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Forum -> Pregnancy & Childbirth -> Baby Names

English names?

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Seraph ↓

Tue, Jul 03 2007, 4:25 am

Are you going to give your kid an english name? Or just write their hebrew name phoenetically on their birth certificate?
My husband's whole family goes by their english name.
No one in my family (meaning my siblings) have an english name at all.

We're deciding what we want to do.

smiley:)

Tue, Jul 03 2007, 4:31 am

I, my husband and kids only have Hebrew names so thats what is on all the official documents.

shalhevet ↓

Tue, Jul 03 2007, 4:46 am

What's the problem in Israel? Anyway there are no official documents with non-Hebrew names here.

amother ↓

Tue, Jul 03 2007, 4:54 am

I'm American and DH is Israel. He really likes the name Zoe and wants to use it on US documents if we have a girl. I have such strong feelings against this. To quote Uncle Moishy: "When we were slaves in Egypt so many years ago / There was a very evil king, his name was Paroh / He tried to wipe the Jews out and for that he is to blame / But Hashem destroyed his people cause we kept out Jewish names." But for some reason DH doesn't seem to take my argument seriously when I sing this song for him during our baby-naming discussions!!!

↑ Seraph ↓

Tue, Jul 03 2007, 5:25 am

shalhevet wrote:

What's the problem in Israel? Anyway there are no official documents with non-Hebrew names here.

American documents...

And my in laws are very much english speakers and have a hard time pronouncing israeli names. Which is why all my silbings in law, even though they grew up here in Israel, go by their english name amongst the family.
So if we name our kids hebrew names, I can just imagine my mother in law (she's a giyores) trying to break her teeth to pronounce them...

Raisin

Tue, Jul 03 2007, 5:27 am

try and give your kids names that are easy to pronounce for anyone.

↑ Seraph ↓

Tue, Jul 03 2007, 5:40 am

Raisin wrote:

try and give your kids names that are easy to pronounce for anyone.

That would generally be the case, but my mother in law has a hard time pronouncing even some english words... It would have to be a traditional english name for her to be able to pronounce it...
And we already picked out hebrew names, and they're not the easiest to pronounce. The question is- english name in addition? Or no?

↑ shalhevet ↓

Tue, Jul 03 2007, 6:11 am

breslov, I just don't get when you're going to be using these English names. Presumably you'll call your children by their Jewish names, on anything official in Israel that's what will be written, in gan/school/cheder they'll use their Jewish names.

So are you giving them a special name just for your MIL to use? shock

If she can't pronounce the name, she'll probably just make up a nickname herself. Anyway it's going to be totally confusing for the kids - savta calls out someone else's name when she wants me. Confused

cdawnr

Tue, Jul 03 2007, 6:23 am

My son is Avraham and we put Abraham on the birth certificate, but now I am nt really sure why we even did that....

My daughter is Elisheva...and that is what we put.

From here forth I wil only put the exact. I always wanted my kids to have just one name...I agree, there is no real reason for different names.

↑ Seraph ↓

Tue, Jul 03 2007, 6:32 am

shalhevet wrote:

No, it wouldn't be just my MIL calling the kids that. It would be my husband's whole side of the family, and my non frum relatives.
My husband, for example, is called Michael * (not his real name, but a similar idea) by his family members, and everyone else calls him Michoel. Even though the siblings are all frum, they still call each other just by their english names, because thats what they're comfortable with.

And what else to use it? Listen, I can't predict my kids lives and what they're going to do with it, but maybe they'll want to one day go live in a different country and work there, and to have to have non jewish people calling them "Avimelech" as opposed to Dave would just be weird.
I know, lehavdil, of a girl who had no english name and when she became unfrum, she had no other name to use besides for her very hebrew name, and she hated that.
I don't ch'v want my kids to be not frum, but there are other reasons why someone would possibly want to use an english name for a legitimate reason, and to make one up at an older age is just weird...
No one says you have to USE the english name. But to just have it available in case they'd ever want to use it.

mummy-bh

Tue, Jul 03 2007, 6:34 am

My kids don't have English names. For the most part, they have 'unpronounceable' names. They get a real kick out of hearing themselves called in the dentists or some such. (Think how to pronounce Menachem with a thick Mancunian accent!)

hila

Tue, Jul 03 2007, 6:40 am

I dont agree that kids need English names at all. We never gave tehm two names. And their TOTALLY Hebrew names are on the birth certificates (British and US) with no problem.
The workd is now global and if Achmed is a recognisable name in England then they can put up with Avichai and any other name I chose for my kids.

And some of my parents fiends had trouble with the "CH" chet sound, but it doesnt bother me or them. The sauy Avihai. Big deal.

Call them one name only.

Truth is they may end up with a nickname anyway.
(It may be a bit embarassing when I call my chayal "chickie" in a month when he starts teh army. I guess we should use his real name )

Marion ↓

Tue, Jul 03 2007, 6:46 am

Well, my DS has only Hebrew names, but both are fairly pronounceable. We're debating this still for #2, as one of the names we want to use if it's a boy is actually FIL's "English" name, but he doesn't use it...and we're debating whether or not we can use the name period.

