and being rebuffed again and again.. I think in season 3 we will see the reverse...Rachelli trying to chase after Akiva, he being oblivious, or even outright refusing, claiming he isn't ready. He will do to Rachelli what Elisheva did to him, and Rachelli will do to him what Akiva did to Elisheva. Until finally at the end he will realize he needs Rachelli in his life. (I hope)
You make a good point about her refusing to write the letter, because she would rather get married to him. When Akiva throws out the idea of getting married, She says, yes that makes much more sense, when there's a mother in the picture. She didn't only mean for the revacha but for Akiva and Devorale as well.
I don't agree that she was starstruck. I don't think that fits her personality. She is a confident young lady and doesn't think Akiva is some prize. But when she gets to know him better, she falls in love with him. He is not an arrogant famous artist, but rather a humble jew trying to deal with life's challenges. This arouses her mercy and then she slowly finds herself attracted to him .
I think its painful for her to know that to Akiva, she is not even on his radar because he is still mourning his dead wife. When he comes to her for help, it is the furthest thing from his mind to ask her to stand in as a wife. By offering to marry him, she hopes to plant a seed in his mind, to look at her as a marriage possibilty.
You know what would be funny? In season one and two we see Akiva chasing after his heart's love..Elisheva (and later Libby,) and being rebuffed again and again.. I think in season 3 we will see the reverse...Rachelli trying to chase after Akiva, he being oblivious, or even outright refusing, claiming he isn't ready. He will do to Rachelli what Elisheva did to him, and Rachelli will do to him what Akiva did to Elisheva. Until finally at the end he will realize he needs Rachelli in his life. (I hope)
like father, like son - Kive will be not ready for another wife just like Shulem, you are right
like father, like son - Kive will be not ready for another wife just like Shulem, you are right
Maybe we will see them in the hotel lobby on an official date and he will say no afterwards. Then rachelli will somehow get sick or almost die (like Akiva almost got killed by that wild car) and Kiva will realize he almost lost Rachelli and that he really does care about her.
So I just watched episode 4 for the second time. And I found it so much fun to notice little details.
1. How perfect is it that it's Giti who calmly takes charge when there is a crisis. Akiva is just sitting there distraught, and Shulem has only unhelpful comments to make. Nuchem curses at Akiva for allowing Devorahle to fall into the hands of the "tzionim". But Gitti is able to calmly figure out what to do and to give Akiva chizzuk that it'll all work out, while telling her father to be patient. She is no stranger to crises, and handles them like a pro.
2. Chanina is insistent that no one knows about the surrogacy, not because he is trying to protect Ruchami's dignity. It is because he knows that the surrogacy is a huge compromise in halacha and he is mortified that people should know that he did such a thing.
The problem with Chanina is that although he got a heter from his Rosh Yeshiva, he really isn't ok with it. He feels that he is still being over on halacha. This is a very big problem. When someone is told to do something lehalacha, it is considered a mitzvah. For example if a person gets a heter to eat on Yom Kippur for medical reasons, he should feel it is a mitzvah, not an aveira. This was a big mistake on Chanina's part. By the same token, if a person takes a questionable bedika to a rav, thinking it's probably not good, and the rav says it's good, he is supposed to accept it, not think he's really sinning by being with his wife! Its basic Emunas chachamim.
This is the same thing here. No wonder Ruchami was so mad at him. She doesn't want to take part in a surrogacy when her husband looks at it as if he is compromising his values. Then she tells him, "fine I'll cancel the whole thing!" And she looks at him, hoping to hear him say, "No, don't!" But he doesn't and that is like a dagger to her heart, because that's when she knows for sure that he never really wanted to do this.
On the other hand, when Ruchami later tells him that the pregnancy took, and the baby is on it's way, Chanina seems visibly moved and happy. I think she was testing his reaction. She is sad/confused that she went ahead and cancelled, now that she sees Chanina's reaction.
3. I noticed how, when Akiva and Shulem are sitting by this Boim guy trying to figure out what to do, Boim says it would be great if you can marry someone. Shulem immediately says, nu, let's find a woman who will say she is married to him. Shulem has a very distant relationship with the truth. He is very quick to lie when it suits him, and this is just onr example of many.
