Split from not fasting

malki2 ↓

Mon, Jul 27 2020, 11:25 am

amother [ Indigo ] wrote:

Not sure about OP's situation but our rov is advising everyone not to fast this year due to corona, in order to keep our immune systems very strong.

What is a this? A cholera epidemic? The Black Plague? Do you know how low the mortality rate is for people with no underlying health conditions? And for kids???

SixOfWands ↓

Mon, Jul 27 2020, 11:48 am

malki2 wrote:

What is a this? A cholera epidemic? The Black Plague? Do you know how low the mortality rate is for people with no underlying health conditions? And for kids???

Darned right its not cholera.

The last cholera outbreak in the United States was in 1910–1911, when the steamship Moltke brought infected people from Naples to New York City. Vigilant health authorities isolated the infected in quarantine on Swinburne Island. Eleven people died, including a health care worker at the hospital on the island.

For the week ending July 18, 6 people aged 25 to 34, and 9 aged 35 to 44, died of covid. More than the last cholera outbreak, in a single week! At least its not like it was on the week ending 4/18 when it was 120 and 279 people respectively.

Close to 150,000 dead of covid in the US in just 5 months.

I know that you enjoy downplaying those numbers, and pretending its no big deal.

But to challenge the psak of someone's rabbi?

↑ malki2 ↓

Mon, Jul 27 2020, 12:04 pm

SixOfWands wrote:

Since you are good with numbers, would you mind providing me with the COVID mortality rate for healthy individuals? And for individuals under the age of 16?

number

Mon, Jul 27 2020, 12:14 pm

malki2 wrote:

Since you are good with numbers, would you mind providing me with the COVID mortality rate for healthy individuals? And for individuals under the age of 16?

I’m not sure what this has to do with fasting. But the number I choose to roll with is 0.4% for the overall population.
Source: https://www.thefastlaneforum.c.....90102

Last edited by number on Mon, Jul 27 2020, 1:35 pm; edited 1 time in total

↑ SixOfWands ↓

Mon, Jul 27 2020, 12:55 pm

malki2 wrote:

Since you are good with numbers, would you mind providing me with the COVID mortality rate for healthy individuals? And for individuals under the age of 16?

Tell me what mortality rate is acceptable to you? Right now, overall, its about 3.5% in the US. Let's say that's overstated by more than 3 times. That its really 1% Who do you think its OK to die? And who is it OK to survive but have lifelong health issues? Do you think people over the age of 50 have lived long enough, its OK to sacrifice them? Shall I name the posters here over the age of 50, and you can let us know which one of us you'd be OK if died?

In any case, we were discussing your declaration that a poster should ignore her rabbi's psak, and accept your psak instead. I thought that was against the rules around here.

↑ malki2 ↓

Mon, Jul 27 2020, 1:28 pm

SixOfWands wrote:

You did not answer my question. If you would have, it would have been clear that there is no issue here. You become dramatic when you have no good answer.

↑ SixOfWands ↓

Mon, Jul 27 2020, 1:50 pm

malki2 wrote:

You did not answer my question. If you would have, it would have been clear that there is no issue here. You become dramatic when you have no good answer.

How about you answer my question.

What fatality rate is acceptable to you?

The death rate for children under the age of 4 is 1.9%. Is that OK with you?

From 65 to 74, its over 10%. Is that OK with you?

And where did you receive smicha making it acceptable to challenge a rabbinic psak?

↑ malki2 ↓

Mon, Jul 27 2020, 2:04 pm

SixOfWands wrote:

Again no answer from you. I never said that people over 65 should fast. And children under the age of 4 do not fast. And how many children under the age of 4 even caught COVID?

↑ SixOfWands

Mon, Jul 27 2020, 2:49 pm

malki2 wrote:

Again no answer from you. I never said that people over 65 should fast. And children under the age of 4 do not fast. And how many children under the age of 4 even caught COVID?

No, what you did was get nasty and sarcatic when someone mentioned her rov's psak

Quote:

amother [ Indigo ] wrote:
Not sure about OP's situation but our rov is advising everyone not to fast this year due to corona, in order to keep our immune systems very strong.

Quote:

What is a this? A cholera epidemic? The Black Plague? Do you know how low the mortality rate is for people with no underlying health conditions? And for kids???

Why are you asking me the numbers, since you claim to know them. So tell me the fatality rate. And also tell me how many people were seriously ill but survived. And how many will suffer long term.

Tell me how many dead children are acceptable to you, since the nearly 2% death rate doesn't faze you.

newcomer ↓

Mon, Jul 27 2020, 3:24 pm

Kids don't need to fast anyway, so that has nothing to do with this psak. Which most rabbanim are not paskening.

However, I did see an interesting psak about regular handwashing being allowed on Tisha B'Av, for those that have been very strict about regular handwashing and mask wearing to prevent contagion.

SuperWify

Mon, Jul 27 2020, 3:27 pm

newcomer wrote:

By kids I assume you mean under 12/13?

PinkFridge ↓

Mon, Jul 27 2020, 4:48 pm

malki2 wrote:

What is a this? A cholera epidemic? The Black Plague? Do you know how low the mortality rate is for people with no underlying health conditions? And for kids???

I've been meaning to ask you about your avatar. Another time.
I'm not sure where the poster you quoted is but check out psakim that have been given with poskim in EY with very broad shoulders. There may be poskim following the same reasoning, especially for vulnerable people. IIRC dehydration can lead to blood clots which is a big complication of Covid.

ETA: Haven't followed the other thread.
And even if people aren't dying they are experiencing serious complications. Maybe fewer people now than before but it's understandable if rabbanim are going to be machmir...on venishmartem.

↑ malki2 ↓

Mon, Jul 27 2020, 5:06 pm

PinkFridge wrote:

Do you the names of any of the poskim who ruled not to fast on Tisha B’av? I’m not challenging, I’m just curious as to who they are.

Good Friend

Mon, Jul 27 2020, 5:22 pm

malki2 wrote:

Do you the names of any of the poskim who ruled not to fast on Tisha B’av? I’m not challenging, I’m just curious as to who they are.

Here's one: Rabbi Yosef Feigelstock, a Chabad Rav in Argentina who is known and accepted by Chabad issued this psak for all over the world, not just Argentina:

https://www.google.com/amp/s/c...../amp/

↑ PinkFridge ↓

Mon, Jul 27 2020, 5:28 pm

malki2 wrote:

Do you the names of any of the poskim who ruled not to fast on Tisha B’av? I’m not challenging, I’m just curious as to who they are.

Rav Yitzchak Berkowitz in Yerushalayim. It's NOT a blanket heter for everyone but is definitely erring on the side of caution for those with fever, with symptoms, who are dehydrating, some other categories.

sky

Mon, Jul 27 2020, 5:38 pm

PinkFridge wrote:

Is it for ppl already sick? If ppl are dehydrating they normally don’t fast.

I remember reading by taanis esther the rabbanim in Teheran came out to say that no one should fast because covid was so rampant.

I would find it ironic if someone who doesn’t wear a mask or practice SD were not to fast due to this reason.