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Forum
-> Chinuch, Education & Schooling
-> Summer Camps
amother
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 Fri, Nov 22 2024, 2:22 am
Previous DD had a paper application. I filled out all the easy stuff in a couple of minutes with a pen. Then later when I had a few more minutes I went back and did stuff that needed a bit more research like look up her teacher's phone numbers as a reference. When everything was filled out I mailed it in and shoin.
Fast forward not very many years and now it's all online. I am very computer-competent, thank you very much but it's driving me crazy.
First of all it's on 7 different pages and you have to go in order and you can't skip any required fields. So no going ahead to put in things I know by heart before I've checked up each thing I need to check up, but then on the next page I'll have to go back into my phone/email/wallet and look up something else.
It won't let you save progress on the current page unless everything is filled out.
One camp demands all your health insurance information. Hello you have not yet decided whether you're accepting my kid, maybe you can make me go look up all the numbers afterward? Maybe the paper application also asked for insurance, I don't remember, but in that case they just wanted a photocopy of the card. I didn't have to correctly copy over strings of numbers.
Then, same camp, decides one of the numbers on my insurance info is not valid or the wrong format or something. I triple checked and tried entering it three times, it's absolutely correct, but I can't move forward with the application because it's required and they don't like it.
Another camp did not have this so I was able to get to the last page of the application. They want all my payment information! To authorize a $650 deposit right away, and to preauthorize 5 more installments with credit card information for the full tuition amount. This camp explicitly said at the beginning that they require references and interviews before accepting anyone so why exactly are they asking for all my money before they've even decided if we're in? I don't have an extra 650 because I'm still recovering from last summer's camps! By June I'll have it saved up, I hope, IY"H. Maybe if they wanted a $100 application fee but I'm not handing over my credit card with authorization for the next 5 months on step 1 of the application process!
Both the money one and the health insurance one I only got to these roadblocks after spending way too long typing in dozens of fields.
I've never missed paper so much.
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amother
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Fri, Nov 22 2024, 2:30 am
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Print it out and mail it in.
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amother
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Fri, Nov 22 2024, 2:35 am
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It's not printable. It's fields to type in on like 7 pages and you can't see the next page until you finish filling out the one before. That's what's driving me nuts.
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amother
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Fri, Nov 22 2024, 2:36 am
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Can you email them for a PDF or paper application? I'm sure you're not the only one with this problem.
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amother
Brunette
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Fri, Nov 22 2024, 4:33 am
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That sounds so frustrating!!! I recently had to fill out an online form for an application, (not camp,Israeli insurance) and it was infuriating. It would’ve taken a quarter of the time to just do on paper. I still haven’t sent it in because there were certain things that had to be looked up…… I hope that you get it figured out and have ann easier time!!
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amother
Nectarine
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Fri, Nov 22 2024, 4:44 am
| amother OP wrote: | Previous DD had a paper application. I filled out all the easy stuff in a couple of minutes with a pen. Then later when I had a few more minutes I went back and did stuff that needed a bit more research like look up her teacher's phone numbers as a reference. When everything was filled out I mailed it in and shoin.
Fast forward not very many years and now it's all online. I am very computer-competent, thank you very much but it's driving me crazy.
First of all it's on 7 different pages and you have to go in order and you can't skip any required fields. So no going ahead to put in things I know by heart before I've checked up each thing I need to check up, but then on the next page I'll have to go back into my phone/email/wallet and look up something else.
It won't let you save progress on the current page unless everything is filled out.
One camp demands all your health insurance information. Hello you have not yet decided whether you're accepting my kid, maybe you can make me go look up all the numbers afterward? Maybe the paper application also asked for insurance, I don't remember, but in that case they just wanted a photocopy of the card. I didn't have to correctly copy over strings of numbers.
Then, same camp, decides one of the numbers on my insurance info is not valid or the wrong format or something. I triple checked and tried entering it three times, it's absolutely correct, but I can't move forward with the application because it's required and they don't like it.
Another camp did not have this so I was able to get to the last page of the application. They want all my payment information! To authorize a $650 deposit right away, and to preauthorize 5 more installments with credit card information for the full tuition amount. This camp explicitly said at the beginning that they require references and interviews before accepting anyone so why exactly are they asking for all my money before they've even decided if we're in? I don't have an extra 650 because I'm still recovering from last summer's camps! By June I'll have it saved up, I hope, IY"H. Maybe if they wanted a $100 application fee but I'm not handing over my credit card with authorization for the next 5 months on step 1 of the application process!
Both the money one and the health insurance one I only got to these roadblocks after spending way too long typing in dozens of fields.
I've never missed paper so much. |
Yes its frustrating!
Re the deposit, they alwayse asked for a 500 to 1k deposit for all the years that I sent to camp. But they onky took that on acceptance, not for just applying.
Are you saying they keep the money even if youre not accepted?
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shabbatiscoming
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Fri, Nov 22 2024, 4:45 am
Let her do it. My daughter applied to be a counselor this summer. She did it herself.
Everything is online now. And if she needs help, she can ask you
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elaela
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Fri, Nov 22 2024, 5:43 am
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Screenshot, copy, insert in word/ other programme, print , read n gather info, fill out with pen, back to PC, type it all online...I agree its,silly
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amother
Cantaloupe
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Fri, Nov 22 2024, 7:29 am
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Wow, am I happy the camp dd goes too does everything by snail mail, no internet ever.
