Frum Survivor Sima tells her story publicly for the 1st time

Log in / Sign Up

List of Forums + New Post Recipe Box Usergroups Following My Posts Bookmarks

Private Messages Rules New User Guide FAQ Advertise Contact Us

Forum -> Interesting Discussions

Previous 1 2 3 8 9 10 11 Next

View latest: 24h 48h 72h

amother

↑ Vermilion ↓

Mon, Mar 30 2015, 12:18 am

amother wrote:

Tx for understanding, not judging and explaining.
I get your point. And that is / was my point too. We need to protect our kids. Educate them ! The schools haveto do their part too.

Can you explain to me what the blaming and shaming does? It doesn't get them off the street or into program! There r 1,000s of them around. Tell ur child don't go next to abc..... It's never ending, u'll never know all of them.... U need God to protect them.

If the victim wants to publish her story, kol h'kovod, but what is her aim her gain? (Recovery u only get by speaking to the proper ppl. )

I am working my program, and I don't forgive my abuser, but I got the sense of acceptance.

She wants to warn of the danger these sickos pose. She wants rabanim to take this seriously and not just shuffle the problem into a different community.

We can't force an addict into recovery, but we can help him hit rock bottom by putting him on trial and locking him up.

Do you have a better idea? Trial+jail serves the triple purpose of keeping him off the streets and away from our children, helping him hit rock bottom, and alerting people that he is a danger.

And true, we can never find and isolate every single molestor - the worst ones remain hidden for years - one less is many children saved!!! It's not perfect but it's better than nothing.

Don't you agree that if there's a relations offenders registry, (what you might consider shame and blame) we can avoid hiring such people to work with children? Isn't that at least one step towards keeping our children safer?

↑ imasoftov

Mon, Mar 30 2015, 5:01 am

amother wrote:

If she is a woman, that is.

That's not a particularly functional set of thoughts for a man, either.

amother

↑ Violet ↓

Mon, Mar 30 2015, 7:44 am

greenfire wrote:

NOBODY in the world is going to get up & embarrass themselves to say they were molested ... unless they actually were molested/raped

That is a very naive and false statement. Very outdated. I know someone who is doing that right now.

amother

Peach ↓

Mon, Mar 30 2015, 7:46 am

Learning wrote:

Who are you?? Why are you amother? Are you friends or family of the molester? The rabbis send him to therapy. If it wasn't true he wouldn't go hiding and omit his name from the website. There are other girls accusing him. The organization that set up this evening won't let her say it if it wasn't true.

Excuse me. Just because a girl says x, y,z happened to her does not mean they did. I am not saying that something did not happen but come on.. I was believing her until she named the four rabbis.. who by the way have a halachic responsibility here. Also, there was a territorial war of Chabad houses between her family and the chabad house of the abuser.. so she might be coming out with this to help her parents in that way. It's not hard to make up stories. Kids these days are not as innocent as they seem.

amother

↑ Peach ↓

Mon, Mar 30 2015, 7:47 am

amother wrote:

That is a very naive and false statement. Very outdated. I know someone who is doing that right now.

That isn't true. Many people have alterior motives to ruin other people and will do ANYTHING to do so.

amother

↑ Peach

Mon, Mar 30 2015, 7:48 am

amother wrote:

That is a very naive and false statement. Very outdated. I know someone who is doing that right now.

I agree with this statement.

amother

↑ Aubergine ↓

Mon, Mar 30 2015, 7:54 am

No I'm not a man.
I don't think I come across as one in any which way, its amazing how ppl here jump to conclusions so quickly without giving it thought.
Everything I wrote I thought through first.
I admit, I may have been wrong though.
Thank G-d I never actually had to deal with a molester. They are ill and they need to be taken care of and off the streets. I thought I made that clear clear clear.
Maybe every single victim really is 100% innocent.
Who knows.
I can be wrong, I hope I'm wrong, and I'll try not to come to conclusions on matters I'm not fully familiar with.

But the way ppl attack here is incredible.

The way ppl twist what mothers here say is saddening as well.

Nothing of my post was aimed at Sima's case except that I was happy she came out and spoke up.

The rest was based on overall observations of victimization, but again, dear me, I've been unanimously voted wrong. That's OK. I can retract my opinion.

↑ Raisin

Mon, Mar 30 2015, 7:58 am

amother wrote:

if there was a territorial war, why did her parents hire the abuser to work for them? Or did the territorial war occur AFTER he was accused and fired?

amother

↑ Violet ↓

Mon, Mar 30 2015, 8:05 am

amother wrote:

That isn't true. Many people have alterior motives to ruin other people and will do ANYTHING to do so.

Maybe I wasn't clear. I am agreeing with you. There are many people who make false accusations for many different reasons, some of them malicious. And I know someone who is making malicious, false accusations right now, publicly speaking about it, and the JCW is supporting him/her.

amother

↑ Violet ↓

Mon, Mar 30 2015, 8:22 am

ora_43 wrote:

I don't want to add fuel to what some of the amothers here are saying, since they are way off base. But - what you're saying is not right, either. It would be nice if professionals had some way to determine who's telling the truth for sure, but all they can do is weed out most of the people who are deliberately lying.

There have been people who went through the system and were jailed for rape, and only set free decades later thanks to DNA evidence. They were jailed despite the involvement of professionals.

