I was a staunch Vaxxer then went completely anti vax - AMA

amother

↑ OP ↓

Thu, Sep 28 2023, 11:02 am

amother Azure wrote:

It is strange because the way the anti-vaxers talk about vaccines, it's as if they are the route of all evil. Complete poison.

I agree, we are all unique. Some people have peanut allergies and would die of they eat peanuts. Does that mean none of us should eat peanuts?

My issue is that the anti-vaxers don't see vaccines like "peanuts". They see them as complete poison, in which case there would be many more people sick and dying in the world.

If the anti-vaxers would admit that maybe the vaccines aren't THAT bad, but they may harm SOME people, I believe they would have more credibility. It's when they say things like "vaccines are the cause of all diseases and they have terrible effects for EVERYONE", that's when I find them hard to believe.

Why would they not be considered that bad if they are causing more harm than good?
What if it was your child that god forbid ended up being vaccine injured? What if you start realizing that something changed in your child around the time they were vaccinated and everybody gaslit you and you were all of a sudden dubbed conspiracy theorist, anti vaxxer or delusional? I didn’t say they affect everyone, some people are blessed with stronger immune systems, and all batches of vaccines are not created equal. Some peoples brains can handle the over influx of aluminum, while others cannot.
When my daughter started exhibiting signs of autism - maybe the way she was wired caused the sensitivity with the amount that was injected into her vs my other children who were not affected that way, and maybe her batch of vaccine had a little bit more than my others. Who knows. But the bottom line is, it’s only when something happens that you start questioning and then backtracking and noticing many other things that are just red flags.

Why won’t they just test the vaccines and accept liability? Why aren’t they just transparent? Why are some people so injured and doctors not even paying attention and trying to see if there is reason to believe it’s from the vaccine?

There’s so much unknown and so much corruption that you start being skeptical and questioning it. Something is not right. And until there is more information available and they start showing something other then the lies that is out there, I have no choice but to stand by my decision and stop trusting people who are too manipulated by money and do not have my children’s well-being in mind.

They made a big mistake with covid. It opened up many peoples eyes to the corruption and people are fed up. I don’t think they imagined it would all become undone.

I’ve been harassed to no end from the children’s doctors office to get vaccinated - when this has never happened before even right after covid.
People are stopping to vaccinate until they get more information. Not letting themselves be fooled. Again.

↑ skyeblue ↓

Thu, Sep 28 2023, 11:13 am

amother Cadetblue wrote:

This is what gets me so frustrated about the narrative of anti-vax. Why can't we both be "a little" right? I'm not saying your research and data is totally illegitimate, and while I don't agree with your lifestyle choices, I respect the fact that you've done your research and have backup for your claims. I think there are flaws on both sides of the aisle - that's always how it's going to be. I can be aware of the flaws in my position and still hold to it, you should do the same. Turning this into such a polarized debate that only one opinion can be objectively correct is a fallacy. Statistics and data are not absolute, and one should make their decision with a healthy awareness of that fact- which set of statistics and data do I put my faith in, knowing that there are flaws in the argument?
When you hold the position that your argument is objectively correct and mine is objectively incorrect/evil/naive, you come across sounding very conspiracy theory-ish and I lose my respect for your opinion.

Unless the "anti-vaxxers" are pressuring you, why does it bother you if someone holds a binary view on vaccination?

Why must there be "flaws on the other side of the isle"? Maybe they ARE 100% right and you are uninformed?

Or maybe you are correct and their binary thinking IS flawed. So? They can rely on their own reasoning and they don't have to respect your view as having any merit.

Does it bother you when people have a binary view IN FAVOR of the COVID experimental treatment, or are you able to give them the space to hold this view?

***
This is coming from someone who vaccinated all my kids and was subsequently extremely disillusioned with the ENTIRE vaccination system due to the covid "vaccine" scam. I don't have clear opinions on all other vaccinations as I haven't done the proper research. I suspect SOME of them may be useful, and must of course be given at the right time to mitigate the potential damage to the child, but that there are definitely too many vaccinations and there is definitely corruption in the system.

amother

↑ OP ↓

Thu, Sep 28 2023, 11:14 am

amother Azure wrote:

I

I agree, we are all unique. Some people have peanut allergies and would die of they eat peanuts. Does that mean none of us should eat peanuts?

Just something interesting about the peanut allergy you mentioned.

After my sibling gave birth I begged her to hold off on vaxxing just for a bit until she researches it and she caved and gave her daughter the vit k shot.
A month later - her baby is having breakout after breakout in terrible skin rashes and she realizes that the baby is reacting every time she eats peanuts.

A few days later I was watching some random clip and was shocked to hear that the vit k shot, which is no vitamin k and is synthetic garbage has something in it that causes - what do you know, peanut allergies.
Also was shocked to hear that there’s an oral option that they offer - only if you decline the vaccine which I’m sure she would have done had she known.

