Spoiling your kids for the sake of their popularity?

Mrs.K ↓

Thu, Feb 05 2009, 4:11 am

I was thinking about this the other day. As a child, I had no friends in school. I was very overweight, awkward, downright ugly, actually. The glasses, braces, and frizzy hair didn't help. I'm sure I wasn't the most socially adept either.

My parents were very "old school" and stuck strong to their beliefs. If they didn't want me to have something, there was no way I was getting it. I respect their principles, but being the "odd girl out" in so many situations didn't help matters.

My oldest is now in first grade. She stands out because she is one of the only girls in her class not from the neighborhood immediately surrounding the school. Furthermore, she is American in a predominantly Israeli class. While she speaks a good Hebrew, children can pick up on the subtle differences and an embarrassing grammar mistake. Furthermore, although we've been living here for years now, I will never understand what's "in", what's "nerdy" etc. Many times my daughter tells me everyone made fun of her knapsack or her pencil case etc. and my heart bleeds remembering 8 years of coming home from school and never wanting to go back. Thank G-d she is an attractive child but my heart aches when I remember the teasing and what it's like to not fitting in. I feel powerless to help her because I just don't know how to help her fit in better without understanding what's in and what's out. (I would like to add that I have son that began cheder this year and I absolutely do not have this issue with him. Boys seem to be so accepting while girls can be so cruel. )

And now the point of this post: my daughter told me that "everyone" in her class has sparkly gel pens. My first instinct was to just ignore it like my parents did, accompanied with a speech about it's the inside that counts and how people only make fun when they're jealous. Maybe I'd tell her to bring it up again by her birthday or another special occasion. But I thought about it long and hard and finally decided that for 9 shekel, if this will make my daughter popular for a month or even a week...I will do it for her. I think back to my school years and what just one weeks respite from the teasing would have meant to me at that age. How can I deprive my child of that? Granted, my daughter isn't obese and awkward but she does stand out from her peers in other ways and if I can have her fit in, even if she's fitting in because of her pens, then shouldn't I do that for her? Obviously I'd draw the line...I wouldn't spend 400 shekel on some ridiculous fad but it's just pens. Am I doing something so wrong? Am I spoiling her? Am I teaching her the wrong values and priorities? In my heart it makes sense to do this for her, but maybe I can't be objective because of my childhood?

Wow..turned into a long post. Thank you for letting me get that all out. Smile

HindaRochel

Thu, Feb 05 2009, 4:55 am

I think you draw the line at what is reasonable for your family and that's that. Gel pens aren't overly expensive, and let her know you expect her to take good care of them. They make a nice gift, and gifts don't have to be relegated to birthday/Chanukah/Pesach.

As for knowing what is in, maybe if you could talk to another mom in the class or at least go to the school and see what the other kids have. Get her new things only after a few kids have already shown up with something new. Then you can either ask her or see for yourself the "style" of pencil cases, knapsacks etc.

That however is unlikely to make a child popular. I never was popular as a child, and can't advise you that way. It seems to me sometimes the children who are most popular aren't all that nice and kind. But then maybe I'm a bit biased as I was never popular and could never figure out what was in and what was out. Perhaps the best thing is to teach your child to feel good about herself rather than worry about how she others deem her. It should be in those areas where she does excel; middot, or math or whatever. I don't mean to teach her to ignore other's feelings, but rather teach her to be a good person.

You do want to make certain it isn't something your child is doing that makes her unpopular. Sometimes children try to impress the teacher, or tell on other students, or engage in inappropriate social behavior. Sometimes the child might have a mild disorder that interferes with their understanding of social situations.

Try and get a clue to what is going on in her class; if she is disliked or just hangs with a small crowd. What you need to aim for is your child feeling happy, not being the most popular. If she isn't the most popular but has friends you need to help her see that popularity doesn't bring happiness, but satisfaction with what one has does. Help her enjoy what she has.

Good luck.

Ima'la ↓

Thu, Feb 05 2009, 4:55 am

My rule of thumb (not shared with dd, of course) is whether it is true that EVERYBODY has it. If it really is true that it is standard and every (or truly almost every) girl has X, I try to get it for her also. She doesn't have to have every latest & coolest thing, but I also remember what it was like to feel like a nerd because I really was one of the only ones who didn't have X. OTOH, sometimes EVERYBODY consists of 3 other girls........ So you have to try to be on top of things. Maybe you can find a mother either from your daughter's class or just someone in the neighborhood (maybe an Anglo who grew up here) who can clue you into these things.

shalhevet ↓

Thu, Feb 05 2009, 5:43 am

I don't think material possessions make children popular in the long run - they may make them the centre of attention for a day or even a week, and then someone else/ something else takes centre stage. I think this is a very important lesson to teach our children for life. Otherwise there is no end - I always need the latest pen/ schoolbag/ sports shoes/ sheitel/ Jaguar to be popular.

