chassidish women fasting?

Sherri ↓

Mon, Sep 21 2009, 9:50 am

bubby wrote:

Having said that, I'm so stuffed I can do without eating today. And I'm going to the Ohel this morning so I won't eat anyway. So I'm not taking my meds Confused

You don't eat when you go to the Ohel? Or do you mean that you're busy this morning anyway and won't end up eating?

NotInNJMommy ↓

Mon, Sep 21 2009, 9:52 am

Sherri wrote:

bubby wrote:

Having said that, I'm so stuffed I can do without eating today. And I'm going to the Ohel this morning so I won't eat anyway. So I'm not taking my meds Confused

You don't eat when you go to the Ohel? Or do you mean that you're busy this morning anyway and won't end up eating?

There's an inyan to fast before going to the Ohel.

↑ Sherri ↓

Mon, Sep 21 2009, 9:56 am

NotInNJMommy wrote:

Sherri wrote:

bubby wrote:

Having said that, I'm so stuffed I can do without eating today. And I'm going to the Ohel this morning so I won't eat anyway. So I'm not taking my meds Confused

You don't eat when you go to the Ohel? Or do you mean that you're busy this morning anyway and won't end up eating?

There's an inyan to fast before going to the Ohel.

Interesting. I never heard of this. Is it meant specifically for Lubavitcher chassidim (like Lubavitch minhag), or is it preferred that anyone who goes should fast? (Like by the Satmar Rebbe's tzion, all women regardless of usual personal attire, should wear stockings of a certain denier...)

↑ bubby ↓

Mon, Sep 21 2009, 9:58 am

Sherri wrote:

NotInNJMommy wrote:

Sherri wrote:

bubby wrote:

Having said that, I'm so stuffed I can do without eating today. And I'm going to the Ohel this morning so I won't eat anyway. So I'm not taking my meds Confused

You don't eat when you go to the Ohel? Or do you mean that you're busy this morning anyway and won't end up eating?

There's an inyan to fast before going to the Ohel.

I don't know about non-Lubavitchers not fasting, it's probably not mentioned unless a Shliach is bringing a group & he goes through the minhagim with his people. I didn't know about the stockings by the Satmar Rebbe's Tzion...how is that monitored? I assume non-Satmar people also go there. Does Satmar also have the minhag not wear leather shoes by the Kever, as we do by the Ohel? At the Ohel there are crocs in every size for those who don't bring their own (but I am wearing my non-leather, leather-look pumps, I hate wearing any shoes other people have worn.)

Last edited by bubby on Mon, Sep 21 2009, 10:03 am; edited 1 time in total

Atali ↓

Mon, Sep 21 2009, 9:59 am

shalhevet wrote:

Ruchel wrote:

Nu... Dutch wait only 1 hour between meat and milk, (most) Sefardim eat kitniot on Pessach, and many chassidish groups hold women only fast tisha beav and Kippur.

One has nothing to do with the other. But if I write why I won't be popular around here. (Hint: the first two minhagim are in full accordance with the SA.)

Shalhevet,

I was going to say this on the Nishmat thread but since you brought it up again here I will say it here.

Unless you have learned Shas and poskim thoroughly (which based on the fact that you don't believe in women learning gemara I can safely assume you haven't), I don't see how you are in the position to say that another rav's psak halacha is not in accordance with poskim.

Have you learned through all the piskei halacha throughout the generations related to fasting? I assume not. Therefore, you cannot say that the chassidishe rabbonim who pasken that women don't have to fast (or for that matter, the rabbonim who pasken that women can learn gemara) are going against halacha simply because they pasken differently than your rabbonim.

The only exception that I see to this is something that so clearly seems to defy halachic logic (such as going mixed swimming wearing a bathing suit), but there are very few things that really fall into that category.

Oh, and I am fasting today.

Last edited by Atali on Mon, Sep 21 2009, 9:59 am; edited 1 time in total

↑ NotInNJMommy ↓

Mon, Sep 21 2009, 10:01 am

Sherri wrote:

Is there supposed to be an answer to that? Confused.

There is a view that going to the Ohel (for a chassid) is like yechidus. Fasting is part of several preparations for yechidus. It's not so much davka fasting, but to not eat before you've completed the visit.

↑ Sherri ↓

Mon, Sep 21 2009, 10:03 am

NotInNJMommy wrote:

Sherri wrote:

Is there supposed to be an answer to that? Confused.

