Bringing babies to a shuir

amother

Thistle ↓

Mon, May 27 2024, 12:41 pm

If you want to bring up the mental health of mothers of babies, then how about the mothers that DID arrange for a babysitter or to align with their husband's schedule so that she could get out and do something for herself? I work very hard to make it happen for myself that I can get out by myself a bit. Sometimes I choose to do something where you would expect children to be around. And sometimes I davka choose to do something where children aren't supposed to be there. When it's the latter, I would be very upset if someone brought a child or baby along. It's not fair to those of us who made the effort to arrange things properly because we wanted a break from our own kids to then have to deal with someone else's kid making a ruckus. Make proper arrangements (whether that's dh, a sitter, or going somewhere davka child friendly) or don't go.

↑ Ruchel ↓

Mon, May 27 2024, 12:45 pm

If it's just a shiur it's not going to endanger. But the same type of community will make it about restaurants and about galas and and and...
Me, now all my children for now are in school. But I remember. I smile when I see a baby. I even HEL¨P.

2 things that DO bother me
- dropping baby near me (whether I have a kid with me or not) and leaving
-not being careful and for me to have to drop everything and catch your baby from falling

But I'll always welcome a mom like I wish I had been welcomed

amother

↑ Sienna

Mon, May 27 2024, 12:49 pm

Cheiny wrote:

You shouldn’t assume or speak for others. You should put yourself in the shoes of the speaker as well. Losing your focus and what you were in middle of speaking about while numerous interruptions take place, even short ones, is not so simple and not fair or respectful.

There’s a time and a place…

We can make room in our spaces for everyone no matter their situation. It only makes us better people. And for the record I never took babies anywhere. But I understand many have no choice and I don’t think the answer is to exclude them from everything.

amother

Peru

Mon, May 27 2024, 1:28 pm

Somewhat off topic, in general I agree that babies who are making noise do not belong in shul or in shiurim. After being a SAHM for 6 years and not being welcome to any shiurim because of my babies (and I really didn't think it was appropriate to drop my child(ren) off at a babysitter while I go to a shiur), a friend and I started a shiur specifically for mothers with babies and toddlers. There were toys out for the kids, we moms sat on the couches and on the floor, could nurse the baby when we needed to, talk to our child when needed. It was okay for the baby to cry and sometimes we would pause the shiur while working out fights over toys. It was amazing. I highly recommend to all those who want to go to shiurim and have babies/toddlers at home with them.

amother

↑ Cadetblue ↓

Mon, May 27 2024, 4:31 pm

amother Geranium wrote:

I can't understand this at all. Are you suffering from infertility? That's the only way I can think of you being upset at seeing a baby. Otherwise a calm baby should pose no problem to anyone and there's no reason why a mother can't bring the baby and step out as soon as it makes a noise

Baruch hashem I have beautiful children that I adore kh!! I just know they don’t belong at a shiur or adult-event, thats all

amother

↑ Cadetblue

Mon, May 27 2024, 4:33 pm

amother Thistle wrote:

Couldn’t have said this better

↑ Cheiny

Mon, May 27 2024, 7:15 pm

amother Sienna wrote:

Have no choice? That sounds like attending the Shiur is an emergency and can’t be avoided and so there’s no choice but to take the baby along. There are plenty of shiurim online that one can watch until they find a different night when there’s a Shiur they can attend after finding arrangements for the baby.

The subject at hand is specifically taking a baby to a shiur, not about “being excluded from everything.”

amother

↑ OP

Mon, May 27 2024, 11:01 pm

I have no problem with the babies being there. We aren’t trying to “exclude” anyone from anything as I was clear in my OP. What I don’t understand is how your baby can be making noise and clearly disturbing and doing nothing about it. I couldn’t hear the women speaking. I think this is inconsiderate.

notshanarishona

Tue, May 28 2024, 12:28 am

amother Geranium wrote:

What if it’s someone who is easily distracted? It’s not about not liking babies as much as trying to relax and focus on the speaker.

