Tisha beav camp price gouging

amother

↑ Red ↓

Thu, Aug 08 2024, 5:52 pm

notshanarishona wrote:

Good for you!! That’s exactly the point I am trying to make, girls can make a very decent amount of $ without being greedy snd taking advantage.

Except the cheap ones fill up super fast because "hey, for $10, why not?" And the mother with a newborn is stuck without camp for her older kids. (I only send on years I'm desperate, otherwise I entertain at home)

amother

↑ Poppy

Thu, Aug 08 2024, 5:58 pm

amother OP wrote:

Yes it’s a luxury and they don’t owe anything but there is a fine line between making something worth your time and charging every penny you can charge.
There are very few girls in the age range of old enough to start babysitting but not fasting.
Personally I am not able to fast if I am running around all day after my kids. I always end up sick or fainting by doing so.
So either I end up breaking my fast early on, or my husband stays home all day and can’t even go daven.
Why can’t there be room for compassion snd trying to help others(especially on T av)? Is this really the time for selfish trying to make a mint.

It’s absolutely fine for you to break your fast early) if a rav says or for your husband not to daven all day. Rabbanim deal with this all the time. The onus should not be put on teens It’s not a teen’s responsibility to make sure your husband can get to shul.

chestnut ↓

Thu, Aug 08 2024, 6:01 pm

If girls should do Tisha beAv camps as chessed, shouldn't they do Yom Kippur as chessed, too? Yom Kippur is so much harder, with no activities and husbands in shul.
As often is the case, the truth lies somewhere in the middle of imamother opinions. 11 y olds deserve to get paid. Getting paid $20/h is a bit too much, but hey, if people are willing to pay those prices...
Our girls do plenty of cheesed.

amother

Chicory

Thu, Aug 08 2024, 6:07 pm

amother OP wrote:

I don’t understand why parents are ok with letting their 11 year old daughter make a fortune on 9 ac off of mothers who are desperate for childcare and don’t fast well.
It’s absurd to be charging $60 for 3-4 hours when the babysitter is an 11 year old , not even really of age to be babysitting themselves under normal circumstances. Why is there no chinuch involved in teaching these preteens to do a service without trying to get rich off of people’s desperation.
$15 an hour is what a older teenager should be charging when they are babysitting for one family. Not for an 11 year old who is also watching 5 other kids. It’s just wrong and nasty to take advantage of people’s desperation.

so dont send your kids
I dont get the problem

tulip3

Thu, Aug 08 2024, 6:22 pm

amother Foxglove wrote:

Again, why are we imposing chessed on 11-year-old children where are all the adults? Let adults do this particular chessed. Why is this exclusively a child chesed?

They should not be forced or expected to do a chesses, but I expect their mother's to help them price it out that its appropriate for their age and skill and not charging quadruple the amount .

Hashem_Yaazor ↓

Thu, Aug 08 2024, 6:23 pm

chestnut wrote:

It's not just $20/hour, it's $20/hour*amount of kids

And to think my 13 yo with experience running camp last year was told by parents to run a 6 hour day camp last summer for 4 weeks, split with a friend, and she should keep it small for $80/week...I felt she was taken advantage of. She got $40/week for 30 hours from each camper. And yes she had supplies and prep time, etc

amother

↑ Bergamot

Thu, Aug 08 2024, 6:25 pm

Who says people are sending because they are desperate?

Some people work on Tisha B’av. Day camp is canceled. They don’t want to or can’t take a day off so they find a camp that they’re more than willing to pay for.

Some people choose to send their children to a camp for the children, not for their own trouble fasting. My children have a good time going to these programs for a few hours in the morning instead of being stuck at home all day.
I’m a good faster and I’m sending my children to a camp. I found one that’s decently priced and run by girls that I know, and I’m choosing to send. I will be able to work and my children will have a good time. It’s a win / win.
Why are we complaining about children and teens that are doing something positive by providing this service whether it’s for Chesed, low price , high price? Nobody has to watch your children. Any help you can get is a blessing. I wouldn’t even feel comfortable asking a girl to babysit my children without paying her, even if she volunteered to, I would give her some form of payment.

