Tisha beav camp price gouging

amother

↑ Amaranthus ↓

Thu, Aug 08 2024, 12:26 pm

amother SandyBrown wrote:

I wonder how your teenager will grow up
I am talking about 80 for tesha bav camps

How is it easy to see who has teens or little kids??
I bh don't need help on t av

You don’t need to wonder. They are doing amazing. They have amazing middos and go out of their way for everyone at appropriate times and places. I’m sure the lady who took advantage and put my kid in a dangerous position last week, will have horrible things to say when I don’t allow my kid to go back. That’s ok her choice. My kid is still an amazing kid with great middos and is not entitled despite me teaching her to set healthy boundaries and stand up for herself.

amother

↑ Pear

Thu, Aug 08 2024, 12:27 pm

amother Whitesmoke wrote:

I think the problem is that we are monetizing everything.

When did chessed stop becoming a thing? Why does everything have a price tag? And why are we encouraging our young young preteens to charge?

As I wrote upthread, when I was a kid I did this for free. I took the little kids in the neighborhood, took them to the park for an hour, read them some stories, maybe we colored a little, everyone ate snacks or sandwiches they brought from home.

It wasn't a whole "program", there weren't fancy supplies and projects or overhead. It was simply giving the fasting adults a break.

And it was common in my neighborhood that every year the 10/11 year Olds would do this.

How did we get from there, to fancy programs run by teens/adults with high hourly rates? Why should anyone lose money over something that shouldn't be costing money?

This.

↑ Trademark ↓

Thu, Aug 08 2024, 12:30 pm

amother Amaranthus wrote:

But that’s the thing my kids have balance. Just because the Tisha b’av camp is not their chessed of the week doesn’t mean they didn’t do chessed this week. And that’s really the biggest issue I’m having here. The entitlement of demanding that this particular thing is a done as a chessed and then the horrible accusation accusing teens of not doing chessed.

One day when your teen comes home describing how badly adults treated them you will be singing a very different tune. I hope you come update us then.

What does having adults treat you badly have to do with overcharging?

You are setting the price.

My problem is that an 11 year old is still young enough that they shouldn't have such concepts about making so much money. Where do they take it from.

I have a sister that age, and I don't see her have that kind of concept about money. It comes from somewhere.

amother

↑ Amaranthus ↓

Thu, Aug 08 2024, 12:35 pm

Trademark wrote:

My kids are older they are teens not 11. But even so parents usually give input. We wrote up expenses, thought about how hard the work would be, then figured out what makes sense. This wasn't for tisha b'av it was for in between camp, but I'm assuming the same was done here.

amother

Lightpink ↓

Thu, Aug 08 2024, 12:39 pm

gcg770 wrote:

Sorry but this is not price gouging… these girls are spending their time probably fasting in the hot summer watching your kids. If you don’t like the price you don’t have to send they don’t owe you watching their kids.

This exactly. We aren't talking about food or clothing which are necessities. If you think it's so easy to watch kids on 9 baav make your own camp and charge as little as you like.

amother

↑ SandyBrown ↓

Thu, Aug 08 2024, 12:48 pm

amother Amaranthus wrote:

One mother did something and you write off all mothers???
Whatever can't argue if you can't even try hear the other side

You don't see a different need with t av? Maybe girls can charge something reasonable for zechus for ey or something like that? We all did this happily for free when we were 11! Again I don't need help I'm just suprised at the new generation..amd I'm seeing its the mothers encouraging it!!!

amother

↑ SandyBrown ↓

Thu, Aug 08 2024, 12:51 pm

amother Amaranthus wrote:

When is an appropriate time to help someone? What do you consider appropriate?

amother

↑ Foxglove ↓

Thu, Aug 08 2024, 12:55 pm

amother SandyBrown wrote:

Sounds like a great idea why dont you start. Set an example volunteer to watch someones kids start with just an hourits such a chessed and do it as a zechus for something important.

↑ notshanarishona ↓

Thu, Aug 08 2024, 12:59 pm

amother Whitewash wrote:

My 11-year-old daughter is making a camp with three other people. ( She is almost 12, another almost 12 year old, a 14 year old and an 18 yr old) She is charging $60. She is doing it though from 12:00 to 7:00 and serving lunch and supper. They're not really out coming out with so much money. Honestly. They are four counselors, so far they have I think 12 children. Of those children, about six of them are relatives. I am sending my little daughter, and I'm paying full price for her so my daughter should make some money for working so hard. I actually never sent my kids to one of these camps as I have no problem entertaining them. I don't fast badly and it never bothered me to have them home. My daughter is working very hard on a program, arts and crafts, and all different fun stuff for the children. I do agree it's a lot of money but she honestly is not going to come out with so much at the end after the supplies and the split between counselors. She is also taking two year olds on diapers....