It's important to note that those cases were very very different from this case. Those people were convicted due to unintentional untruths, not deliberate lies. Victims falsely identifying a rapist tends to happen when the rapist is a stranger, not when it's someone they know. And many changes have been made to the system to prevent people from being falsely jailed for molestation.

(People falsely claiming to be victims is also a real thing, but in cases like that they almost never accuse a real, live person. They tend to be suffering from a form of attention-seeking mental disorder, but are not malicious and don't want to harm anyone.)

My point is - it's very very unlikely that an innocent would be accused of a s-x crime and end up in jail. And it's stupid to be so afraid of convicting an innocent person that we never convict anyone. As harsh as it is, better to have a dozen innocent people in jail, than to have thousands of dangerous rapists running around free.

But it would be dangerous to say "justice will set the record straight," because when justice has set the record straight, it was only thanks to those people who were willing to believe that an injustice might have occurred. IOW we have to recognize that the system is fallible in order to keep the system working.

A few points. Firstly, many false accusations are aimed at living, breathing persons. And it is often malicious. The case I am involved with has the so-called victim having a personality disorder. This person has a long history of making all sorts of accusations about many different people often with malicious intent.

Secondly, the person who is being falsely accused, is not so worried about the court system, because the false accusation isn't even prosecutable. (Unless the "victim" changes the story.) The fear is that the "victim" is going around publicly and on the internet with JCWs support talking about her so clled "abuse". There are no names mentioned but the worry is that once the victim establishes "cred", they can then "out" the accused name and now that person was already judged on the public stage without a chance of self defense before the public even knew who was being accused.

Chayalle

Mon, Mar 30 2015, 8:24 am

amother wrote:

How do you know, for sure, that the accusations are false, malicious, etc...

amother

↑ Violet ↓

Mon, Mar 30 2015, 8:37 am

Chayalle wrote:

How do you know, for sure, that the accusations are false, malicious, etc...

Because this person has an established pattern of behavior and the story isn't consistent/doesn't make much sense and the accused denied it. I have talked this person down before, when He/ she wanted to make accusations that had no basis, this time regarding their child. About Malicious, it depends on how you interpret it. The intent is definitely to cause harm, but the underlying reason is that this person has BPD and feels this is leverage for him/herself to use when they feel that people are "abandoning" them. Do some research on BPD and Distortion campaigns. There is a series of steps and a method and it is being followed to the T.

amother

↑ Cyan ↓

Mon, Mar 30 2015, 8:40 am

The JCW does not put up names only after they have investigated the claim completely. I'm sure they know very well what's at stake. They have Rabbanim that back them up and I trust them. We now have an organization that makes pedophiles think twice. If Levitansky claims that they are false accusation I'm sure he will sue. I'm waiting to hear his side of the story PUBLICLY.

amother

↑ Violet ↓

Mon, Mar 30 2015, 8:42 am

amother wrote:

Not on their wall of shame. But they don't do any fact checking before harassing and spreading lies in other ways. This is only because they are worried about lawsuits.

amother

↑ Cyan ↓

Mon, Mar 30 2015, 8:45 am

amother wrote:

Not on their wall of shame. But they don't do any fact checking before harassing and spreading lies in other ways. This is only because they are worried about lawsuits.

Spreading lies where? What are you talking about?

amother

↑ Cyan ↓

Mon, Mar 30 2015, 8:47 am

amother wrote:

Not on their wall of shame. But they don't do any fact checking before harassing and spreading lies in other ways. This is only because they are worried about lawsuits.

So you are saying that if its on the wall they are not afraid of a law suit because they have enough proof. Correct me if I'm wrong.

fmt4 ↓

Mon, Mar 30 2015, 8:53 am

amother wrote:

Oh yea for sure. She's going to announce to a room full of people a horrific humiliating and painful story in order to help her parents with their Chabad house. ARE YOU INSANE??? You are a sick disturbed individual, and are definitely connected to the family of the accused. No one wants to hear your disgusting ridiculous accusations which are so typical of those who cover up abuse. It's time to stop.

Last edited by fmt4 on Mon, Mar 30 2015, 8:54 am; edited 1 time in total

amother

↑ Cyan

Mon, Mar 30 2015, 8:54 am

http://www.jewishcommunitywatch.org
Thank you for being there for us. You have my support.

amother

↑ Violet ↓

Mon, Mar 30 2015, 8:55 am

amother wrote:

So you are saying that if its on the wall they are not afraid of a law suit because they have enough proof. Correct me if I'm wrong.

Most likely, yes. Unless, they feel that someone won't bring a lawsuit for other reasons, maybe. It used to not be this way until they were threatened with lawsuits. If you notice, most of the people who are on the wall are formally accused, has charges filed against them and/or convicted. (but just because someone has charges filed against them, it does not mean they are guilty)

amother

↑ Violet ↓

Mon, Mar 30 2015, 9:01 am

fmt4 wrote:

And some people are sick and tired of being in the pedos camp by bringing awareness that false accusations happen and that it is a reality and that there is no proof beyond a reasonable doubt that this occurred. This doesn't mean that we support predators. And that we are sick people who are "obviously" best fiends and close family to the accused. By the way, I don't have an opinion in this case. I am not discrediting her story or supporting it, because I am humble enough to say I DON'T KNOW.

Page 9 of 11

Previous 1 2 3 8 9 10 11 Next