A second point is that the 'everybody' almost always turns out to be three girls. We don't buy things because 'everyone' has them' (even if it's 33 girls).

Having said all that I would still buy my daughter the pen. BUT first I would teach her that we don't do things because it makes us popular/ everyone has it = we think for ourselves. Also I would not buy her things 'stam' so that she doesn't learn to play on your guilt to get every gashmius whim.

What I would do is to say to her,
'You saw there are other girls with gel pens, and you also want one? You think it would be useful to you to decorate your notebooks?'
'Yes'
'It sounds like it could be useful for you.' (lesson: we are buying it because it is a good idea, not because Chani and Miri and Shevi have one too).

Then I would say, 'You know, it is a while till your birthday, and I wasn't planning on buying new school equipment right now, but since it sounds so useful maybe we'll make a mivtza and that will be your prize' (now fill in something you would like her to work on - helping you for Shabbos, davenning Shabbos morning etc). Since this item is super urgent (!!!) make it a mivtza she can finish by Sunday so you can buy it already....

Teacup9

Thu, Feb 05 2009, 5:59 am

I agree with Shalhevet.

If your daughter wants gel pens and you want to give them to her than Baruch Hashem mother and daughter agree so enjoy it.

I think you have to just not worry so much about her popularity, even though it is hard given your situation. You are her mother and just need to concentrate on teaching her good middos and to be confident in being herself and doing the right things like I am sure you are doing.

When you are buying her items like a backpack and a pencil case that you will buy no matter what you may take into consideration what "everyone" else has. Does she have definite opinions when she picks these out? Then you can remind her how much she likes hers and how silly it would be for her to want another one just because other girls have one. If it seems really important for her to have one like everyone else then you can consider letting her take the old one the first day of school so she can decide what will work best for her that year. After wearing the most uncool clothes ever to be seen in the 6th grade (though they were quite right for fifth grade) I started clothes shopping the first Sunday after school began so I could figure out what everyone else is wearing. I think I still do that seasonally.

Just make sure she doesn't feel pressure just because of your experience.

As for her Hebrew remind her of all the other things she does well so she won't be self conscious. Teach her to laugh at herself.

Seraph

Thu, Feb 05 2009, 6:22 am

Cool things don't make a kid popular, but unpopular things can make a mediocre person's life fall into the unpopular/rejected/teased category.

Meaning, some people, no matter what cool stuff they have, just won't be popular.
Others aren't the class leaders but they aren't the class laughingstocks either. However, by having things particular nerdy/nebby they become the class laughingstock.

Growing up, everyone in my class wore name brand clothes. The richer girls banana republic or gap, and the kollel family ones, old navy, etc. Poor me was stuck with thrift store and walmart clothes because my mother didnt want to waste money on clothes, and it just gave my class another reason to pick on me. Eventually I got smart and went with my mother to the thrift store, and picked out name brand stuff off the racks.

I think parents shouldn't give their kids another reason to be picked on if at all possible, and if not having something will make her be picked on, its a good idea to get them.

Batyah

Thu, Feb 05 2009, 6:26 am

shalhevet wrote:

WOW!! This is excellent chinuch eitzah! Thank you!

Atali

Thu, Feb 05 2009, 10:54 am

My kids are a bit younger but I can relate to this somewhat.

Like you, I was the kid who was constantly teased in school. I had poor social skills, was overweight, spoke with a lisp, you get the idea.

However, now I have learned a lot from dealing with my children.

DS #1 is 4.5 years old and despite being the shortest and youngest boy in his class (and new to the country), he is among the most popular. The reason is obvious. He is a natural leader who convinces all the other kids to go along with whatever he wants to do. Basically he is one of the main ones to set the trends and doesn't worry as much about what other kids have.

Therefore, when being mechanech him one of the things I focus on is getting him to be sensitive to the feelings of other kids by not bragging about what he has or what he can do and by making sure that he lets other kids make the rules and be in the spotlight sometimes.

He does occasionally want things that other kids have and if the requests are reasonable I usually let him do it. For example, last summer he really wanted a pair of crocs since some other kids had them. I got him crocs, but not the name brand ones since they were obsurdly expensive. But I know that due to his personality he will be popular regardless.

DS #2 is almost three and I am more concerned about him. He is generally well-liked by other kids, but he is not the leader type. Other kids like him because he does whatever they say to do. Therefore even at his young age he is very distressed if other kids have something that he doesn't. I am concerned that he may follow other kids when they do bad things and that his self-image seems to be very dependent on what others think of him. This is probably going to be made worse by the fact that going through school he will probably always be thought of as "Shneur Zalman's little brother".

