Is a degree a waste of $ for kid w/o specific career plans

amother

↑ Gold ↓

Tue, May 04 2021, 2:37 pm

amother [ Rose ] wrote:

What’s her job and how’d she get it?

Many colleges and universities offer very discounted rates for their employees and even their children. It would vary depending on the university or course.

My friend worked as a secretary at NYU and was able to take free courses while employed.

amother

↑ Navy ↓

Tue, May 04 2021, 2:39 pm

amother [ Rose ] wrote:

What’s her job and how’d she get it?

Her job is in finance, and she got it through the regular online application process and interviews.

Her bachelor's degree was in a totally unrelated field. Her first full-time job after college was as an office manager at small company, but she gradually expanded her responsibilities to include some finance-related tasks and eventually that company formally switched her role to a finance role and hired a replacement office manager. After a couple of years in that position, she got the finance role at the university. Her master's will be in finance.

amother

Khaki

Tue, May 04 2021, 2:40 pm

amother [ OP ] wrote:

We tried a career counselor but nothing interested dd. At this point in her life she’s just enjoying her social life and chessed activities. School is a party. Her grades are fine but she’s not the studious type. She also isn’t super aware of her strengths and weaknesses and has an unrealistic view of her ability to multitask. We don’t want to do the Jewish programs because they’re overpriced. We looked into community college but again are just hesitating at the tuition (which is reasonable but still adds up) if she won’t have anything to show for it in the end.

So interesting that you're finding that because we're finding just the opposite. DD is a little bit of a snob and really doesn't want to do a frum program. The non frum programs, for a BA at least are a lot more expensive because they won't accept her seminary credits, they won't allow her to work while pursuing degree, they will take her at least two years longer than a non frum program would (meaning she can't even work with said degree for an additional two years...) I'd love to find practical and inexpensive non frum programs!

amother

↑ Amber

Tue, May 04 2021, 2:42 pm

amother [ Khaki ] wrote:

The frum programs are best to save time.

To save money, you can go to community college for the first two years.

singleagain ↓

Tue, May 04 2021, 2:46 pm

When I was doing freshman orientation I told them that of you right know what you wanted you should take intro courses for anything that sounds remotely interesting. You never know what will strike.

And there's a ton of options besides ot and social worker. Especially since ppl have learned you can do things remotely

↑ Elfrida

Tue, May 04 2021, 2:47 pm

amother [ Turquoise ] wrote:

Vote for a good BA program teaches critical thinking and analysis. You 'use' your BA even if you can't connect the dots back to your day-to-day..

Agreed. My friend had no idea what to study, and ended up doing a degree in english literature. She now had an excellent planning and administration job. Her boss couldn't care less if she can do an in depth analysis of Hamlet, or if she knows the difference between the Bronte sisters, but she would never have got that job in the first place without some kind of degree.

Aurora

Tue, May 04 2021, 2:50 pm

I know too many older women who never got a degree, and then either ended up stuck in unhappy marriages because they couldn't afford to leave, or who left and are very poor because they don't have much earning potential.

Please give her a way to always have the choices that financial independence can bring you. But let her do as much as she can as cheaply as possible.

honey36 ↓

Tue, May 04 2021, 2:52 pm

Such a hard decision! She's so young so it's annoying but I would really try and sit down with her and figure out if any job at all interests her.

Don't ask questions like is she interested in subjects like science, math, english etc. Sounds like she doesn't care for that stuff which is fine. Rather, does she like working with kids? Helping Older people? Cooking? Fashion?

It doesn't have to be office job/employee vs. degree. There's so much out there to do! I don't think a degree is necessary but may be smarter in the long run depending on her interests. E.g. if she likes working with kids, maybe worth it to get some sort of a degree in education so she can get paid more etc.

But if shes good with her hands- she can be a sheital macher, or if she likes cooking- maybe go into the food industry. Fashion- open a clothing or shoe store etc. These are jobs girls in my class did who never got degrees and their probably making as much money, if not more than those with degrees (obviously depends which degree, but in any case, doesn't sound like shes going to be doctor or lawyer or something.)

amother

Mint

Tue, May 04 2021, 2:55 pm

She can get a bachelor's in liberal arts through tti or maalot in about a year for around 10k. It's a great stepping stone if she needs it one day. I know 4 ppl with this degree who used it later down the line to get into other programs such as social work, accounting, law, or nursing.

amother

↑ OP ↓

Tue, May 04 2021, 3:00 pm

I went to a liberal arts school and my bachelor’s program was a total waste of time. This was back in the 90s so I can only imagine how much worse the liberal indoctrination has gotten.

You are right a BA is the basic requirement for most entry level jobs in the secular world.

miami85

Tue, May 04 2021, 3:07 pm

I say no, because part of "going to college" is gaining knowledge about different things and exploring your likes and dislikes. In college you can take courses based on your preferences--we call it a "Major". Most of the "Frum" college programs are designed for those who are career minded and just want to finish quickly to get to their masters as fast as possible, but if she needs time to figure things out just starting is better than nothing.

