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-> Chinuch, Education & Schooling
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amother
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 Sun, Dec 04 2011, 7:32 pm
| AliG wrote: | I am not in Brooklyn. I am in Miami Beach. If you move here, your welcomed to join.
The cost is half the local tuitions for now. It depends on how many students we get and our location (rent, etc). I am volunteering my time and efforts to gather all the curriculum and resources for the grade. The plan is to hire two teachers, one for secular and one for Judaics. Again, the goal, with Hashem's help, is to provide very strong levels of education but also to reduce the cost of the tuition. The way to do this is through everyone paying their part. It may be actually more expensive for several people as they may not pay even half the tuition of the other schools. I am not complaining or resentful to those schools, I have compassion on them for the situation they are in and their need to charge 12K plus a student. But I am very interested in children learning in smaller groups and developing an educational initiative this way.
This doesn't take a masters of education. It takes initiative and motivation. I am sure if a group of parents got together in whatever city you live in, you could pull this off. It means hiring great teachers, figuring how much everyone can afford and seeing if you can match the curriculum and resources needed. I haven't done it yet but friends of mine have and they say they are within budget. Further, I would like to add that this really isn't for every student and my kids will certainly miss out on the larger school experience if this doesn't work out. There will be big things that schools give kids, like the greater energy and seviva of the school that my kids won't have. So I am not saying this is the ultimate solution. I am sure it is better for all yiddishe kinder to go to school together and see beautiful teachers being marbeetz Torah and showing their love for Torah. But there is a reality to our lives these days and this may be an alternative for now. |
fooey. I was getting hopeful. I don't think I could do this here. the brooklyn people are very wary of being different. no one wants to be the first one to go outside the box and whenever I have tried it I get baffled stares in response. you should have seen the responses I have been getting making in quiries about homeschooling from people in y community. "what would you want to do THAT for. VEEERRY unusual." and no, no one I asked knows anyone who has done it.
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amother
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Sun, Dec 04 2011, 7:41 pm
| amother wrote: |
fooey. I was getting hopeful. I don't think I could do this here. the brooklyn people are very wary of being different. no one wants to be the first one to go outside the box and whenever I have tried it I get baffled stares in response. you should have seen the responses I have been getting making in quiries about homeschooling from people in y community. "what would you want to do THAT for. VEEERRY unusual." and no, no one I asked knows anyone who has done it. |
We homeschooled our children and threatening calls from concerned neighbors wanting to report us to ACS even though we filled out all the proper paperwork with the local school district. But when a kid is busy being a bully and hurting other kids, no one threatens to report him to ACS because he is in school and conforming.
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AliG
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Sun, Dec 04 2011, 7:45 pm
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There will always be resistance for something that is unknown. And I have enough humility to say that I am not 100% confident it is the best solution. However, I have taught and do know that children can do exceptionally well in small groups (as opposed to 25 to 30 kids per class). Of course there is resistance but I am moving beyond that and trying to find a reasonable solution for the situation here. Don't be discouraged and have your family and your needs as primary. We don't have the class yet. We are still looking for a few great kids to join....
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amother
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Sun, Dec 04 2011, 7:59 pm
| OPINIONATED wrote: | | AliG wrote: | I am not in Brooklyn. I am in Miami Beach. If you move here, your welcomed to join.
I have compassion on them for the situation they are in and their need to charge 12K plus a student.ultimate solution. |
Is this elementary school? |
Yes, that is the cost of full tuition here in Miami Beach. Many, many families get a significant break.
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chocolate moose
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Sun, Dec 04 2011, 8:20 pm
I'm not supermom. I'm not saying that I did everything with dignity and aplomb. I just did what I had to do. And I think it boded well with my own kids who saw a good work ethic and emulated it.
Tuition costs are not likely to change. Don't our schools say that tuition only covers a certain percentage of what it actually costs to educate our kids anyway? They are forever fundraising for teachers' salaries and our expenses. I think our rebbies and morahs deserve a decent wage, and I think our kids need a hot lunch and buses and modern textbooks. None of that stuff is free.
