I don't get it; how do people survive?

amother

↑ Steelblue

Wed, Aug 21 2024, 3:46 pm

amother Powderblue wrote:

Why are Americans complaining about taxes? You have some of the lowest taxes in the world

Tax rates are high for high earners though. And then we still have to lay out approximately 25k a year in health costs. And social benefits are minimal.

amother

DarkRed

Wed, Aug 21 2024, 4:02 pm

amother OP wrote:

Financially?
With a $3000 to $5000 morgage. And by the way, where can you find a normal size house these days with a $3000 morgage?
Food, tuition, insurance. And then add all the extras.
Even with both parents working, they are making $120 combined? It doesn't add up.
How on earth do people survive?

I’ve been wondering the same thing!! I have no idea how people r doing it! We r drowning in debt!!! It gets worse by the day. And this is without any luxuries. I can’t even afford a cleaning lady which a lot of ppl consider a necessity

amother

Moccasin ↓

Wed, Aug 21 2024, 6:12 pm

amother Firethorn wrote:

We are making 150k combined (before tax) in a rental with 2 kids and it's impossible. Can't pay bills

You are scaring me. Is this what I’m in for? One baby
Why can’t you pay bills? Always thought 150k is nice for a small family

amother

↑ Offwhite

Wed, Aug 21 2024, 6:15 pm

amother Moccasin wrote:

You are scaring me. Is this what I’m in for? One baby
Why can’t you pay bills? Always thought 150k is nice for a small family

Everyones finances are different. I have 3 kids and am getting by fine with that income.

amother

Gray

Wed, Aug 21 2024, 6:49 pm

Don't freak out. Everyone has different expenses.
Making 145k pre tax with 2 kids and a mortgage and we give maaser, save and invest for retirement. Yes, we live frugally but we are definitely surviving just fine bh.

amother

Antiquewhite ↓

Wed, Aug 21 2024, 7:14 pm

I bring home about 6k per month (post tax). My husband brings in 3k. We have 3 young children and only spend on necessities. Learning to separate needs and wants was hard, But we are able to live within a very very tight budget. In the last year, we paid off all our credit cards and cut them up. And we have 2 very used cars that we paid for in cash. It was minimum monthly payments that made us feel like we were drowning, so limiting those has been so helpful!

Rent - $3k
Tuition for 3 kids bh- $1800
Utitilities/Bills - around $1500
Food -$1200-$1500
Savings - $1000-$1200

It really bothers me that we can't afford a house, but in the last year, we have built our savings to about $15k in a high yield savings account. Once we hit $35k-$40k, the plan is to start investing.

I'm not saying it's easy to be frugal. My kids all wear hand-me-downs and a couple of cheap new things each season. And I definitely still feel the financial strain. But learning to say no to wants has been hard, but also freeing. (And our kids are still too young to push us on their wants, which they may think are needs).

amother

↑ Moccasin

Wed, Aug 21 2024, 7:26 pm

amother Antiquewhite wrote:

Wow just curious what you do that makes such a high salary?
And just saw post tax? Good for u!

amother

↑ Antiquewhite

Wed, Aug 21 2024, 7:34 pm

amother Moccasin wrote:

Wow just curious what you do that makes such a high salary?
And just saw post tax? Good for u!

Thank you hashem! I work 20-22 hours a week at slightly over $100/hr. I have a masters degree and I have an administrative position in the education/special education field.

amother

Petunia

Wed, Aug 21 2024, 7:41 pm

amother Powderblue wrote:

Why are Americans complaining about taxes? You have some of the lowest taxes in the world

Are you comparing the US tax system/rates to socialized countries? If so, add health insurance costs ($2.5-3.5k per month in NYS for a family), maternity leave (poorly paid or unpaid though the job will be held for you for 12 weeks), and other safety net benefits that your higher taxes pay for.

Meanwhile I live in NYC and pay close to 50% in payroll and income tax. Aside from sales tax (8.875%) and property taxes. Then add health insurance costs and I’d say it’s gotta be pretty close to the tax rates you are comparing this to.

amother

↑ Firethorn

Wed, Aug 21 2024, 8:49 pm

amother Petunia wrote:

Well said.
And don't forget about the fact that many cities are lacking in adequate public transportation so having a vehicle (or multiple) per family is another added expense.

I don't understand why Europeans feel like Americans kvetch so much about taxes. We get a fraction of the benefits they get and our expenses are much higher.

After each birth of my 2 kids there was ZERO paid government maternity leave. I just got the paltry $170 per week in disability (6 weeks). in Europe they get many months (is it a year?) of paid maternity benefits, free Healthcare, etc.

amother

Slategray

Wed, Aug 21 2024, 10:55 pm

amother Oleander wrote:

If you are talking about the generation of Jews whose parents immigrated prior to WW II, the parents really were Orthodox only because there was no alternative in Europe.

Did you really just say there was no alternative to Orthodoxy in pre-war Europe? If only that were remotely true.

imaima ↓

Wed, Aug 21 2024, 11:03 pm

amother Strawberry wrote:

Because pioneering isn't for everyone, and we do have infrastructure needs like minyan and mikvah. Prices shoot up insanely fast once a place becomes workable for a frum family. By the time we decided to make the move out of Brooklyn, considering career adjustments, schooling, and everything else, housing in our target location was just as unaffordable. Now what.

Being not the pioneering type is a luxury too.
People who are desperate overcome such inconveniences just as they work at jobs that may not always feel pleasant or deal with kids tantrums and sleepless nights.

amother

Molasses

Wed, Aug 21 2024, 11:04 pm

Basic necessities on weekdays
Second hand clothing
Hand me downs
No frills - no camp no costly entertainment no home internet don’t purchase music etc
I tell my kids no A lot when we go shopping or go alone. It’s good for them to hear no.
I don’t shop online.
I go without
I do with what I have
I find creative solutions.
I mend clothing. We don’t dry clean.
I keep telling myself I have everything I need right now.
I learn Chovos halevavos shaar habitachon.

Not having is hard. Paying off cc debt is hard. Choose your hard.

Oh and the hardest part is… gulp… no cleaning help. I could really use it. Daavening to Hashem.

↑ imaima

Wed, Aug 21 2024, 11:08 pm

#BestBubby wrote:

Children whose parents kept shobbos andKosher, 95% of them became irreligious because of PS

I believe it was due to a larger political context and not PS per se

Also, we see today that kids go OTD or are effectively otd even though they keep up appearances.
So it’s naive to think kids will stay sheltered and protected from the outside influences

amother

Firebrick

Thu, Aug 22 2024, 3:46 am

amother Powderblue wrote:

Why are Americans complaining about taxes? You have some of the lowest taxes in the world

Really?! I don’t think so at all American taxes are extremely high, especially when you get almost nothing for them. You don’t Even get health insurance. Maybe they are lower compared to Israel.