S/O Vegan Restaurants ok?

↑ tulip3 ↓

Thu, Jun 20 2024, 2:06 pm

amother Cadetblue wrote:

What does this thread have to do with jealousy?

There so much emotions in the comments about ppl eating in these restaurants from this thread and the other. Such outrage usually stems from jealousy that they can't push the lines of halacha or take on a more lenient path of halacha or can't do what they secretly want to do. I think most are unaware of why they are so angry and indignant.

amother

↑ Cadetblue ↓

Thu, Jun 20 2024, 2:15 pm

tulip3 wrote:

Or it comes from people being upset with other jews or family members who we love not following halacha....

amother

Floralwhite

Thu, Jun 20 2024, 2:16 pm

Comptroller wrote:

I see a lot of black and white thinking in this thread.

there are people who have to travel, for some reasons, and maybe it could help them when they could eat in a vegan restaurant on occasion. Judging them wholesale as "not keeping kosher", like people did on this thread seems a bit exagerated to me.

I understand that there are users on this site who never step outside the 4 amos of their stetl where kosher food is readily available. Let me tell you: not everybody lives like this.

And please, don't come and accuse me of eating in vegan restaurants without a hechsher, I belong to the category who might have to travel to places where no ready made kosher food is available, and I go to extreme lengths to cook in my hotel room in such cases. That's why I know that it is a terrible headache, and why I understand that not everybody would do that and why I advocate against judging persons in such circumstances harshly.

Maybe concentrate your attention on your tzitzis, your life will not become better by judging others.

And if you are so jealous of those who eat in vegan restaurants, just try it yourself and that's it. Don't live by what society around you imposes on you, just for spectacle.

Um... Yes because many parts of Kashrus are just black an white.

Either it's kosher or it's not kosher.

Eating in a non-kosher vegan restaurant is not allowed.

We can be dlkz for why someone might be eating there- they don't know better, etc, but that doesn't change the halacha, which is what OP is asking about. Of course no need to judge someone for making a mistake.

And no, there's no need to list parts of Kashrus that are grey/ different communities hold differently. This happens to be pretty basic. No one, I assume, in this day and age, is in a state of Pikuach Nefesh to the point that if they don't eat from this restaurant they may not survive.

amother

Taupe

Thu, Jun 20 2024, 2:18 pm

amother Scarlet wrote:

You do have a point. Availability does have an effect on what one may eat. It still doesn't change basic, halacha, though. halachically, one may eat non kosher food if their life is at stake-but that IS the halacha, it's not CHANGING the halacha. (and I'm aware that's not the example you gave.)
And I did say that not drinking water isn't the halacha. The rav I spoke to did not even present it as halacha. (in fact, he initially said it would be ok to have a drink and then said, "actually, it would be better not to")

I think (?) she's trying to point out that there are differences in how we pasken based on availability of kosher food.

I'm REALLY not here to pasken, but I'll just say I was in a VERY specific situation in which I was allowed to buy bread from a specific non kosher bakery and that this was 100% ok AND used to be a lot more common and is still acceptable in places where 1. kosher bread is not available and 2. the bakery only makes bread and the like and uses no animal fats.
This actually is a reasonably mainstream opinion, it's just that most people aren't usually in this sort of situation.

I guess I'm agreeing with the point that there are differences in rulings and halachic ways to act in situations where less kosher food is available.

amother

↑ Cadetblue ↓

Thu, Jun 20 2024, 2:22 pm

tulip3 wrote:

There would be a sadness and you rarely hear that. You hear anger and how dare they and criticism laced with " I'm so good". Very few are on the level where it really hurt their souls.

The anger comes from a saddness. Not everyone expresses it that way or even knows how to express it that way. I don't think most people are jealous that they "can't" be more lax.

↑ tulip3 ↓

Thu, Jun 20 2024, 2:24 pm

amother Taupe wrote:

There's very little education on what's actually allowed. Ppl in tri state area just go to gourmet glatt and get everything in a kosher store not knowing that a side of salmon with skin on can be bought anywhere and cut up fruit from a big non kosher store can be eaten. There's so much out there if you educate yourself and that includes vegan restaurants. I remember reading about rice from the rice cooker could be ok bec just rice is made in it but don't quote me, I have to research more. It's so easy to assur things then know intricacies and how to do things according to halacha.

amother

↑ PlumPink ↓

Thu, Jun 20 2024, 2:25 pm

tulip3 wrote:

You think all outrage is jealousy? That’s a very juvenile point of view. Outrage is usually because of passion. We are passionate about being frum and not seeing our Torah treated disrespectfully. I assume you don’t feel passionate about topics if you can’t fathom this concept.

amother

↑ PlumPink ↓

Thu, Jun 20 2024, 2:27 pm

tulip3 wrote:

Do you think people in the tri state area don’t go to remote locations? I’m finding the bubble you live in fascinating. We are just taught in depth kashrus so we know what we can or cannot eat when we are far from easy kosher food.

↑ tulip3 ↓

Thu, Jun 20 2024, 2:44 pm

amother PlumPink wrote:

Of course they do and they ship all their food or bring a lot with them. Or they buy things with an o u in a store on vacation. How many average yeshivish in towners know about salmon and cut fruit? From my interactions and life, most don't know. And no, it's not part of high school curriculum to know how to shop and eat on vacation besides look for an o u.

↑ tulip3 ↓

Thu, Jun 20 2024, 2:46 pm

amother PlumPink wrote:

If you are very very honest with yourself, the average person's outrage is not about their passion about Torah but what will society say, or shame, or jealousy and it comes out as anger.
I'm a very passionate person and I like to call out bs when I see it.

amother

↑ PlumPink ↓

Thu, Jun 20 2024, 2:48 pm

tulip3 wrote:

You do realize you just look arrogant and silly telling all of us that you know best about what’s driving us. No sweetie you don’t know anything. No one is jealous. You should look in the mirror.

↑ Cheiny ↓

Thu, Jun 20 2024, 2:50 pm

tulip3 wrote:

I couldn’t disagree more. I don’t believe there’s one person here who’s challenging or upset about someone bending halacha to eat halachically-questionable foods, because they’re jealous.

That’s just bizarre.

amother

↑ PlumPink ↓

Thu, Jun 20 2024, 2:51 pm

tulip3 wrote:

Very cute bubble. Right totally everyone ships food. Literally lived in 3 areas don’t know a single one who shipped anything. We know all about salmon and fruit in fact we learn in depth all the potential knife problems. And we choose not to use those leniencies because there are risks involved. Seems like you lack a lot of knowledge and life experience.

↑ tulip3 ↓

Thu, Jun 20 2024, 2:52 pm

amother PlumPink wrote:

You do realize you just look arrogant and silly telling all of us that you know best about what’s driving us. No sweetie you don’t know anything. No one is jealous. You should look in the mirror.

Haha! To think no one's jealous? It's cute how you think ppl are so holy and mamish care that much when someone sins.
Nope, I do what I want and I want to keep kosher fully so no jealousy here. If I didn't want to, I would stop.

↑ tulip3 ↓

Thu, Jun 20 2024, 2:53 pm

amother PlumPink wrote:

I don't know where and how old you are but I've lived in two places in tristate and your average lady was and is very clueless. You must hang out with educated smart ladies.

↑ Cheiny ↓

Thu, Jun 20 2024, 2:56 pm

tulip3 wrote:

You’re very presumptuous in that you think you know what others know and don’t know, what they’re educated on, what they believe is allowed and not allowed. You have very narrow minded views on this. It happens to be that tons of very frum people buy salmon from Aldi, for instance, with no hashgacha necessary.

So there goes your theory…