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Hashem_Yaazor
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Fri, Nov 22 2024, 7:51 am
On the other side, online forms are much better at data collection. My son's yeshiva had no online form and they had our address wrong, I'm still trying to figure out with them why I'm not getting emails, etc
A paper form needs someone to accurately read the information, accurately type it into some database system, make sure they don't accidentally lose a form... Online forms all get automatically merged into the data collection system with the data the parent inputted, so if there's a mistake, the parent has no one to blame but him or herself.
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amother
Whitewash
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Fri, Nov 22 2024, 7:58 am
I work with camp registration software and have a couple comments
1) they should be able to make adjustments that certain fields aren't collected until after acceptance. It does seem weird that they'd need your insurance information while you are just applying. Once you're accepted you should be able to log back in and submit that information, so it doesn't seem to be configured correctly.
2) it is industry standard to get a card on file for future payments, but there should be language in there that explains how they handle your payment information if you are not accepted.
They could also configure it to take just a deposit, and then put you on a payment plan after acceptance.
3) you can complain about it - if no one complains they won't change the setup or look for a different software provider for next year. If they make it hard to apply people will just abandon registrations,or put in dummy information to just submit the form.
It is"normal" to not allow the form to progress until all mandatory information is filled out, but again it sounds like they way they've ordered it isn't right. Too bad, it is something that if it's done right is definitely easier for the parents!
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amother
Daisy
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Fri, Nov 22 2024, 8:17 am
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Omg, story of my life! I literally have to take a day off from work to properly fill out all my kid's camp forms!!
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zigi
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Fri, Nov 22 2024, 8:25 am
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Omg yes. I feel like I won the lottery when my kid makes it to camp. It means that I did everything correctly. One camp timed out after 20 minutes. It took me 3 tries. Another one if I had to leave the page I had to start it again... Another camp I didn't have the exact details so I did N/A. But he does have it. I will fix it later. Thankfully the second year is usually easier since information was saved.
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amother
Amaranthus
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Fri, Nov 22 2024, 9:03 am
I just did this a few days ago with a different camp.
It took me an HOUR- I timed it- to fill out everything and attach everything (photo of daughter, shot records, insurance card photos, lunch program forms, etc etc). Part of that hour included getting stumped at the payment page and thinking about which forms of payment to commit to, and how the deposit is so expensive and it was unclear if they don't refund if they don't even accept you. Really unclear.
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ruchelbuckle
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Fri, Nov 22 2024, 10:57 am
OP- I just want to validate and sympathize with you. I also find these online camp forms to be a huge pain.
If the camp invested in proper software then it's usually okay-- it allows you to work on it a bit and save and come back. And it will also allow to do certain things (upload insurance) after you've been accepted.
But the problems you are describing are likey because the camp thought they could do it for cheaper. 🫣
Just want to sympathize.... and I agree with you!
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amother
Carnation
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Fri, Nov 22 2024, 11:35 am
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In the future you can just put in 11111111 or xxxxxxxx or whatever format that field requires, then at the end before you hit submit you can go back and edit all those fields
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amother
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Fri, Nov 22 2024, 12:32 pm
| amother Carnation wrote: | | In the future you can just put in 11111111 or xxxxxxxx or whatever format that field requires, then at the end before you hit submit you can go back and edit all those fields |
I googled my heart out and can't figure out what the right format is for pcn that doesn't match my insurance card. So I emailed tech support and am waiting for a reply and this is why these chores are so endless.
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amother
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Fri, Nov 22 2024, 12:34 pm
| ruchelbuckle wrote: | OP- I just want to validate and sympathize with you. I also find these online camp forms to be a huge pain.
If the camp invested in proper software then it's usually okay-- it allows you to work on it a bit and save and come back. And it will also allow to do certain things (upload insurance) after you've been accepted.
But the problems you are describing are likey because the camp thought they could do it for cheaper. 🫣
Just want to sympathize.... and I agree with you! |
This seems to be some kind of standard software because they both say camp minder, though obviously customized because the two camps I started so far are different though similar. One is a big established camp so I would have expected them to know what they're doing.
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amother
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Fri, Nov 22 2024, 12:36 pm
| amother Amaranthus wrote: | I just did this a few days ago with a different camp.
It took me an HOUR- I timed it- to fill out everything and attach everything (photo of daughter, shot records, insurance card photos, lunch program forms, etc etc). Part of that hour included getting stumped at the payment page and thinking about which forms of payment to commit to, and how the deposit is so expensive and it was unclear if they don't refund if they don't even accept you. Really unclear. |
I'm sure they refund you if they don't accept you but I'm applying to a few camps after seeing the threads here about not getting in and I simply don't have the liquid cash to give big deposits to each one. A $50 administrative application fee I could understand but a tuition deposit up front is ridiculous.
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amother
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Fri, Nov 22 2024, 12:41 pm
| shabbatiscoming wrote: | Let her do it. My daughter applied to be a counselor this summer. She did it herself.
Everything is online now. And if she needs help, she can ask you |
My daughter is first time camper age, not counselor. The other is a little older. But how much easier would it be if I have to keep fielding questions like "ma, who am I supposed to write for emergency contact? Where do I find aunt shifra's phone number? Where's my insurance card? Is the insurance name the thing on top or on the side or under?" And I'm divorced so she'd have to figure out to click the small print that says add another parent at a different address.
Easier to just sit down and do it myself even taking an hour rather than get my day interrupted 100 times in the name of raising independent children. I'll have to do that sometime but if I'm having a hard time with this one it doesn't seem like the ideal teaching moment.
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