Mom beats son for participating in Baltimore riots

↑ ora_43 ↓

Thu, Apr 30 2015, 9:25 am

A quote from that article I linked to:

Quote:

In 2001, a pair of black men and a pair of white men went hunting for work in Milwaukee, Wis. Each was 23 years old, a local college student, bright and articulate. They looked alike and dressed alike, had an identical educational background and remarkably similar past work experience. From June to December, they combed the Sunday classified pages in the Milwaukee Journal Sentinel and searched a state-run job site called Jobnet, applying for the same entry-level jobs as waiters, delivery-truck drivers, cooks, and cashiers. There was one obvious difference in each pair: One man was a former criminal and the other was not.

If this sounds like an experiment, that’s because it was.

...

Pager’s white applicant without a criminal record had a 34 percent callback rate. That promptly sank to 17 percent for her white applicant with a criminal record. The figures for black applicants were 14 percent and 5 percent. And yes, you read that right: in Pager’s experiment, white job applicants with a criminal history got more callbacks than black applicants without one. “I expected to find an effect with a criminal record and some with race,” Pager says. “I certainly was not expecting that result, and it was quite a surprise.”

↑ Raisin ↓

Thu, Apr 30 2015, 9:26 am

PinkFridge wrote:

I really hear the comments about a week with no answers, and the after effects of slavery (a century and a half since the Emancipation Proclamation, much of that still involving serious discrimination and worse isn't so long).
But why erupt in violence, among the very community that is suffering the most, and for whom you've been peacefully demonstrating the whole week??? Why can't there be a different reaction? What should it be?

Being bought up without a father figure and in poverty puts a child (especially boys) at much higher risk for all sorts of things, especially violence and crime. They are angry. Yes, this is not the right reaction, obviously, and it is one that is deplored by many other members of the same community.

The anger is legitimate, the reaction is not. But to understand why people would react in that way, you need to look back in history.

Martin Luther King advocated peaceful protest, look what happened to him. Although I think he and others achieved huge changes through this approach.

↑ 33055 ↓

Thu, Apr 30 2015, 9:44 am

sky wrote:

She didn't have any support at the time and didn't speak the language.

Sometimes help is not a good things. In some ways welfare and other hand outs have set people back further then having to fight to make it on your own. (In our own community as well)

Yes, it was not easy. My grandfather also was devastated by the war and arrived a broken man. He came to a country with many of his landsmen speaking the same language. He read yiddush newspapers and frequented yiddush merchants.

He was never subject to racial discrimination. This discrimination was codified by the very government sovereign over the blacks. To compare you would have to wonder why Jews under the Czar weren't upwardly mobile.

↑ PinkFridge ↓

Thu, Apr 30 2015, 9:46 am

Raisin wrote:

Martin Luther King advocated peaceful protest, look what happened to him. Although I think he and others achieved huge changes through this approach.

And Lincoln was assassinated by someone who didn't want to see any form of reconstruction. But Reconstruction proceeded, and it's arguable that had Lincoln been at the help it would have gone differently, but it still went on. Just as I'm sure leaders, religious and otherwise, of stature carried the torch after Rev. King.

↑ 33055 ↓

Thu, Apr 30 2015, 9:57 am

PinkFridge wrote:

Since you asked twice, I will answer your question as to why riot in your own neighborhood. You get the government responses (cops/firemen) on your turf. There is an element of the mob mentality obviously. There is also the looters who exploit the situation for economic gain.

↑ mazal555

Thu, Apr 30 2015, 9:59 am

Why is everyone worrying about black babies born to single mothers? 40% of ALL babies born in the US in the last couple of years are born outside of marriage. Regardless of race. Why is it only a problem if they are black? Why isn't anyone complaining about the single white mothers? They are somehow more capable of raising their children without fathers?

These statistics also vary a lot by education. Since salaries for black people are still much lower than for white, it is harder for a black person to go to college. If you don't go to college in the US, there is a 71% chance you will have a baby outside of marriage. If you don't finish High School, there is an 87% chance you will. If you are born after 1985, there is a 64% chance. Regardless of race.

See http://www.slate.com/articles/......html

And I happen to not think the problem is slavery. I don't think black families are more dysfunctional than white families under the same circumstances. I think the problem is poverty. If you factor out income, I think you will probably find that black families are doing better than white families.

But, even if the problem is dysfunction, we are told that after 210 years of slavery the Jewish people had sunk to the 49th level of the 50 levels, so why should we expect anyone else to be different? A few years of slavery, although awful, is not the same culturally as 13-15 generations. Your grandmother in the camps still had her memories of how a family works, and a normal life, with 2 parents who weren't getting sold apart from each other. She knew what to aim for.

