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amother
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 Mon, Jan 06 2025, 8:30 pm
Is reading very detailed romance novels that describe the bedroom scenes in great detail (I.e. the beauty queen of Jerusalem)the same as watching por-n?
Why or why not?
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amother
Purple
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Mon, Jan 06 2025, 8:31 pm
| amother OP wrote: | Is reading very detailed romance novels that describe the bedroom scenes in great detail the same as watching por-n?
Why or why not? |
I don’t think so. Reading is just text and your imagination - p-rn is actual people and seeing things play out in real life.
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amother
Aqua
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Mon, Jan 06 2025, 8:33 pm
Erotica is a form of p-rnography, yes
I don’t see it as being all that different . Those mental images you imagine and the words you read will still stick with you the same way visual p-rn will
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amother
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Mon, Jan 06 2025, 8:34 pm
| amother Aqua wrote: | Erotica is a form of p-rnography, yes
I don’t see it as being all that different . Those mental images you imagine and the words you read will still stick with you the same way visual p-rn will |
Nahhh this is really not true
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amother
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Mon, Jan 06 2025, 8:35 pm
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But erotica is on Rambams list of 4 forbidden things to read. Together with Avoda Zara and I don't remember the rest
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meyerlemon44
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Mon, Jan 06 2025, 8:35 pm
I don’t think so. For one thing, erotica doesn’t exploit “performers” like pron does.
For another, you can find erotica that describes scenes between loving married couples that makes you excited to be with your own husband. I can certainly understand why some people wouldn’t approve, but the latter seems fine to me.
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amother
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Mon, Jan 06 2025, 8:36 pm
| amother Freesia wrote: | | But erotica is on Rambams list of 4 forbidden things to read. Together with Avoda Zara and I don't remember the rest |
Interesting, I’ve never heard that.
So then we’d have to define what erotica really is. Because like a poster described, if it’s two lovers, then is it [filth]?
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amother
Ballota
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Mon, Jan 06 2025, 8:42 pm
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I once heard that the three aveiros which are yehareg ve'al ya'avor are incredibly serious. Because of this, it’s best not to even read about those sins—we don’t want to fill our minds with such thoughts. Following that logic, I believe graphic romance novels are not ok to read.
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amother
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Mon, Jan 06 2025, 8:45 pm
| amother Ballota wrote: | | I once heard that the three aveiros which are yehareg ve'al ya'avor are incredibly serious. Because of this, it’s best not to even read about those sins—we don’t want to fill our minds with such thoughts. Following that logic, I believe graphic romance novels are not ok to read. |
One minute. The three aveiros are adultery. Murder. And avoda Zara.
Why would reading [filth] that isn’t - or even is- about cheating fall into any of these?
And secondly, the Torah mentions affairs many times. If it were so serious not to even fill our minds about it, wouldn’t that be a problem?
It’s hard to imagine literally abstaining from thoughts about cheating, especially that it unfortunately does exist.
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sequoia
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Mon, Jan 06 2025, 8:57 pm
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No. Prn involves actual living women and girls being harmed and exploited.
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amother
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Mon, Jan 06 2025, 8:59 pm
| sequoia wrote: | | No. Prn involves actual living women and girls being harmed and exploited. |
Okay so I guess we can separate it into two parts
1) women and girls being exploited
2) the viewer seeing filth
So in regard to reading filth, is it different than viewing it.
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amother
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Mon, Jan 06 2025, 9:01 pm
I have read romance books... some are erotica and some are not. Personally I'm not ok with reading erotica that graphically describes certain acts... I'm more ok with scenes that are more... euphemistic.
Someone once said to me that every frum woman should read some explicit novels when she first gets married... there's definitely a point to that!
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amother
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Mon, Jan 06 2025, 9:04 pm
| amother OP wrote: | One minute. The three aveiros are adultery. Murder. And avoda Zara.
Why would reading [filth] that isn’t - or even is- about cheating fall into any of these?
And secondly, the Torah mentions affairs many times. If it were so serious not to even fill our minds about it, wouldn’t that be a problem?
It’s hard to imagine literally abstaining from thoughts about cheating, especially that it unfortunately does exist. |
If you're imagining yourself with the lover in the novel - which let's face it, is the point of erotica - that might have something of adultery ? In your mind? So it's not so simple.
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amother
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Mon, Jan 06 2025, 9:04 pm
| amother Periwinkle wrote: | I have read romance books... some are erotica and some are not. Personally I'm not ok with reading erotica that graphically describes certain acts... I'm more ok with scenes that are more... euphemistic.
Someone once said to me that every frum woman should read some explicit novels when she first gets married... there's definitely a point to that! |
Hmm…maybe… but I like that my intimate life was born out of my own naturalness without influence or knowledge from anywhere else…
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amother
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Mon, Jan 06 2025, 9:05 pm
| amother Periwinkle wrote: | | If you're imagining yourself with the lover in the novel - which let's face it, is the point of erotica - that might have something of adultery ? In your mind? So it's not so simple. |
What???? lol!!
I never imagined myself with the lover… I’m actually laughing 😆
I usually imagine the scene as viewing it or knowing about it but never dawned on me to be in the scene.
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amother
Mauve
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Mon, Jan 06 2025, 9:08 pm
| amother OP wrote: | One minute. The three aveiros are adultery. Murder. And avoda Zara.
Why would reading [filth] that isn’t - or even is- about cheating fall into any of these?
And secondly, the Torah mentions affairs many times. If it were so serious not to even fill our minds about it, wouldn’t that be a problem?
It’s hard to imagine literally abstaining from thoughts about cheating, especially that it unfortunately does exist. |
Geloy Arayos or however you spell it is not just adultery. It’s all forbidden arayos- meaning s-xual acts.
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amother
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Mon, Jan 06 2025, 9:10 pm
| amother OP wrote: | What???? lol!!
I never imagined myself with the lover… I’m actually laughing 😆
I usually imagine the scene as viewing it or knowing about it but never dawned on me to be in the scene. |
Then you weren't reading real erotica. Because that's sorta the point of erotica.
I sometimes read reviews of books and the women will write - the guy was so hot... then I know its probably not for me. They're obviously imagining themselves with the guy.
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amother
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Mon, Jan 06 2025, 9:16 pm
| amother Periwinkle wrote: | | If you're imagining yourself with the lover in the novel - which let's face it, is the point of erotica - that might have something of adultery ? In your mind? So it's not so simple. |
No, people imagine their spouse as the lover as well...
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SaraBee
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Mon, Jan 06 2025, 9:17 pm
| amother OP wrote: | Is reading very detailed romance novels that describe the bedroom scenes in great detail (I.e. the beauty queen of Jerusalem)the same as watching por-n?
Why or why not? |
No, because our imaginations are somewhat limited. Imagined scenes doesn’t stay in our brain the same way an explicit image does.
Last edited by SaraBee on Mon, Jan 06 2025, 9:18 pm; edited 1 time in total
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amother
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Mon, Jan 06 2025, 9:18 pm
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Also, while erotica can get pretty bad, I think some people underestimate what horrible pornographical video content is normalized.
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