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Forum
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-> Simcha Section
Mimisinger
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 Tue, Dec 16 2008, 11:40 am
It's not our minhag, personally I have such issues with people not thinking we're frum b/c of not doing it. It stated off as a chassidish minhag and all of a sudden everyone's adopted it.
Anyway, we'll have a party, and I didn't even think of the tzitzis/kippah bit yet. I guess we'll fit it all in somehow. G-D willing he'll be potty trained by then.
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elf123
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Tue, Dec 16 2008, 12:10 pm
| Mimisinger wrote: | It's not our minhag, personally I have such issues with people not thinking we're frum b/c of not doing it. It stated off as a chassidish minhag and all of a sudden everyone's adopted it.
Anyway, we'll have a party, and I didn't even think of the tzitzis/kippah bit yet. I guess we'll fit it all in somehow. G-D willing he'll be potty trained by then. |
I agree, it is a minhag that has of late (probably this generation) been "adopted" by almost everyone. When my first DS was starting to look straggly-haired, and I told DH, "Now we need to decide if we're cutting it or not" (It wasn't his parents minhag, but all of his siblings did it anyway with their sons), he asked a shaila. Now I won't name names, but the Rav he asked is considered a gadol, and he told him the following: "It's a chassidishe and sephardic minhag. (we are neither). And my father (who was one of "THE" gedolei hador -- okay, now you can probably figure out who I'm talking about) cut my hair when I was one year old.
So we immediately cut DS's hair, and from then on, when asked, I would say "If it's good enough for R.___, it's good enough for me!!!!"
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zaq
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Tue, Dec 16 2008, 12:17 pm
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No one in our family ever has or ever does, in fact I never even heard of such a thing till a friend in college mentioned that her nephew was having one.
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manhattanmom
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Tue, Dec 16 2008, 12:39 pm
You could still make a "turning 3--yarmulke, tzitzis, etc." party.
My parents cut my brother's hair before he was 3. It was a cute style--not very short like you associate with an upsherin type of cut. We don't have the minhag and his hair was long and nobody had patience (my mother or my brother) to let anyone deal with it. When he turned 3 and put on a yarmulka and tzitzis we made a little bit of a big deal.
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bandcm
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Tue, Dec 16 2008, 12:51 pm
A custom originating with the Muslims?
How does that fit in with the custom originating with Chassidim?
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sky
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Tue, Dec 16 2008, 12:57 pm
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We make a wimple party some where around age 3.
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HindaRochel
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Tue, Dec 16 2008, 12:57 pm
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Nope we didn't do a thing.
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stem
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Tue, Dec 16 2008, 1:29 pm
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We don't have a minhag to let the hair grow, but I don't cut it in a short boy-hair style till he turns 3. Then we give him payos, yarmulka and tzitzis if he's toilet trained. It's very exciting for the boy, and the long hair down to the waist is an aspect we do not miss at all. It really bothers me when people take on minhagim just because they think it's cute.
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Hashem_Yaazor
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Tue, Dec 16 2008, 1:37 pm
It was instituted I think by R' Shlomo Alcabes which is why Sefardim do it, and since it's based on kabbalistic reasoning, chassidim also adopted it.
My family background is Yekkish/Litvish on my side and Litvish on my husband's. We don't do it. Although in E"Y we probably would since it's become "minhag hamakom". Most of our peers do, but we don't. I have actually had a few people comment on my tiny 3 year old (who happens to be not yet 2!!) He wears a yarmulka because his older brother does, and I'm not going to take it away. My older son started wearing a yarmulka a few months before he turned 3 because he wanted to, and I figured it's easier to get a willing child to wear it then impose it on him. Tzitzis came around sukkos time when he was a few months over 3 and was more ably handling the bathroom (going standing most of the time, etc)
We didn't have any party for any birthdays.
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Hashem_Yaazor
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Tue, Dec 16 2008, 2:53 pm
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Skverer Chassidim do upsherin at 2?!
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Mama Bear
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Tue, Dec 16 2008, 3:01 pm
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yep! in skver the upsherin is done at age 2.
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sruth1
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Tue, Dec 16 2008, 3:01 pm
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My husbands family does but my family does not, it is not the Brisker minhag to do this. I also know that Yekies also don't have upsherins.
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Twizzlers
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Tue, Dec 16 2008, 4:10 pm
I married a yekke. We do not do upsherin, my 2 year old has had a handful of haircuts already (but the cute type without a yarmulka)
At age 3/when the child is trained, we will do a wimpel and a small party along with it.
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dilego
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Tue, Dec 16 2008, 4:11 pm
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Yekkes really dont have this minhag,although here in E.Y.most do it.Our Rav in switzerland cut his sons hair as soon as it gets in the way,He is litwish
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sympa
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Wed, Dec 17 2008, 8:20 am
| Twizzlers wrote: | I married a yekke. We do not do upsherin, my 2 year old has had a handful of haircuts already (but the cute type without a yarmulka)
At age 3/when the child is trained, we will do a wimpel and a small party along with it. |
What's a "wimpel"?
The first time I saw it in this thread, I thought it was a typo for "simple" 
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Marion
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Wed, Dec 17 2008, 8:21 am
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The wimple is from the bris, no?
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sympa
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Wed, Dec 17 2008, 8:38 am
| normama wrote: |
and DH is SUPER against upsherin, if you trace back the history it's actually something
that started with Muslims. we just copied them.
I'm sure you'll all eat me for that, but really, do your homework, this is not a longstanding tradition. |
| Quote: | | It does not seem very clear, however, that either of these theories is altogether satisfactory. Is it not more probable that we have in this Moslem custom another Jewish element in Islam connected with the Old Testament doctrine of sacrifice, especially the redemption of the first-born? (Compare Exodus XIII: 11-22 XXXIV: 19.) If in addition to all the resemblances to the Jewish practice already noted further testimony were necessary, it would be sufficient to refer to the statement made in the commentary of Al Buchari as the key to this true Sunna of the Prophet: "For the female child one ewe - and this abrogates the saying of those who disapprove a sacrifice for a girl - as did the Jews, who only made 'aqiqa for boys." (On the authority of 'Araki in Tirmidhi - Fath-ul-Bari V.390.) |
http://sufibrighton.com/Animism/chap5d.htm
The whole article is a little long to copy, but if you're interested, you can read it. Anyway, the part I quoted implies that Muslims wonder whether they got their equivalent "minhag" (aqaqi is the first Muslim haircut, and it's only for boys) from the JEWS! So, I guess it's neither here-nor-there, like so many things in history.
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normama
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Wed, Dec 17 2008, 8:51 am
it's funny, cuz even though we're not doing upsherin, I will be cutting DS's hair
cuz now he has kindof a bowl cut, and his hair is thick and won't hold a kippa on!
so we'll give him a big boy hair cut (not at the party, just sometime soon)
and give him a yarmulke and tzitzis. he's very excited.
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Hashem_Yaazor
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Wed, Dec 17 2008, 11:50 am
Shmuel Hanavi is a "prophet" for Muslims, so going to his kever and deriving the minhag from Arabic customs can have some connections.
Apparently, there is no real source for 3, and that's why Skverer (and some other) chassidim do it at 2 because that's the age a child is weaned and is no longer a baby who nurses (again, shaychus to Shmuel Hanavi).
My husband says that Rav Chaim Kanievsky doesn't really think too highly of this as a mainstream minhag.
A wimpel is the cloth used from the bris which in Minhag Ashkenaz (read: German/"Yekkish") shuls many times is later wrapped around the Torah, often by the bar mitzvah of the boy it was used for.
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