4. When Nechama tells Shulem that she reconsidered and would like to see if they could be a couple, the reason she gives is because she is lonely. Shulem
would have loved to hear her say that she is considering him because she thinks he is a special person. But he was happy to take what he got.
He offers to get a special cheesecake from Brizel. Is that the same cake he got for that widow in the first season? Anyone remember?
5. It's a bit strange to me that Akiva never calls Racheli before coming over. Every time he knocks on her door, she is not expecting him. Since they all have phones, I find that a bit unrealistic.
6. Does anyone know what that poem was about that Nechama read at the kever? It made Shulem tear up.
7. I don't get why the guy at the rabbanut kept saying "hatznea leches". It made sense in the context of keeping a wedding small. But he kept saying it every minute, like that there was only one sheet left in the printer. What am I missing here?
I don't think that the cake was from the same place. Brizel is a famous israeli bakery in geulah. The first cake he bought was from a random makolet.
Very entertaining thread! Maybe not everyone here lives in Israel. Jut pointing out that Shtisel's producers who are providing us with this series have asked that viewers watch legally (like not on Sdarot or other free links). I paid for the Sting TV app just to watch Shtisel, and I have not viewed any other shows. It's a fair price, not that costly. You need a smartphone or tablet.
Very entertaining thread! Maybe not everyone here lives in Israel. Jut pointing out that Shtisel's producers who are providing us with this series have asked that viewers watch legally (like not on Sdarot or other free links). I paid for the Sting TV app just to watch Shtisel, and I have not viewed any other shows. It's a fair price, not that costly. You need a smartphone or tablet.
Thanks for letting us know. I never understand how sites like sdarot could show something illegally and not get fined.
How much is a subscription to sting?
Thanks for letting us know. I never understand how sites like sdarot could show something illegally and not get fined.
How much is a subscription to sting?
Im not sure if they get fined or not, but their site is closed down very often when "found".
Thanks for letting us know. I never understand how sites like sdarot could show something illegally and not get fined.
How much is a subscription to sting?
It seems to be saying 59 shekel a month, with the first month free.
I got one month free and I believe something like 45 shekel for the following three months, and only after that will I pay 59 shekel a month.
They assured me that I can cancel at any time.
I'm not davka encouraging people to sign up for TV. This works for me, to view this one series and I know from experience that I can stick to my intentions, be'ezras Hashem.
It seems to be saying 59 shekel a month, with the first month free.
I got one month free and I believe something like 45 shekel for the following three months, and only after that will I pay 59 shekel a month.
They assured me that I can cancel at any time.
I'm not davka encouraging people to sign up for TV. This works for me, to view this one series and I know from experience that I can stick to my intentions, be'ezras Hashem.
Because that would be so strange. A random charedi single woman wants t be a surrogate? Thats beyond weird. I dont think thats going to happen.
I agree it's weird, but is it weirder than two charedi adults getting engaged without planning to get married? Or for two chareidi children to get "married" in a restaurant with three witnesses? There is no shortage of weird things happening in the world of Shtisel..
The reason why I think it could happen is because Rachelli is an older single and thinks she will never get married. She tells Akiva " you only get married once!" Only a person who has basically given up on getting married would "marry" a stranger for the sake of getting his baby back.
So if she knows/ believes she will never get married, why shouldn't she be a surrogate? Maybe she is doing it because she knows it's the one chance she has of carrying a baby. Maybe she is doing it as a chessed. Or maybe there is another motive she has that will come to light. We know next to nothing about Rachelli or her family.
It's also interesting to think about the halachic ramifications of getting married and divorced without consummating the marriage. As a divorcee, she probably doesnt have to wear a shaitel and she is not off limits to a Cohen, I think?
But my guess is that in the next episode we will see her still wearing her shaitel.
It's Israel TV. You might have to live in Israel to get access to the service. Or use a VPN or whatever. I'm not that knowledgeable about these things.
The surrogacy part is getting me angry.
The producers are simply wrong.
It's not true that surrogacy is assur halachically.
It's very complicated, and needs a competent knowledgeable Rav, but it's definitely been done.