↑ PinkFridge ↓

Thu, Apr 30 2015, 11:37 am

Squishy wrote:

That is a technically correct answer to my question. (Reminds me of the joke about the Microsoft engineer answering a parachutist's question.) It doesn't answer my question.

And Mazal, interesting point about the percentage of babies born out of wedlock. The question is, how involved is the father afterwards, and what exposure to adult male role models do the children have. And of course, even in more optimal situations it's still not really optimal.

↑ Raisin ↓

Thu, Apr 30 2015, 11:49 am

mazal555 wrote:

Lots of babies are born to single mothers, but the parents might be living together and even get married later on. Or the father might be very involved in the childs life. Or as you said, poverty and education is a huge factor. And of course not all children born to poor uneducated single mothers will grow up to be criminals, but a larger proportion will.

Why are so many black families so poor? Its a combination of legacies of slavery, plus years after of Jim Crow laws and violence against blacks, plus the continued racism to this day. Black men are less likely to gain employment, will get more severe prison sentences, etc.

↑ 33055 ↓

Thu, Apr 30 2015, 12:19 pm

PinkFridge wrote:

Were you just asking rhetorically?

It is awful and they are destroying their own neighborhood, but there is a logical reason. This is seen over and over in the inner city riots.

By the way, I hope you don't think I am advocating this behavior. I am giving the technical answer as you say.

↑ PinkFridge ↓

Thu, Apr 30 2015, 12:29 pm

Squishy wrote:

Sigh. I don't know what kind of answer I was hoping for. You would just think that if they're so upset about the injustice they'd at least be more protective of their own and their most vulnerable.

↑ debsey ↓

Thu, Apr 30 2015, 1:06 pm

Squishy wrote:

Jews are never subject to racial discrimination? Wow, that's great news! Tell that to my grandmother, who came here after being slave labor in Siberia and faced signs on doors saying "No Jews or Irish need apply." or signs on BANKS saying "No Jews or Dogs allowed in here." This was as recent as 1949!
In the 1950s my parents were in Florida and they stopped at a motel and the guy said "We don't let Jews sleep in our motel!" No shame or fear to say this.
Do you really believe this, Squishy? That Jews don't face racial discrimination? I don't get how this whole "Jews don't face discrimination" narrative is being spouted mostly by JEWS.

↑ marina

Thu, Apr 30 2015, 1:16 pm

debsey wrote:

Jews are never subject to racial discrimination? Wow, that's great news! Tell that to my grandmother, who came here after being slave labor in Siberia and faced signs on doors saying "No Jews or Irish need apply." or signs on BANKS saying "No Jews or Dogs allowed in here." This was as recent as 1949!

In the 1950s my parents were in Florida and they stopped at a motel and the guy said "We don't let Jews sleep in our motel!" No shame or fear to say this.
Do you really believe this, Squishy? That Jews don't face racial discrimination? I don't get how this whole "Jews don't face discrimination" narrative is being spouted mostly by JEWS.

yeah, that's nice. Black people couldn't normally vote in many places for two decades later. VOTE. That means they couldn't have a say in what happens to them. Totally disenfranchised.

Jim Crow laws were in place LEGALLY until 1965. And then slowly society began to change. That's twenty years after your "recent" events.

↑ MagentaYenta ↓

Thu, Apr 30 2015, 2:07 pm

Rubber Ducky wrote:

There were several peaceful protests about the circumstances of Freddie Gray's death in the days before the riot.

Actually it was 6 whole days. The 300 men, Brother 2 Brother and over a hundred clergy (no rabbis), the NAACP all participated in peaceful demonstrations and reached out to the community. And no these groups did not spring out of nowhere to come alive after Freddies death, they were all active in the community prior to his demise.

Baltimore has a long sad history of racism, poverty and marginalization of the black community. Baltimore is the second most violent city in the US. With unusually high rates of unemployment over all. The rate in the African American community is double of that of the caucasian community in Baltimore. There have never been good economic times for African Americans in Baltimore. Redlining kept the African American community in ghettos and lasted longer in Baltimore than it did in other major US cities.

↑ debsey ↓

Thu, Apr 30 2015, 2:10 pm

marina wrote:

death is the ultimate disenfranchisement. The Holocaust was 70 years ago. Then those survivors came HERE and faced yet more discrimination. Discriminatory attitudes towards Jews are quite pervasive until today.
I am not drawing an exact parallel, nor is there any way to compare suffering - it is too subjective. But I consider it the ultimate in discrimination (and yes, in disenfranchisement - the removal of voice) to say "well Jews don't face discrimination." we certainly did and we certainly do.