What bothers me about seminaries

↑ keym

Sun, Sep 29 2024, 7:18 am

amother Peach wrote:

I don't get it. At this point most sems offer shabbos meals either in the dorm or to be set up at local families. Yet it seems that people are saying that their daughters don't want to join because it's the "nebby choice" and somehow it's the seminary system's fault?

What more should they do? They are offering the meals & the girls are choosing not to take part in them. Should they be forced to?

Because many seminaries are not

If the requirement to stay in is a minimum of 15 girls (like one of my daughters friends places) that's not a comfort or a help.

Or the placement person is busy desperately begging people to host for meals and the hosts feel desperate and resentful.

Or the seminary that provides food for Shabbos but that's it. My daughter's friend said that once (last year) she was absolutely stuck. She stayed alone with one other girl who she barely knew who slept the whole day. The seminary provided the food. True. But not Shabbos.
We can't call a girl spoiled who doesn't want such an experience.

amother

Apricot

Sun, Sep 29 2024, 8:41 am

I was in seminary over 20 years ago. I didn't have relatives in Israel so I stayed in the dorm for shabbos at least once a month if not more. My friends and I actually loved it. Sometimes we would find a local meal for Friday night but we preferred to eat by ourselves on shabbos day - we bought rolls, kugels and deli and we found it fun and relaxing.

Now I live in Israel and I am asked to host all the time. When I lived in yerushalayim, it was easier to say I can host for meals but we don't have sleeping space. I had to make extra food but I didn't mind that for one meal.
Hosting for sleeping is very hard for me. I have a bunch of ADHD kids who are every messy and I have to constantly clean to keep my house looking normal. They also tend to get wild when we have guests and start jumping on the couch and acting out, which is embarrassing. I also have to plan a meal for "shalashudes" when we normally just have challah and chumus, so that is a lot of extra work.
I only host relatives or my friend's kids but it is definitely a lot of work. However, I do love getting to know them and all the boys and girls we've hosted have always been a pleasure.

amother

↑ Freesia

Sun, Sep 29 2024, 8:42 am

As a mother of a DD currently in seminary, this thread has been very eye opening. As to what each sem does and doesn't do, I can't really comment. We chose a seminary that was a good fit for DD academically, hashkafically, and socially. Our chinuch mentor, who knows DD very well, encouraged us to send her despite it being a huge financial burden.

For me, what I got out of this thread that I should educate DD on some of the concerns that people here mentioned. I hope she is not giggling with friends and ignoring the hosts, but I don't know for sure. I'll reinforce that. I'll also reinforce that it is a stretch for many people and she should be makir tov to every host.

She knows to bring her own linens wherever she goes.

She had mentioned buying candy for hosts, but I am happy to give her ideas that would be more useful. She needs to use her own money for all her expenses and I know it is stressful for her.

Her seminary offers food for any girl who wants to stay in for Shabbos. She was placed once already and said it was a pleasant experience but she would rather stay with people she has a connection with in the future.

If anyone wants to host a really lovely girl (who will be thrilled with chicken and rice and a small salad, that's all we serve each week) let me know!

Good Friend

Sun, Sep 29 2024, 9:41 am

I wanna give a shout out to Beis Chana seminary in Tzfat (chabad seminary). Shabbos and yomtov was a major part of the experience, and most weeks were mandatory in Shabbos, with meals all together and all the girls helping to serve, said divrei Torah, with a farbrengen after the meal (singing niggunim and words of inspiration lead by a speaker). Most yomim tovim were in seminary also, and same style.
On the shabbosim that we were allowed to go out it was optional. For those who stayed if it was a big group we ate in sem, medium group we joined a dorming high school on the same campus for their meals, and if it was very few they placed us with teachers.

amother

↑ Blush ↓

Sun, Sep 29 2024, 10:20 am

shabbatiscoming wrote:

Why ever not? What is so bad about serving exactly what you would serve for your family?

in general I can suffice with a pretty limited (and possibly a bit strange) menu for my family, because I know what each of us likes to eat so I don’t need to make a huge amount of variety to be sure no one will go hungry. it’s different when I have guests—there needs to be enough variety that I can be confident most will find something they like.

also, if it’s just us I can suffice with second best—if my toddler is needy and I’m exhausted, skip the salad. and I definitely don’t consider dessert a necessity when it’s just us. not so when I have guests. (I mean I guess I could do it, but yes I do expect to be judged if I do that or for people to just kind of wonder.)