(I asked that because Bubby just quoted without adding anything.)

What's yechidus?

↑ NotInNJMommy

Mon, Sep 21 2009, 10:07 am

Sherri wrote:

NotInNJMommy wrote:

Sherri wrote:

Is there supposed to be an answer to that? Confused.

(I asked that because Bubby just quoted without adding anything.)

What's yechidus?

There is an idea that a one-on-one meeting with a Chassidishe Rebbe is more than a physical interaction, but there is a spiritual connection as well. Yechidus is like "yachid" being one/unified spiritually. So, there are customs set down to prepare one for this both physical and spiritual experience. again,t hese are customs not halachah.

↑ bubby ↓

Mon, Sep 21 2009, 10:08 am

Yechidus is where people had private audiences with the Rebbe at certain times...like before a Chasaneh, going on shlichus, or some other milestone. We were never Zocheh to that, but we were Zocheh to speak to the Rebbe at "Dollars" etc. My father ZT"L received a special Bracha from the Rebbe at Kos Shel Bracha after Shavuous one year.

sarahd ↓

Mon, Sep 21 2009, 10:08 am

Atali wrote:

shalhevet wrote:

Ruchel wrote:

Nu... Dutch wait only 1 hour between meat and milk, (most) Sefardim eat kitniot on Pessach, and many chassidish groups hold women only fast tisha beav and Kippur.

One has nothing to do with the other. But if I write why I won't be popular around here. (Hint: the first two minhagim are in full accordance with the SA.)

My sentiments exactly. (Except I'm not fasting today. Wink

)

↑ sarahd ↓

Mon, Sep 21 2009, 10:11 am

bubby wrote:

Sherri wrote:

NotInNJMommy wrote:

Sherri wrote:

bubby wrote:

Having said that, I'm so stuffed I can do without eating today. And I'm going to the Ohel this morning so I won't eat anyway. So I'm not taking my meds Confused

You don't eat when you go to the Ohel? Or do you mean that you're busy this morning anyway and won't end up eating?

There's an inyan to fast before going to the Ohel.

There's a sign in front of the ohel asking that women with less than 70(?) denier stockings not go into the ohel, and it's expected that people will act in accordance. (Ironically, when my family was there for my uncle's hakomas matzeivah, the only one of us women not from the immediate family who could go into the kever was the least chareidi of my aunts, who happens to suffer from terrible varicose veins and always wears surgical stockings...)

↑ Sherri ↓

Mon, Sep 21 2009, 10:13 am

bubby wrote:

First of all, when people met with the Rebbe not yechidus, who was there, just gabbaim or in public?
And how did one get an appointment?
And how did the Rebbe have time to speak to one at Dollars?
(And you still fast before going to the Ohel?)

Thanks in advance for answering all this!

↑ sarahd ↓

Mon, Sep 21 2009, 10:13 am

First Lady wrote:

Depends which Chassidus. And depends if the woman is pregnant or nursing.
Some like Skvere and Vizhnitz are extremely lenient for pregnant and nursing women.

How lenient do you have to be for pregnant and nursing women? I would think you would have to be very machmir to require that a pregnant or nursing woman fast, when it says in the SA that she doesn't have to. I think you mean that they're lenient about non-pregnant and -nursing women.

↑ Atali ↓

Mon, Sep 21 2009, 10:15 am

sarahd wrote:

First Lady wrote:

Depends which Chassidus. And depends if the woman is pregnant or nursing.
Some like Skvere and Vizhnitz are extremely lenient for pregnant and nursing women.

Some rabbonim are more machmir in some instances. When I was only nursing my five-month-old once per day, I asked a rav about fasting and was told to fast on 10 teves (this was in Australia, where 10 teves is in the middle of the summer)

↑ bubby ↓

Mon, Sep 21 2009, 10:19 am

Sherri wrote:

Yechidus was private...no gabbaim/secretaries etc.

Yes, you made an appointment & if you got one @ 3 :00AM...you were there!

At Dollars it was super-fast, you had to spit out quickly what you wanted to say so as not to cause the Rebbe to stand a second longer than necessary. Some people, though, esp. dignitaries, took longer.

Yes, I'm fasting...gotta run to pick up my passengers! I'll check this thread later, very informative & interesting.