Its so sad that Chaninah has to feel he is being forced into an aveirah, which then guilts Ruchami into cancelling and removing her IUD.
Why couldn't the Rabbi have given them guidance on how it should be done properly?
The surrogacy part is getting me angry.
The producers are simply wrong.
It's not true that surrogacy is assur halachically.
It's very complicated, and needs a competent knowledgeable Rav, but it's definitely been done.
Its so sad that Chaninah has to feel he is being forced into an aveirah, which then guilts Ruchami into cancelling and removing her IUD.
Why couldn't the Rabbi have given them guidance on how it should be done properly?
Did anyone else find it hysterical when Shulem tells his brother Nachum that they have to go out,a Nd Nachum asks if they’re going to the zoo?
And then Shulem says they’re going to Kiva’s wedding, and Nachum asks, which Nachum? And Shulem sarcastically answers, which Shulem? Shulem the sus Paroh!
Then he tells Nachum that if he makes trouble at the wedding, we will throw him off the terrace!
The surrogacy part is getting me angry.
The producers are simply wrong.
It's not true that surrogacy is assur halachically.
It's very complicated, and needs a competent knowledgeable Rav, but it's definitely been done.
Its so sad that Chaninah has to feel he is being forced into an aveirah, which then guilts Ruchami into cancelling and removing her IUD.
Why couldn't the Rabbi have given them guidance on how it should be done properly?
I hear that its upsetting to be sending out a wrong message. I don't know anything about surrogacy, but according to Wikipedia (if we can take that seriously) the issue of surrogacy is very complicated. Many poskim do hold that its assur.
Chanina feeling forced into an aveira is his own flaw. In real life, I know people like that. The get a psak to do something, but they feel that it is wrong and feel guilty doing it, even if they were clearly told to do it.
However, I don't think you can blame Chanina for Ruchami taking out the IUD. They are each responsible for their own mistakes.
And I agree the Rosh Yeshiva should have made sure that Chanina received proper guidance. Especially since Chanina is very young and has no parents (he is estranged from his father).
Did anyone else find it hysterical when Shulem tells his brother Nachum that they have to go out,a Nd Nachum asks if they’re going to the zoo?
And then Shulem says they’re going to Kiva’s wedding, and Nachum asks, which Nachum? And Shulem sarcastically answers, which Shulem? Shulem the sus Paroh!
Then he tells Nachum that if he makes trouble at the wedding, we will throw him off the terrace!
I didn't find it funny that Shulem threatens to throw him off the terrace. I don't like such type of humor. Bad enough that Nuchem almost did it himself.
You know what I find funny? In this season, I'm seeing that Shulem has a penchant for garbling famous aphorisms. I don't remember him doing that in previous seasons.
In the first episodes he tells Akiva, "you know what they say, if life gives you lemonade -- you should take it!" 😂
In the second episode, he tells Ruchami, "you know what they say, if the mouse won't go to the Rav, you bring the mountain to Mohammed!"
And this gem: A thousand wise men cannot take out what one fool throws into a well from which he drinks. (He tells this to Tzvi Aryeh)
These are so hysterical! Anyone else noticed these? Has this been his habit in the previous seasons too and I'm just not remembering?
I feel like I'm hogging this thread but I have a lot of thoughts on this series , and this is the best place to share them!😁
About Kiva's artwork: Its not realistic to me that Akiva should believe that the three paintings he bought would be equal in value to the 3 of his wife. Firstly, large paintings are much more valuable than smaller paintings. Second, the three of his wife were portraits which have much more emotional impact than still-life. Akiva should have known that. He was wrong to get angry with Rachelli when he did not deliver on his end of the agreement to bring paintings of the same caliber as the first three.
Later, Akiva brings her the drawing of a depressed Nuchem lying in the couch, which she liked. While I agree that it is a provocative drawing, and has the emotional piece that Rachelli was looking for, it is not realistic to me that a charcoal drawing on paper can equal the value of an oil painting done on canvas. Completely unrealistic. Rachelli could never hope to resell that drawing for the amount of money she paid for the painting.
Does anyone get the joke Rachelli told Akiva about the man who said he could imitate a bird and then he opened the window and flew? I didn't get the point of it.