But now her child has a sensitivity to peanuts. Hopefully not forever, but who knows? And to know it’s almost for sure related to the shot, to know that the uptick in peanut allergies in the past 20 years is way way higher than normal could be caused by a shot they’re giving to day old babies in the hospital and they refuse to disclose this information to new mothers?
Just choosing not to reveal information and not having the ingredients and side affects plastered everywhere is just wrong and very shady.

Not what you were asking, but you brought it up….

amother

↑ Cadetblue ↓

Thu, Sep 28 2023, 11:23 am

skyeblue wrote:

It frustrates me when people hold binary views on topics that are based on statistics and data like this- inherently they cannot be 100% right because their view is based on statistics - there is no 100%. I've just heard this narrative on so many different polarized topics - when you refuse to admit that my claim might have legitimacy, I lose respect for the debate, because things are rarely so black and white. I don't claim to be absolutely right, and don't believe you are absolutely wrong. People in the more polarized group don't have the same perspective, and that's frustrating.
Btw, I'm aware that there are people from the pro-vax camp who do the same- your research/opinion is totally illegitimate and I'm 100% correct. I don't think that's right either

amother

Aqua ↓

Thu, Sep 28 2023, 11:26 am

amother Navy wrote:

Serious question here.
If you can’t trust the studies and research that are pro vaccine, why can you trust the studies and research that are anti vaccine?
Let’s assume you are truly qualified to understand medical statistics and analyze and interpret data as you assert you are.
If you believe the data and studies are faulty, then what are you researching and studying and interpreting and basing decisions on?
How are you deciding who is lying and who is telling the truth?
Again, asking seriously.
I always wondered this- if I’m assuming all studies are real and I believe them- than the majority of the data points to one conclusion. If I decide the research is a lie, then I am left with no data to interpret because I don’t have a set of established data points to analyze, only my limited experiences (which are obviously not sufficient for scientific study).

Not OP, but I'm trying to understand this question. If it is universally established in the medical community that, for instance, the gold standard for clinical studies requires double blind placebo trials, and those were never done with vaccines, then they were never done.
What's to interpret?

amother

↑ Azure ↓

Thu, Sep 28 2023, 11:28 am

amother OP wrote:

Correct, but so far nothing bad has happened to us BH, so we'll just continue what we've been doing. Of course if one of my kid got an unexplained illness CH"V I would look into the cause and question the vaccines. But so far I haven't seen that they cause more harm than good for MY FAMILY.

I hope all your kids have a refuah shleima.

amother

↑ Azure ↓

Thu, Sep 28 2023, 11:34 am

amother OP wrote:

Yeah, I'll take peanut allergies over blood clotting issues.

amother

↑ Aqua ↓

Thu, Sep 28 2023, 11:38 am

GLUE wrote:

I hear this all the time but when I looked it up all I could find is that Polio has gone up and up every year until the vaccine came out.

Once the vaccine came out it went from an illness that every one could get to one that only the unvaxed got.

Please tell me were you are getting your research on Polio.

The response is that after the vaccine came out, polio cases were instead diagnosed as meningitis. And to push the vaccine before it came out, other illnesses that were not polio were diagnosed as polio to make polio seem more widespread.

It's now believed that FDR more likely had Guillain-barre, not polio, as an example.

Other conditions that were diagnosed as polio but were not, were transverse myelitis, viral meningitis and more.

This is the response I have encountered and I honestly don't know what to think at this point. Before covid I would have dismissed this as preposterous. Not anymore.

amother

DarkViolet ↓

Thu, Sep 28 2023, 11:38 am

amother OP wrote:

I was pregnant during covid and was terrified of losing my baby. My husband and I got the first covid shot and got covid from the shot. My husband had a terrible reaction to it which we kept thinking was from covid and suffered for almost a year with head to toe psoriasis.
I had a reaction too, and got a massive cyst that appeared right after I gave birth which I also dismissed and said was nothing.
When my daughter started suffering with bloody noses for weeks that wouldn’t stop and my eight year old started peeing blood and none of the tests showed up with anything - I also kept dismissing it as a coincidence.
As time went on I took my kids for their missed shots after covid craze and the new baby shots and my two year old started acting weird and not responding to things that they used to respond to and just parroting everything that was said.
Doctor started with evaluation forms and said definitely showing signs of autism and I started looking into things and just timelines and chains of events back to the covid shot and the fact that we got covid from the shot, even though they said we couldn’t.

Also at that point I started researching on Twitter since it was bought and freed by Elon musk and started seeing very interesting things regarding side affects with the covid shot and my husbands ailments and realizing many things were tied to the shot and just started looking into the childhood shots as well. This is over the course of over a year that I started talking to the doctor and she dismissed my concerns as nonsense and I just realized this is something I need to do on my own.
And I did.
And it’s a rabbit hole. And I can never go back.