So with him the main thing I am focusing on is getting him to be happy with what he has and stand up for himself. I would also buy him reasonably-priced things that other kids have, as long as I can afford it and don't disagree with it in principle.

Mimisinger

Thu, Feb 05 2009, 10:59 am

shalhevet wrote:

I like this too. giving her the pens but having a positive spin....good job Shalhevet.

gryp ↓

Thu, Feb 05 2009, 11:00 am

shalhevet wrote:

Such a great post, Shalhevet. Thank you.

I know I spoil my kids a bit but I don't think I'm doing anything harmful. It's only once in a while and I'd never spend anything crazy.

OldYoung

Thu, Feb 05 2009, 11:15 am

I think Shalhevet's post was great too! Wink

I just wanted to add, it sounds like your daughter is in a really difficult situation. I don't think that gel pens will make her Miss Super Popular, but will just make her into another one of the 'chevra'- aka just another normal kid. If my daughter were to ask me for something super unreasonable that wasn't plain standard for the class but would make her into the most popular girl then I would have no problem putting my foot down. But if kids are already making fun of her, and she asks if I can help her be normal like the rest of the girls, I think it's important for a little girl's self-esteem- especially when little- to fit in.

AlwaysGrateful

Thu, Feb 05 2009, 11:16 am

shalhevet wrote:

Like everyone else, I like this advice. Just one question, though. Would it make a different if you surprised her with the pens "because you helped me get ready for Shabbos so well!" or "because you've been playing so nicely with your little brother" instead of making it dependent on something in the future? I know that in theory it's a good enticement, and it might get her to do something she wouldn't do otherwise. I know it's not exactly a bribe. But it just seems that her attitude towards it will be "if I do X, I DESERVE a prize" which could translate into "I will only do X if Mommy promises me a prize." As opposed to surprising her with it afterwards, which sends the message, "I know you did it because you knew it was the right thing to do, and I'm giving you this prize as recognition of the fact that you did it." In theory, she could keep on thinking "I wonder when Mommy's going to surprise me with something," but that doesn't seem quite as dangerous to me.

I don't have kids this age yet, so definitely let me know if I'm missing something!

louche

Thu, Feb 05 2009, 11:30 am

As with everything, Shvil HaZahav is the way to go. What you're looking for isn't so much "popularity"-- kids don't actually LIKE other kids because of what they wear or carry, though they may congregate about them for reflected glory--as "fitting in". As you yourself know from painful experience, being different is horrible for a young child. A little bit of individuality is to be encouraged; learning how to be herself and not follow the herd in all things is a good life lesson. However, a child should not be different in ALL things, and you need to choose carefully where to differ and where to blend in.

I hardly think buying your daughter a knickknack for a few shekels constitutes "spoiling". If you contemplated buying every little fashion fad that came along simply because it's the "in" thing, that would be foolish and excessive. No one has EVERYTHING of the latest and greatest, nor should they. Anything you feel is unsafe, violates major principles of yours, or is simply more than you can afford, go ahead and reject. Leave some leeway for things you may not like much but that are inexpensive and do no harm.

Before buying anything, I would wait a few days to weeks. Some of these fads are so transient, by the time you buy them they're passe. But if it seems that the style is going to be around for a while, or the item itself so short-lived that it will be used up soon, no harm in dd having something that everyone else has. Also, you may want to give dd a choice: since fad styles are often more expensive than the garden-variety, let her decide if she'd prefer three plain T-shirts over two character-label ones. e.g.

It should be made clear to dd that if whatever she's getting is really frivolous, she's getting it as as a treat, not because she "needs" it. It's important to impress upon a child early on that there is a difference between what we need and what we want, and that while it's Ok to occasionally splurge on what we want but don't need, that should not be a regular occurrence.

RightOnTarget

Thu, Feb 05 2009, 1:10 pm

Well, I was a kid that was considered popular in school and had a lot of friends. Don't think it had anything to do with the latest gadget since I didn't own them at all. It was just charisma, brains, a friendly personality and wit that got me friends. I believe some kids make it and some unfortunately don't; not due to anything they are doing wrong.

Though, if that gel pens will make her a bit happy (for a short while) u can definately get them for her and do it as Shalshelet and some of the others mentioned as a reward for a kind act she did.

MiamiMommy

Thu, Feb 05 2009, 1:25 pm

My 8 yr. old dd gets an allowance. She has to do certain tasks each week to earn her allowance. When she asks for something that I wouldn't normally buy, I ask her if it's important enough to her that she'd spend her allowance on it. Sometimes it is, but sometimes she thinks about it and changes her mind.

I don't think that it's always about fitting in. Many times, I find that that extra thing just makes them feel special. I work in the school system and very rarely to I hear the younger kids make fun of things like pencil cases. But to have that really cool glittery one. . .now that's special!