Most canps are not having a ratio pf 4 counselors to 12 kids (of which are family). Obviously like that they aren’t going to make a lot of $.
I an seeing canps charge between $60-80 for some as little as 3 hours, and have 1-2 preteens to 10 kids.
I wouldn’t pay an 18 year old that much, definitely not a 11 year old.
Yes everyone is entitled to charge what they want, but it’s sad that 9 av of all days has become all about making and can’t even mix a little bit of chessed or trying to make it affordable for everyone.
Again, I don’t send to these camps, it just disgusts me each year anew.
My daughter (10 year old) wanted to make a camp , and I told her the max she could charge was $5 an hour, max 5 kids . And she was still super exited about the thought of making that much $ in one day.
10-11 year olds are not adults, there is no reason they should be charging more than most adults charge to babysit.
And saying it’s reasonable because they could get away with it.. that’s the same as any other service, anyone who doesn’t have competition can triple their rates at any time, but that wouldn’t make me want to do business with them.

amother

↑ Foxglove ↓

Thu, Aug 08 2024, 1:01 pm

notshanarishona wrote:

Well that is an insane responsibility on a kid I hope they get paid nicely. 5$ /hr to be responsible for 10 kids is just taking advantage

amother

↑ Amaranthus ↓

Thu, Aug 08 2024, 1:01 pm

amother SandyBrown wrote:

When is an appropriate time to help someone? What do you consider appropriate?

That’s not a real question. Each situation has its own evaluations. You demanding a chessed doesn’t mean anyone owes it to you. You can post on your chats looking for a girl to watch my kids for free while I fast. Maybe someone is looking to help. The entitlement of demanding chessed is disturbing to be honest.

amother

Cerulean ↓

Thu, Aug 08 2024, 1:02 pm

amother SandyBrown wrote:

There is a reason why the younger generation is called the 'me' generation. Everything is looked up thru the lens of 'me, myself and I'. Very little focus is given to look outside of one self.

And this thread is a good example of it.

My kids ran such camps as a means to help others. Their benefit was that they kept themselves busy too on TB. They came away satisfied that the day went faster for them plus they helped out many mothers. That was sufficient. They weren't looking to make a buck off people's challenges. They were happy to step up, on such a day no less.

The caveat to this though has to be that the kids agree to do this on their own volition. It shouldn't be hoisted upon them and apply pressure for them to do this.

Also, the food and arts & crafts supplies should be supplied (or paid for) by the parents.

amother

↑ Foxglove ↓

Thu, Aug 08 2024, 1:03 pm

amother Amaranthus wrote:

Seriously its disturbing that people think they are entitled to this

↑ notshanarishona ↓

Thu, Aug 08 2024, 1:03 pm

amother Foxglove wrote:

Well that is an insane responsibility on a kid I hope they get paid nicely. 5$ /hr to be responsible for 10 kids is just taking advantage

$5 per hour per kid is $50 an hour!
No one is talking about $5 per hour total.
And yes it’s completely irresponsible of those parents to allow their 10-11 years to watch so many kids without an adult in charge, personally I wouldn’t trust them anyway even if $ wasn’t an issue,

amother

↑ Amaranthus

Thu, Aug 08 2024, 1:04 pm

amother SandyBrown wrote:

It wasn’t one mother. It was many. Until I put my foot down and told her to set boundaries and rules. Apparently many mothers thought teens are there to slave away and serve them while they party and shirk their duties. I’m actually finding the 20-29 year olds very entitled and self centered. Each time I say maybe it was a one off, but then another one comes along. I am starting to think they aren’t good examples for my kids and maybe I should rethink who they work for or help.

↑ notshanarishona ↓

Thu, Aug 08 2024, 1:05 pm

amother Amaranthus wrote:

No one is demanding chesed, we are asking parents to consider not having their child charge 3-5x as much as they normally charge on a day where most mothers are physically exhausted, not feeling welcome, and can really use a break.

amother

↑ SandyBrown ↓

Thu, Aug 08 2024, 1:11 pm

amother Foxglove wrote:

Sounds like a great idea why dont you start. Set an example volunteer to watch someones kids start with just an hourits such a chessed and do it as a zechus for something important.

My 11 year old daughter and her 3 friends watch 7 kids for free on t av they have a cute camp and everyone has a great
Time!
They wouldn't dream to charge!!

Maybe this whole thing is a in town thing -I live OOT .
I would love tohear if that imamother who says her daughters do chesed I'm really curious what' she considers chesed?