If she's more inclined to working with people--can't hurt to major in psychology.
If she's more inclined to working with numbers--major in something like pre-accounting track or mathematics
If she wants to run a business--take marketing and economics courses (those are usually part of basic Liberal arts anyway)

Even a basic liberal arts degree with give her a smattering of different subjects and she can choose a "career" later on.
My father-in-law, not religious, didn't finish his bachelors until he was an adult--meaning his kids were grown up already but he still managed to work and get it "Eventually".

Just starting before she gets married is a step in the right direction and if it takes 10 years it takes 10 years but having some post H.S. education is better than nothing.

amother

Brown ↓

Tue, May 04 2021, 3:18 pm

I think she should start going to college and getting the core courses out of the way, like English, history, etc. That way if/when she does decide to finish her degree it can save her up to 2 years. I went back to school in my 30s and at that time I really regretted not having done basic college courses when I was single. It could have save me so much time. (I ended up doing a lot of CLEP and online classes. My seminary credits didn't go very far.)

amother

↑ Navy ↓

Tue, May 04 2021, 3:25 pm

honey36 wrote:

But if shes good with her hands- she can be a sheital macher, or if she likes cooking- maybe go into the food industry. Fashion- open a clothing or shoe store etc. These are jobs girls in my class did who never got degrees and their probably making as much money, if not more than those with degrees (obviously depends which degree, but in any case, doesn't sound like shes going to be doctor or lawyer or something.)

I agree these can be good options for some people, but the ones who make good full-time money this way are the motivated go-getters. A lot of women dabble here and there and earn a little supplementary income, but the ones who earn a real living providing goods or services usually work very hard, at least during the early years when building up their business and reputation. It does not sound as if OP's daughter is very driven, although maybe that would change if she found the right field for her.

amother

Orange ↓

Tue, May 04 2021, 3:25 pm

How is a 1 year bachelor degree even remotely comparable to a 4 year degree?
Are grad school naive enough to think they are?

I imagine OP’s DD is going to sem next year. I imagine she will need to apply from there, if she wants to go to college as, while I am taking about “regular” colleges, applications were due by Jan/Feb. and deposits were due no later than May 1 (which was Shabbos.
While she is in Sem. She should have the opportunity to speak with her teachers and mentors and hopefully figure out her best path.

I can’t imagine senior DD just hanging out and socialize. I am wistfully thinking of the lack of stress that must accompany. Mine had AP Calc this morning and has been stressed and has not stopped working hard (ie no time to help me with anything). Next up is a Chumash project, followed by a history paper and then AP Psych next Tuesday. I can’t wait for her to be done.

nicole81 ↓

Tue, May 04 2021, 3:45 pm

amother [ Orange ] wrote:

There are plenty of colleges still accepting applications. Sure, the Ivies are filled up by now, but SUNY and CUNY are still actively recruiting. I get multiple emails a week from various CUNY programs about their open houses, begging us to invite our students to apply. They're "regular" colleges.

amother

↑ Orange ↓

Tue, May 04 2021, 3:52 pm

nicole81 wrote:

Those are for spring or fall 2022 (but the essay topics haven’t been revealed yet so you can submit your application. For Fall 2021, CUNY and SUNY had a deadline of Feb 1 for applications. Deposit due May 1.
Trust me. Last week almost everyone I know with seniors was making a last minute decision.

** if you are now getting in off a waitlist, you can lose your deposit and go to a different school, but you would have needed to apply.

amother

↑ Brown ↓

Tue, May 04 2021, 3:55 pm

amother [ Orange ] wrote:

I did an online degree in 2.5 years, then used it to get into an accelerated nursing program, and then got in to a highly ranked graduate school.

Depending on what your ultimate career goal is, a "1-year bachelors" can serve your purposes just as well as a 4-year degree. Many people start out in community colleges and then transfer to a university once they have a clear picture of what they want to do.

These days there are many different paths and approaches towards higher education and many different options. Gone are the days when the college you got into at 18 defines your position in life forevermore.

amother

Blonde ↓

Tue, May 04 2021, 3:55 pm

amother [ Orange ] wrote:

How is a 1 year bachelor degree even remotely comparable to a 4 year degree?
Are grad school naive enough to think they are?

It's not really a one year degree. My DD is a 12th grader as well. She took AP classes in 11th and 12th grade which she will be getting credit for, will be taking college classes this summer and next summer, her sem year next year will give her 30 credits, so when she comes back if she takes a full course load she can finish in 3 semesters. Yes, it is through a frum program, but an accredited FULL degree, for which she will work hard for her 120 credits, and will enable her to get into graduate school.