↑ Bnei Berak 10

Tue, May 28 2024, 12:58 am

Ruchel wrote:

And that's where "oh you left your children with a non Jew on shabbes/yt" comes in. PLus not everyone can afford this, even a few times a year (not talking about me, but say, when I know a family leaves in social apartment I seriously assume they won't get a sitter). Taking turns, that's assuming there's more than one event. Where I live it's a lot. But I remember where I used to live. The hatred of babies I've encountered is extremely strange - do they not want moms with a good mental health who won't burn out, or???
BH I would never settle in a posh place where kids are hidden until somehow they appear Rolling Laughter

Hatred of babies? A posh place where kids are hidden? Aren't you a bit dramatic now? Please recognize there's is a time and place for everything.

amother

NeonGreen

Tue, May 28 2024, 4:09 am

saralem wrote:

I think it is totally fine to bring babies. Ladies-let’s support each other. Maybe the shiur is what’s helping an overwhelmed mom keep it together. Feel inspired. Feel part of the community. Prevent isolation. Yes, walk out and calm baby if she’s crying. But to give the message that only women with babysitters (or beyond that stage) can attend shiurim is so not supportive.

Either have the Shiur that Mother's and babies can come. Or Mothers can meet other Mothers at the park and this is not a disturbance for anyone. I never took our children to Shul when they were small, and never for Shofar blowing until they were older. I would never think of going to a Shiur with a baby. Why would I do that? This is the way we grew up.

Aurora ↓

Tue, May 28 2024, 5:30 am

This is very weird to me. Don't we want there to be big families and lots of children? In which case, the children are going to be in places.

amother

Heather

Tue, May 28 2024, 5:34 am

Aurora wrote:

This is very weird to me. Don't we want there to be big families and lots of children? In which case, the children are going to be in places.

Of course, but does that mean there can't be a few select places where children are not going to be in?

amother

Almond

Tue, May 28 2024, 5:34 am

amother Thistle wrote:

THIS.

amother

↑ Thistle

Tue, May 28 2024, 6:12 am

Aurora wrote:

This is very weird to me. Don't we want there to be big families and lots of children? In which case, the children are going to be in places.

Yes. And if you want people to have large families, parents need a break sometimes. So we should have spaces that are supportive to young parents. That means we need BOTH family friendly spaces AND adult only spaces available.

↑ Aurora

Tue, May 28 2024, 8:08 am

Maybe it's because I've studied Jewish history, but one of the innovations of the Reform movement in Germany, aside from creating a weekly Devar Torah in a language everyone spoke (before it was just a rabbi's drasha twice a year in Hebrew), and putting an organ in the schul, and calling it a Temple - was to try to keep children out of schul, and create places that were only for adults in Judaism.

I am glad for those who worked so hard for a babysitter. Not everyone is able, for whatever reason, to make those same arrangements. Maybe a bit of compassion instead?:

I just think that if we push so hard to have children, we need to accept that if children are part of Judaism, so are the spaces in Judaism.

While I do think there is a place for an adults-only shiur, it is mostly if the content of that shiur is clearly for adults. Otherwise, children belong.

↑ Ruchel

Tue, May 28 2024, 8:13 am

I'm just as dramatic as the need for a "just the presence a baby even quiet changes the atmosphere". Well we're Jews we like children, we're not a anti kids woke group... But again when I see some threads with boob jobs and stuff I wonder

watergirl

Tue, May 28 2024, 8:20 am

Bring your baby? Cool. Bring your baby and it cries, so you take a seat by the door and leave the second it cries? Cool. Bring your baby, let it play with loud toys, eat loud and smelly snacks, make sounds, shush it when it cries and all out ignore the loud sounds so women are bothered? THIS is the problem I think most people have.

amother

Winterberry

Thu, Jun 06 2024, 3:34 pm

Sorry I answered No before I read the question, I thought question was should babies be brought to a shiur!
I guess if they are quiet then its not a problem, but once they make a noise - you remove the baby.