↑ chestnut ↓

Thu, Aug 08 2024, 6:46 pm

Hashem_Yaazor wrote:

Even if they charge $20/h per kid, they still have expenses and might be splitting it with a friend.
And if they're charging this much, maybe it's ok in their community. We all know babysitting fees are different in different cities and communities.

↑ Hashem_Yaazor

Thu, Aug 08 2024, 6:48 pm

chestnut wrote:

If they're doing it with a friend, they're likely taking in 10 kids. Su even if they only pocket $10 per hour per kid because it's divided in 2, that's $100/hr.
Their supplies aren't going to be *that* much.

↑ flowerpower

Thu, Aug 08 2024, 7:27 pm

amother Lightpink wrote:

Do you want a bunch of kids running loose in your home so other moms can have a breather?

Loose entertainment doesn’t mean hefker. It means something like play dough for 20 minutes and perler beads for another 20 minutes. Then a cute puppet show for 15 minutes. And why a bunch? Let there be a limit for them how many they will accept.

amother

Caramel

Thu, Aug 08 2024, 7:37 pm

Honestly, I didn't read through every post, just a few pages.
My DD is 12 and making a tisha b'av camp with a friend. They're charging $10 an hour.

They're fasting, they can't take the kids outside (it's over 100 degrees here) and they're not doing anything too sophisticated. Nobody is being forced to send their kid. I personally have my own 4 year old that I'm not sending because I don't want to spend that kind of money.
They are absolutely not doing it as a chessed. They're working hard, I have no problem with them making a lot of money.

amother

↑ Iris ↓

Thu, Aug 08 2024, 8:33 pm

Supply and demand
Supply and demand
Supply and demand....

It's as easy as this! No need to discuss it for 10 pages.
If cheap day camps get filled up, we need more day camp.
If not enough girls are ready to open daycamps price go up!
If expensive one don't get full, they will lower their prices! If they fill up, it's because some ppl are willing to pay an exorbitant amount of money!
Some mothers are ready to pay more to get a smaller group, some mothers are ready to pay more to get older more experienced counselors or someone they trust.
Simple business rules.

amother

cornflower ↓

Thu, Aug 08 2024, 8:47 pm

amother Peach wrote:

I didn't read every single page so apologies if this has been said already...

But everyone who's saying "since when do we charge for Chessed" and "what about post partum mothers"?

Right. For those few who truly don't fast well and truly don't have help (family, husbands who often fast better, older kids), there should be Chessed.

For everyone else, yes, it's not great fun have a bunch of restless, bored, kvetchy children home all day in the heat as you try to keep them entertained for hour after hour while you fast. It's hard, not easy. But that's fine. No one owes you Chessed. It's your job to take care of those kids.

I think if the girls who did this didn't charge or charged less EVERYONE would be sending and many many many of them would be rude, entitled, and demanding.

It's a luxury. And just because they're 11 doesn't mean they're not people. It's really not easy to take care of a bunch of randomly aged kids that you don't know for a few hours, without a playgroup set up and supplies. Supplies cost money. Snacks cost money.

About this….I ran an afterschool tutoring/babysitting program in my young teen, completely free of charge. It turned into 4 hours + every day, getting home after dark. I passionately believed in helping those who needed help but looking back, I don’t understand why some adults didn’t step in. I was watching over 10 kids of varying ages each day, many from dysfunctional families with behavioral issues. It was too much for me. And the parents just wanted more and more and I even remember being yelled at by one of them because he felt I didn’t watch his child adequately. So while young me didn’t recognize it at the time, adult me realizes they took advantage and felt little gratitude. I bear no ill will as I think many of these people had issues, but I’m glad my kids have more assertiveness than I did, even if I still promote chessed a lot at home.

↑ Trademark ↓

Fri, Aug 09 2024, 1:39 am

amother cornflower wrote:

This is a straw man.