Is there such a thing as support with no strings attached

amother

Glitter ↓

Wed, Jul 31 2024, 5:47 pm

Yes.
My parents supported us for many years. No longer do.
Nothing has changed from before to after.
They are and always were amazing, giving, emotionally supportive, very normal, sometimes giving their opinions, usually giving us space, sometimes pressuring us but in normal ways, asking us to visit with the kids but not being upset if we cannot... you get the point?
Normal, great parents/grandparents. Nothing changed when they were supporting us fully, helping us partially, or not giving any financial help

lamplighter

Wed, Jul 31 2024, 5:49 pm

From the parents POV, it's beautiful to be no strings attached ie no expectations.
From the children's POV, you bet there's strings attached. It's called hakaras hatov. And I don't mean saying thank you. There should be some kind of extra or different behavior towards people who support you. That's basic middos.

amother

↑ Glitter

Wed, Jul 31 2024, 5:50 pm

lamplighter wrote:

Strings refers to someone "pulling the strings", or controlling, puppeting...

From the children's POV, it's not strings. It's hakaras hatov, 100%

amother

Stoneblue

Wed, Jul 31 2024, 5:56 pm

I think there's a very big difference between the basic mentchlichkeit of hakaras hatov, and strings. "Strings attached" is coming from the parents, whether explicitly or not, where they give over the feeling that since they gave $, they have a say in your life or at the very least, in what you did with that money. Hakaras hatov is just a natural appreciation and gratitude that any recipient should have for the generosity shown toward them.

For example, when we bought a new couch when we moved into our house, my in-laws gave us $2k towards it. There was not one string attached of "and therefore we get to have a say in the color or style" etc. It was freely given with no expectations. Out of hakaras hatov, we thanked them warmly several times over the next few months- when we ordered it, when it finally came, and with a pic of our kids sitting on it holding a thank you sign they colored.

My parents gave us $ towards our down payment of the house, it didn't come with some expectation like, "You will now invite us first before anyone else." Out of hakaras hatov, we invited them to stay.

My inlaws bought us new beds for the guest room before they came to our house the first time. There was no string attached of "whenever we come we get those beds"- in fact, when both they and my parents came for Shabbos together, they insisted my parents sleep on those new beds. We tried to give them the room because WE felt like they should get it, and they refused.

amother

Jetblack

Thu, Aug 01 2024, 1:38 am

amother Amaryllis wrote:

Dh has a trust fund that they legally had to give to him because they made the wrong kind of trust lol.

Anyway, even though they aren't officially supporting us because it was unintentional, they still feel that they can control us. Then again, they try to control all their kids except the one who sued them lol.

Just curious why would a kid sue their parents?

amother

Tulip

Thu, Aug 01 2024, 2:48 am

In theory yes, but I couldn't help but feel indebted, even though my in-laws made it clear there were no strings attached. I think that depends on your own personality type though. I'm not good at asking for help in general. As soon as we were able to support ourselves I felt like a weight was lifted.

amother

↑ Azure

Thu, Aug 01 2024, 3:14 am

amother Geranium wrote:

Your last words in parenthesis do not fit with your first point imo..

ofcourse I would change my shabbos plans for my parent but I wud do the same for my inlaws who dont support us because as you said "and incidentally are their parents- we need to honor our parents regardless!"

but that is not what 'string attached' means! strings attached is when a mother says (or makes you feel this way with out saying) I pay your rent so I get to choose your couch or were paying your tuition so we have a say in where you send your kids for school etc

I hear that. I think strings attached are somewhat normal. when my parents were supporting us, my father discussed things with us (whether I would work or not...I ended up not working and focusing on my degree) and those were conversations we didn't have with my in laws who were not supporting us. Same with renting/buying an apartment...it was my father's money and he was trying to help us maximize on it... on my father's advice, we ended up buying an apartment and his money went towards mortgage instead of rent....of course, we wanted his advice and he took our thoughts and preferences into consideration!
That being said, while I think it's healthy and so supportive to have this dynamic with a young couple, I do think that complete financial independence is the healthiest as married kids get older and they begin raising their own kids....especially for the husband, it's so important that he feels that he can support his own wife and kids without his father or father in law...

amother

Mintcream ↓

Thu, Aug 01 2024, 3:33 am

amother Lightyellow wrote:

Not my b*tch of a daughter 😒

Well, I guess you've told us why that is.

BTW if she is a b*tch, you're the one who raised her, role modeled for her, and taught her to be one. So perhaps you are one yourself?

I'm sure she's struggling to be not like you. That takes all the energy a person has and more.

But you can go make friends with my mother. And b*tch together about what b*tches your daughters are. She would love someone who is interested in hearing her talk nasty about me. Some of what she says is true and some isn't and some is exaggerated but no one is interested in hearing it anymore and truth be told, she's getting pretty lonely and frustrated. Maybe you are too, and you can diss your daughters together and each mother will have the listening ear and sympathy she so desperately craves.

If you put an email here (make it anon if you like) I'll email you with my NM's email address. And you can just tell her that her married daughter (she's only got one married daughter) gave you her email so she'd have a friend her own age and stage to b*tch to instead of b*tching to her other kids in a way that's emotionally abusive towards them.

Anyways post your email here if you want, and I'll send you hers.

amother

↑ Mintcream

Thu, Aug 01 2024, 3:34 am

amother Jetblack wrote:

Just curious why would a kid sue their parents?

She wrote that her parents are controlling of all kids other than the one who sued. Means there's a lot of dysfunction in that family, likely the scapegoat/ black sheep child sued and stood up to the abuse to put a stop to it. And was successful - the parents no longer try to control that child.