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amother
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Sun, Dec 04 2011, 10:12 pm
expenses tend to rack up in other areas. garbage bags, plastic plates ect....you cannot tell me that there is nowhere at all the school can cut. franlky especially in high school. when I was in high school, we did not need spanish in 10th grade if we were learning it no other time. we didn't need chumash as well as nosim b'chumash, ect.......and the problem with what you say about things costing is thatthey have a captive clientelle. anything else in life, if we can't afford we do without or go for a cheaper alternative. here we are basicly forced by propriety to buy a service we can't afford, and pay employees we can't afford to hire. just because they deserve it doesn't mean I'm able to pay it......and yes you were supermom. not everyone is able to do what you did, with or without grace. some people simply don't have that kind of energy or orginizational skills. and its frustrating as heck because whenever I say something like that, I find those who do manage to do it all look down on me and assume im making excuses because I don't want to do the hard work, have a poor work ethic and want things in life for free. but thats not true. I do the best I can, you were able to do better. good for you, but thats not a reflection on me. (and im saying that to all those out there who react that way, I'm not saying you think that). the fact is hashem didn't make people in a factory. we all have different skills and abilities, and just because administrators say I must do something doesn't mean I'm able to do it. they hold the future of our children in their hands. they put a price down of what our childrens' future costs and then what happens if you can't pay it? if we put our children in public schools guess who gets villified?
not every frum family can make 3 times the national average income to support a moderate sized brood. as much as they deserve it, I can't pay it. parnassa is in G-od's hands.
and you can't tell me nothing can be cut. who says kids need hot lunches? whats wrong with brown bagging nutricious cold lunches? whats wrong with parents sponsoring paper and plastic lunch utensils for the child's class here and there? to provide it for 30 kids once a year is no big cost but if the school doesn't have to provide it every day for 300 kids thats more money in the bank. whats wrong with other parents sponsering a pack of garbage bags for their childs classroom every month. another parent can send in the chalk, if they still use that. maybe schools don't need to spend money on smartboards. maybe the old chalkboards work just fine. again, cheap one at a time, but not insignificant for a whole school over the cost of a year. why not have the kids pitch in with things like painting the classrooms before school? it would be fun, and free.....the schools also have to think outside the box. cutting small expenses can make a big difference in their ability to help poor families. and considering the humiliating incredibly detailed questionaires we have to fill out just to get an appointment to discuss a break, how we have to justify every purchase and financial decision as though all our money is already theirs and they can decide how much we deserve to keep, why don't we get to analyze where all the money they insist they need is being spent. why don't we get to ask how they use the money they squeeze out of us on pain of our childrens' humiliation?
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amother
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Sun, Dec 04 2011, 10:24 pm
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there are no easy answers. the staff at hotels deserve great pay and all their tips. but thats why I don't go to hotels. however if we are expected to give our children a jewish education, the powers that be have to make that education accessible and affordable for every child, or the community will have to learn to be open and accepting of frum kids who go to public school. How many precious jewish neshomos will never be born because their parents couldn't pay tuition for the children that came before them and were afraid of having to support another jewish child? this isn't right. I'm not saying I have all the answers but I know this can't be right. all the complaining in years past about wedding expenses....who on earth can marry off children after putting them through school. I am baffled that anyone but the wealthiest among us can pay tuitions, then seminary and yeshivah and then make chasunahs and not end up in ruin. im starting to think frumkeit, beginning with a frum education, is a way pf life designed for the rich, and im setting myself up for ruin by living it. its a terrifying thought. I dont see a way out
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amother
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Sun, Dec 04 2011, 10:48 pm
| amother wrote: | | amother wrote: |
fooey. I was getting hopeful. I don't think I could do this here. the brooklyn people are very wary of being different. no one wants to be the first one to go outside the box and whenever I have tried it I get baffled stares in response. you should have seen the responses I have been getting making in quiries about homeschooling from people in y community. "what would you want to do THAT for. VEEERRY unusual." and no, no one I asked knows anyone who has done it. |
We homeschooled our children and threatening calls from concerned neighbors wanting to report us to ACS even though we filled out all the proper paperwork with the local school district. But when a kid is busy being a bully and hurting other kids, no one threatens to report him to ACS because he is in school and conforming. |
are you in brooklyn?
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AztecQueen2000
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Sun, Dec 04 2011, 10:56 pm
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I am also in the BP/Flatbush area. My girls are 5 and 3 and have never been to school at all. We spend about an hour and a half a day on academics (kodesh and secular) and the rest of the day is spent on field trips, art projects, special classes etc. If you are interested, PM me.
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amother
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Sun, Dec 04 2011, 11:24 pm
| amother wrote: | | I am baffled that anyone but the wealthiest among us can pay tuitions, then seminary and yeshivah and then make chasunahs and not end up in ruin. im starting to think frumkeit, beginning with a frum education, is a way pf life designed for the rich, and im setting myself up for ruin by living it. its a terrifying thought. I dont see a way out |
ITA. It's really frightening to look at the big picture and see so many families struggling because there doesn't seem to be a choice.