↑ imaima ↓

Sun, Sep 29 2024, 11:07 am

shabbatiscoming wrote:

So let them. Who cares? Any sem girls that Ive had for shabbat have always helped to clear the table, always said everything was delicious and been good at conversing with us. But of course if the girls are entitled and dont like that is served, thats fine too. They are guests in YOUR home.

Why is it fine too?
It is my shabbos too. I also want to feel good on shabbos in my own home.

Last edited by imaima on Sun, Sep 29 2024, 11:26 am; edited 1 time in total

↑ imaima ↓

Sun, Sep 29 2024, 11:26 am

amother Freesia wrote:

This is very thoughtful. Just a list of things if anyone is interested:
- bring a small gift or offer to bring a gift
- compliment the food
- don’t ask „where is brisket/ xyz?“ if it’s not there, there must be a reason
- offer to help serve or clean up
- but don’t go too far into the kitchen, maybe the hosts don’t want you to see the mess
- don’t start speaking a different language with your friends when the hosts turn away for a second (if applicable)

If you are an overnight guest, there are more things to think about.

heidi

Sun, Sep 29 2024, 1:50 pm

amother Freesia wrote:

As someone who has been hosting sem and yeshiva students for many years, I'd like to point out one other thing.
BH we can host without financial strain.
But there is no way on G-d's green earth that we could have laid out $30000 multiple times for seminary.
I just hosted this shabbat before a 3 day RH.
2 girls- we know the parents of one of them- who sat at my table and did not speak, did not help, barely made eye contact and then went out for a THREE HOUR walk in my tiny yishuv on Friday night- Lord only knows what they were doing.
We have had pleasant guests, but honestly even when my kids were home they had zero in common with these mostly vapid girls whose biggest goals seemed to be getting married the next year.
It is beyond me how seminaries have the chutzpah to charge this much money and not have the decency to provide shabbat every single week.

amother

↑ Almond

Sun, Sep 29 2024, 2:05 pm

heidi wrote:

I actually made good friends with some of the family's kids. It likely helped that I was not afraid to go alone without a friend so I really got to know them. They got married younger than me though Wink

It made it much easier for my hostess too. In one place, I slept on the bunkbed with the kids.

I liked what I saw and made aliya over a decade ago.

amother

Poinsettia

Sun, Sep 29 2024, 2:25 pm

I just hung up the phone with my dd.
She's in a European Seminary, and apparently, there are no meals offered on Rosh Hashanah morning, at all!
Everyone has to figure their meals out, independently. My daughter is so stressed out. She has no invite for the second day of Rosh Hashanah yet, and is clueless about where to even start!
I had no clue about this when we sent her there. I'm upset with the Seminary, I trusted them to provide for my child, and they aren't!
At least it's only the morning meals, but it's stressful enough.

↑ imaima

Sun, Sep 29 2024, 2:55 pm

amother Poinsettia wrote:

Do you know anyone there in that town?

amother

Heather ↓

Sun, Sep 29 2024, 5:23 pm

Good Friend wrote:

Funny, I was just thinking the same. I'm reading this thread in shock.
I have zero family in Israel and never had to stress about meals or a place to sleep. There was always someone to help me if I couldn't tag along with friends. We always brought nuts or cake or something along. We would help set up, serve and clear. If we were told to come a significant amount of time before Shabbos we always helped in the kitchen. We took the kids to the park or on a walk on shabbos afternoon so the parents could rest and we weren't anything special, this was very much the norm.

amother

↑ DarkYellow ↓

Sun, Sep 29 2024, 5:33 pm

Good Friend wrote:

How many years ago did they start full shabbos/yomtov meals? In my days they didn't but I heard they changed shortly after.