I am very curious about not making aliyah

salt

Mon, Jun 24 2024, 4:15 am

amother Outerspace wrote:

Again someone please answer me and tell me how the mitzvos of the Lubavitcher rebbe or Rav Moshe or the Chafetz Chaim were just practice

Am Yisrael was sent to galut because of its (our) sins. We were dispersed to the four corners of the globe. As was promised in the Torah (eg. 2nd para of Shema).
According to Ramban, during those few thousand years, while Am Yisrael was in galut, they continued to be obligated to keep the mitzvot (obviously apart from those that are only for the Land of Israel), so that when Am Yisrael returns to it's land (also promised in the Torah, and more so, prophesied by our neviim), they shall return to keeping the mitzvot as originally intended, in the Land of Israel.
In Galut, Am Yisrael is no less obligated to keep the mitzvot.

During that time in galut there were many gedolim, holy Rabbanim and leaders, eg those that you mentioned (Lubavitcher rebbe or Rav Moshe or the Chafetz Chaim), whose were still in galut, and maybe even meant to be in galut, and they continue to keep the mitzvot, and to guide their talmidim, in the hope that one day they will merit returning to the land of ISrael.

amother

Outerspace

Mon, Jun 24 2024, 4:35 am

salt wrote:

Ok, maybe I misunderstood, I thought someone said that our mitzvos in chutz laaretz don’t count

csa123

Mon, Jun 24 2024, 4:38 am

amother Daphne wrote:

Please stop attacking Reality for this post. I said it, and I only said it in the context of the words of our chachamim that spoke to me to make me make aliyah. No one undercut what you’re doing.

The Ramban writes it. Never learned it in BY or seminary. My dh learned it with me. I was so perplexed that I spoke to two rabbanim in the USA and his rebbi in Israel. They confirmed it. I moved. Make your own cheshbonot, but the words of the ramban don’t change and please stop speaking this way to other posters. I did believe it enough to move, but to demand another poster confirms their personal belief about Jews outside of Israel is wrong. I trusted the ramban’s interpretation of an pasuk enough to move because it was the ramban. It was absolutely essential to me. That’s all that was stated. I think this is being taken too far.

There's no reason to disparage other Jews who make different choices, which is exactly what you did. If you need to put others down to feel better about your own choices, then maybe posting it on Imamother is not the best solution. There are multiple ways to interpret that quote. I think the correct interpretation is likely that all of our mitzvos are practice until Moshiach gets here because I don't think the chachamim would disparage other Jews like that. Obviously other people found it hurtful and offensive considering it has been cited on multiple other threads as being so. You can keep defending yourself to the end, or maybe you can question why you felt the need to come on a thread asking people who didn't move to Israel (so obviously this thread doesn't apply to you) why they don't move and disparaging the approximately 8.25 million Jews who live outside of Israel. You may not have meant it to be offensive, but clearly it was. I'm posting under my screen name so everyone can stop accusing me of being anonymous.

amother

Daphne

Mon, Jun 24 2024, 5:01 am

csa123 wrote:

No one disparaged anyone. I said the Ramban’s words moved me enough to move to Israel in response to a poster who said that it was special that we left a lot behind to be in Israel. There is no wrong there. Maybe a pasuk will inspire you one day to do something you always thought bigger than yourself, too. It did me.

The ramban simply states this. I spoke over the ramban with three rabbanim. They said yes, this is their interpretation too and two of the three lived in the USA. What the kuzari writes about living in chutz laaretz was very harsh and enough to make me cry. Is the kuzari disparaging Jews, too?

Reality

Mon, Jun 24 2024, 5:08 am

amother Cobalt wrote:

This is not the way I understand things but in any case:
Dear Reality,
I did not mean to insult or bully you. I meant to ask for clarification. I'm sorry if I came across too strongly, I feel very strongly on this topic. Please accept my mechila, I'll either tone it down or leave the conversation like I did last time.

I accept. Thank you!

csa123

Mon, Jun 24 2024, 5:36 am

amother Daphne wrote:

Really nice in your assumptions that I’ve never done anything bigger than myself. You’re right - all Jews living outside of Israel are small minded and selfish and don’t do anything for Torah. Thanks for showing your true colors.

someone

Mon, Jun 24 2024, 6:07 am

csa123 wrote:

By the bolded do you mean all mitzvot everywhere, both in Israel and outside of Israel?

amother

Daphne

Mon, Jun 24 2024, 6:11 am

csa123 wrote:

Again, no one said that. Different pasukim and mefarshim inspire people differently. This one did me. I hope there are many that inspire you to become bigger, this is one of mine.

Your comments are not very nice and have become very personal. I will not respond further.

There is an element where Torah is higher in israel. It just is. It doesn’t mean Torah somewhere else isn’t worthwhile or worth less. Only Hashem knows value, but that doesn’t change that kedusha is higher here. This is where Heaven touches earth. Nothing changes the words of the ramban or the kuzari, Eretz yisrael is the ideal for every Jew and it should be respected as such.

amother

Cobalt

Mon, Jun 24 2024, 6:21 am

See how beautiful our Torah is, how much Hashem loves us:

Megilla 29a
It is taught in a baraita: Rabbi Shimon ben Yoḥai says: Come and see how beloved the Jewish people are before the Holy One, Blessed be He. As every place they were exiled, the Divine Presence went with them. They were exiled to Egypt, and the Divine Presence went with them, as it is stated: “Did I reveal myself to the house of your father when they were in Egypt?” (I Samuel 2:27). They were exiled to Babylonia, and the Divine Presence went with them, as it is stated: “For your sake I have sent to Babylonia” (Isaiah 43:14). So too, when, in the future, they will be redeemed, the Divine Presence will be with them, as it is stated: “Then the Lord your God will return with your captivity” ( Deuteronomy 30:3). It does not state: He will bring back, I.e., He will cause the Jewish people to return, but rather it says: “He will return,” which teaches that the Holy One, Blessed be He, will return together with them from among the various exiles.

The Shechina is found in galus wherever the Jews were exiled to.

The Gemara goes on to say that the shechina is found in the shuls and yeshivos in galus. And these buildings will be transported to yerushalayim when the beis Hamikdash will be built to be part of the bigger mikdash.

Success10

Tue, Jun 25 2024, 2:51 am

A short, lovely op-ed on the topic of discussion: Nowhere else to go

The basic gist of the article is that the author finds the notion of Israel being about "nowhere else to go" offensive. It's about something we are running to, not the terrors we are running from. I love the positivity of the article, and I don't think it's subtly putting down anyone who can't come. But it certainly does encourage aliyah.