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gold21
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Mon, Dec 05 2011, 12:13 am
yes, it is insanely expensive to raise a frum family.
dont ask me where people get their money from.... I dunno.... 
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Depressed
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Mon, Dec 05 2011, 12:56 am
| amother wrote: | I don't know where you live but are your schools more expensive than other areas? Would it make sense to move just for this? I don't mean to Israel where it's pretty much free because that's a huge move, but in brooklyn I know it's a lot cheaper than other areas. Lkwd too I think.
(Sorry if it's a crazy idea) |
For one, its murder getting children into schools in Lakewood, money aside. DO NOT MOVE THERE unless a school will give you in writing that they are accepting your child...
For two, the limudi chol is abysmal, meaning that most of the children here do not know what abysmal means. So unless,you want your children to be even poorer then you, think long and hard before moving here....
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leomom
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Mon, Dec 05 2011, 1:29 am
Also look into Room613.
How old are your children? You might also benefit from just adapting your expectations to the reality of homeschooling if you choose that route (which I recommend!). It doesn't mean school at home. It's different for everyone. And with young kids, it's flexible and fun.
Plus - I think a freelancer has the best mindset/personality for homeschooling! Homeschooling is NOT a job in the sense that Dolly said. It's a life. With your children around a lot. Learning and playing. And send them to activities and tutors if you like, to give yourself a break. You'll feel so liberated being able to afford to do fun things and extras when there's no giant tuition bill hanging over your head!
(By the way, Dolly, you've made such a convincing and well-argued case for homeschooling, you do sound like you've had experience yourself!)
Last edited by leomom on Mon, Dec 05 2011, 1:38 am; edited 1 time in total
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Dolly Welsh
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Mon, Dec 05 2011, 1:51 am
| yy wrote: | Also look into Room613.
How old are your children? You might also benefit from just adapting your expectations to the reality of homeschooling if you choose that route (which I recommend!). It doesn't mean school at home. It's different for everyone. And with young kids, it's flexible and fun.
Plus - I think a freelancer has the best mindset/personality for homeschooling! Homeschooling is NOT a job in the sense that Dolly said. It's a life. With your children around a lot. Learning and playing. And send them to activities and tutors if you like, to give yourself a break. You'll feel so liberated being able to afford to do fun things and extras when there's no giant tuition bill hanging over your head!
(By the way, Dolly, you've made such a convincing and well-argued case for homeschooling, you do sound like you've had experience yourself!) |
I sort of have, but only as a supplement to regular schooling, never completely instead of it. I have never been in OP's situation. I am not against regular schools! But they teach to the norm, the class average, quite properly, except for "gifted" programs. If you want more than average results, you have to provide more yourself. I privately think most of what people know they have learned at home. We have all seen that people often go into their parents' professions. It is under their fingernails. They learned without knowing they were learning, the best and easiest way to learn.
Have you homeschooled?
Yes, one develops the knack of evaluating everything, every hardware store, for potential teaching materials and play things. You come to see ordinary things in a new way. And the websites. And the reading materials strategically left lying around the house, for a child to just pick up and get into by herself.
As for socialization, surely there are playgroups that can be joined, for that part of it.
Your link to Room613 http://www.room613.net/members/room613 is very interesting! OP, it's about Torah homeschooling. There may be many others also.
Last edited by Dolly Welsh on Mon, Dec 05 2011, 2:24 am; edited 3 times in total
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leomom
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Mon, Dec 05 2011, 1:54 am
| Dolly Welsh wrote: |
Have you homeschooled?
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Yes, I homeschool.
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Dolly Welsh
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Mon, Dec 05 2011, 1:57 am
Well, OP, there you are. Somebody here who does this. AztecQueen2000 also does, she says, above.
Last edited by Dolly Welsh on Mon, Dec 05 2011, 2:22 am; edited 2 times in total
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leomom
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Mon, Dec 05 2011, 2:19 am
OP can come read lots of threads about homeschooling in the homeschooling forum on imamother.
Room613 also has discussion boards for Jewish homeschoolers. There's really plenty of support out there and lots of frum families who are happily homeschooling.
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leomom
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Mon, Dec 05 2011, 2:20 am
Nope, there aren't any others. 
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amother
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Mon, Dec 05 2011, 2:23 am
YY ....yet .
Its being worked on as we speak.. My website will blow you away when its finished..
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