I'm totally with you, op, all the way! All my kids were fully vaxxed, even got their hep b shots at birth, and now after COVID opened our eyes, we never want to ever give them another shot. My husband did tremendous research and literally spoke to dozens of experts on this issue at length.
The unnatural desire of the medical establishment to completely shut down any resistance to vaccines is a HUGE red flag, by the way.

amother

↑ Aqua ↓

Thu, Sep 28 2023, 11:47 am

amother Azure wrote:

Yeah, I'll take peanut allergies over blood clotting issues.

First of all, I have a problem with not being advised as to the risk factors.

We never are, with vaccines, other than risk of a temporary fever and numbness at the injection site. As a new mother, I would have appreciated hearing about this potential to develop a peanut allergy.

I also would like to know more about the risk of blood clotting in newborns. For a vaccine to be given to every newborn, the risk of clotting should be extremely high. Color me skeptical. What are the risk factors for clotting? Why wasn't I given the opportunity to make my own determination that my dc perhaps did not have any of those risk factors so better to skip the vitamin K shot?

Now Idk if you have any children with peanut allergies, but I do. And it's absolutely nothing to be flippant about. Not only are accidental exposures terrifying and potentially life-threatening, they bring with them constant anxiety.

amother

↑ OP ↓

Thu, Sep 28 2023, 12:11 pm

amother Milk wrote:

OP, thanks for opening this thread.

On a slight tangent here, is your daughter doing okay?

IIRC, a family member of mine was able to reverse autism at early stages of exhibition.

Backstory, shortly after routine vac appt, perfectly normal 10 yr old child had high high fever and began showing autism symptoms like stimming, etc.)

Yes! Thank God! It lasted about an year and she slowly started snapping out of it and has developed into a normal almost five year old girl.
It was amazing watching her break through, and terrifying to see the regression of a very advanced brilliant child turning into a flapping arm girl who couldn’t go down the stairs and didn’t know who I was or what her name was.
I have not given another vaccine since that last one - and the crazy thing is I found her vaccine booklet and realized that I had given her the Mmrv at 11 months at the suggestion of the doctor as we were flying right before her first birthday, and then gave it again the month following our return after her first birthday. Then sometime later she got another combination shot and I think the overload caused something in her system to snap and I haven’t given any since.

I am blessed. But it could have gone so badly. And as unfortunate as it was that I got the covid shot, I’m so grateful it snapped me out of the blind faith I had and opened my eyes.

Thank you for asking.

amother

Cherry

Thu, Sep 28 2023, 12:25 pm

The things you’re spewing are so utterly ridiculous I wonder just how much research you’ve actually done. Childhood illnesses on the rise?!

Bill Bryson once wrote, "The world before the modern era was overwhelmingly a place of tiny coffins."

Here are the facts:

In the olden days, half of children did not make it past the age of five.

Only 200 years ago (1800), the global child mortality rate (the number of children dying under five) was over 40%. This was an improvement over the centuries prior (!!). In the US it was slightly higher, at 45%. That means if you gave birth to ten children (common), you should expect to bury on average four or five of them BEFORE THEY TURNED FIVE.

Only 70 years ago, after World War 2, the global child mortality rate was still over 20%. That means if you gave birth to ten children, you should expect to bury on average two of them before they turned five. The US was much better than the rest of the world at 5%- so if you and one neighbor each gave birth to ten children, one of you should expect to bury a child before they turn five.

Currently, the global child mortality rate is under 4%, and in the U.S. (and other very developed countries) it is around half a percent. That means if you and twenty neighbors each give birth to ten children, odds are only one will have a child who won’t make it to the age of five.

Please don’t believe the nonsense of “childhood disease is on the rise”. Without modern medicine and vaccines, half of these children wouldn’t have survived in the first place, and would have suffered through far more and far worse diseases to boot. Any sensationalist headline you read is hyper focused on a specific time and demographic and is very misleading.

https://ourworldindata.org/gra.....D_WRL

https://www.statista.com/stati.....hday.

https://childmortality.org/data

amother

↑ DarkViolet ↓

Thu, Sep 28 2023, 12:33 pm

amother Aqua wrote:

Yes, this. Among other concerns, one of my pet peeves with doctors and vaccines is that they never look at my child as an individual- what are the exact risks for this child? What is the probability that my child could contract these diseases? If my baby is breastfed for a year and is staying home with me, what are the chances that he'd be exposed to these illnesses? Do the benefits outweigh the risks? (Are there any real benefits?) What about my child's unique genetic and biological makeup might make him more suseptible to vaccine injury? But the pediatricians never do this. It's one size fits all; everyone must get vaccinated 100% or they get into a panic. If you even dare question them, they kick you out of their office.
I smell a rat.

ETA And when my 2nd child did have a negative reaction to MMR, do you think his pediatrician filed a report with VAERS?? You wish. Probably 80% of these vaccine injuries go unreported. How convenient. And the vaccine pharmaceutical companies are never legally liable. How convenient, indeed.