↑ shalhevet ↓

Tue, Jul 03 2007, 6:48 am

breslov wrote:

shalhevet wrote:

But they call him that because they called him that as they grew up. My dh is Israeli and has a biblical name. When he was growing up he was always called Avi but when he became chareidi he changed to Avrohom (again, not the actual name, but the name he was given at the bris). His family still call him Avi, but everyone else calls him Avrohom. But he was once used to being called Avi.

But you're in a different situation. Say you call your ds Mordechai and write Max on his American documents. So you and dh call him Mordechai, he goes to gan and cheder and he gets called Mordechai, he gets letters with the name Mordechai and writes Mordechai on his books.
One day grandma comes round and in the middle of something calls "Max!". Everyone looks round (including him).

Quote:

And what else to use it? Listen, I can't predict my kids lives and what they're going to do with it, but maybe they'll want to one day go live in a different country and work there, and to have to have non jewish people calling them "Avimelech" as opposed to Dave would just be weird.
I know, lehavdil, of a girl who had no english name and when she became unfrum, she had no other name to use besides for her very hebrew name, and she hated that.
I don't ch'v want my kids to be not frum,

Well that's just too bad. I am really not going to give my kids English names just in case they decide to live in America or England and not be frum, chas v'shalom.

Quote:

but there are other reasons why someone would possibly want to use an english name for a legitimate reason, and to make one up at an older age is just weird...
No one says you have to USE the english name. But to just have it available in case they'd ever want to use it.

Look, if a frum person ends up living in Alaska and finds that no-one can pronounce Mordechai he will be perfectly capable of deciding to tell his non-Jewish business associates to call him Milton or Max or Martin.

mima

Tue, Jul 03 2007, 6:49 am

We gave our kids an English name for official documents. It has no connection to the Hebrew name, just the same initial.
As Breslov said, you never know later in their in lives when it may come in handy, and for the meant time whats the harm in them being called properly in the doctors office, at the airport etc. What

challi

Tue, Jul 03 2007, 6:52 am

breslov, just so you can plan ahead, but if you want all the American documents to have an English name you'll also have to make sure that's what is written on the Israeli documents as well. Whatever they write at the misrad ha panim when you ask them to give you an english copy is exactly what the U.S. embassy/ consulate will insist on putting on any passport, consular report of birt abroad, s.s. card etc.

With dd, the lady at misrad hapanim spelled the English translation WRONG. It wasn't even any longer her name. In the rush to get all her paperwork in order, we didn't realize till we went down to the embassy. We realized only when they pointed out that what we wrote on the form and what was on the Israeli birth certificate were 2 diff names, nad they refused to put anything else despite us telling them that it was a mistake. In order to change it now is a long drawn out procedure here, not to mention the price of a new passport. So for now we're stuck.

Just wanted to let you know that its not that uncomplicated and needs some forethought and pre-planning if that is actually what you intend to do.

↑ Seraph

Tue, Jul 03 2007, 6:59 am

shalhevet wrote:

But you're in a different situation. Say you call your ds Mordechai and write Max on his American documents. So you and dh call him Mordechai, he goes to gan and cheder and he gets called Mordechai, he gets letters with the name Mordechai and writes Mordechai on his books.
One day grandma comes round and in the middle of something calls "Max!". Everyone looks round (including him).

Not quite, because growing up, grandma and grampa and all who are a big part of his life will be calling him max. Not just one day there'll be a name that he never heard before.

Quote:

Well that's just too bad. I am really not going to give my kids English names just in case they decide to live in America or England and not be frum, chas v'shalom.

See, this is based on our differnet hashkafos. I see nothing wrong if my kid would want to live in chutz laaretz (besides for the fact that it'll be far from family), and its very much a possibility. (I'm not raising them with the idea that you have to live in e'y because its holy etc and if you leave israel we'll be very disappointed with you. But this isn't a debate on living in eretz yisroel or not, and lets not turn it into that.) And you don't have to be not frum to have a job that would be better off with an english name. Not to mention, even if you live in israel, and you deal with international clientelle, sometimes an english name would work better than a hebrew name.

Atali

Tue, Jul 03 2007, 7:01 am

As someone who has a different English or Hebrew name, I can tell you it is not a good idea for a few reasons:

1. It can create problems with legal documents. Let's say, for example, that you wrote a check to "Rivka" without knowing that her English name was really "Roberta", the bank may refuse to take it. (I have had this problem more than once).

2. In the past I have tried to get employers to call me by my hebrew name but they won't since it isn't the name on the government forms.

3. People may think that your children are BTs.

zigi

Tue, Jul 03 2007, 9:08 am

I hate having an english name. first of all I don't like the name at all.second its annoying when I have a new job and the boss is making plane tickets etc.. I have to say my legal name is....
if my children want to change their names they can do it when they are legal.

gryp ↓

Tue, Jul 03 2007, 9:08 am

I don't see a need for English names at all. A Hebrew name is special since it's a name for the essence of an individual.

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