Important...Breaking off challah for Bracha

mummy-bh

Thu, May 08 2008, 4:40 pm

I save mine in the freezer for my dh to burn with the chometz, but I heard a lovely idea from a lady I know. She saves them in the freezer, but 3 times a year burns them on a disposable barbeque specially bought for that purpose.

↑ MrsLeo ↓

Thu, May 08 2008, 5:15 pm

Mrs. XYZ wrote:

MrsLeo wrote:

chocolate moose wrote:

the piece should be less than a kezayis. leo, maybe you'd like a book explainign the process. dh could get you a present !

I know how the process works, I just want to know if I can take challah when I make the dough and not when im actually baking.

I always take challa when I make the dough.

But I wonder, if you split the dough and give away half to someone else, then both dont have to take challa cause they're both less than a shiur? I imagine if the dough was originally 5 lbs, then challa has to be taken.

When you buy frozen dough from the bakery or wherever do they take challah from it or do you have to do it?

cassandra ↓

Thu, May 08 2008, 8:14 pm

mummiedearest wrote:

just looked in the ksa... says nothing about not burning while baking.

I think it's a matter of kashrus since the challah is assur to eat. So if you hold that wrapped foods in an oven do not cause a problem with reicha or zeia then you can wrap the challah and burn it while the challah is baking. If you hold that even wrapped foods are a problem (I.e, you will NEVER bake milchig and fleishig in the same oven) then I would imagine you would have a problem burning the challah in the oven too.

Squash ↓

Thu, May 08 2008, 8:16 pm

I used to burn the challah in the oven, the way my mother did it, in the lower broiler part.

then dh told me that according to kabala (I think, or it might just be halacha, dunno) one should be very careful for the challah to mamash be burnt to a crisp so that even a dog or cat wouldn't eat it. it is dangerous (for the neshamos of our children) for anyone, whether a human or animal, to eat from the challah that we take.

I will try to post a source for this later, when my husband gets home.

so now I save it in a special bag in the freezer all year and before pesach I take it to someone who does the burning as a service for pple.

↑ cassandra ↓

Thu, May 08 2008, 8:21 pm

But if you send it out you don't know that it's burned well; you're relying on a third party. Only if you do it yourself can you be sure.

↑ mummiedearest ↓

Thu, May 08 2008, 8:28 pm

cassandra wrote:

mummiedearest wrote:

just looked in the ksa... says nothing about not burning while baking.

the ksa also mentions that the minhag is to do it in the oven in which the challahs will be baked. (I guess this means before the challahs.) I don't think it's a kashrus issue.

↑ cassandra ↓

Thu, May 08 2008, 8:30 pm

AFAIK it is a kashrus issue as all tevel is. You need to wrap it to burn regardless because of the holy status of the challah, so I don't know how you are inferring that it is not a kashrus issue.

↑ Squash

Thu, May 08 2008, 9:34 pm

dh will try to look up exactly where, but he says it's written in many sforim very strongly that a tamai animal (I don't know where I got the humans part) should not eat the challah.

and the place that I take it to, they do it in an open fire (pit?) where it turn into almoast charcoal.

↑ mummiedearest ↓

Thu, May 08 2008, 9:37 pm

cassandra wrote:

AFAIK it is a kashrus issue as all tevel is. You need to wrap it to burn regardless because of the holy status of the challah, so I don't know how you are inferring that it is not a kashrus issue.

I guess because if it was a kashrus issue it wouldn't be burned in the oven that will then be used to bake chaalah that people can eat without a problem. BUT, as I have just burnt the dough whilst baking six challahs, I will look into the matter before shabbos. thank you for the info.

↑ cassandra ↓

Thu, May 08 2008, 9:57 pm

I just mentioned the issue to my husband and he didn't think it was as straightforward as I did. I always thought it was obvious it was a kashrus issue. I must have dug that up from someone in the deep recesses of my BY educated mind. Anyway, I'm curious to hear what you find out and I will look into it myself as well.

↑ mummiedearest ↓

Thu, May 08 2008, 10:04 pm

I asked my husband who is pretty sure it's not an issue, but will look it up AND ask a shailah...

who knew challah was so complicated.

↑ cassandra

Thu, May 08 2008, 10:31 pm

I was just looking at the Star-K website and they mention

1) That you should davka NOT store your challah to burn at a future date as the two reasons we burn challah is a) it is holy and we can't use it so we must get rid of it and b) "she lo yavo l'ydei takala"-- if it is left around you may use it by accident, so we burn it right away instead

2) the reason why you shouldn't burn it in the oven with other things baking is because it is possible that that piece will serve as kindling for the fire and help to bake the other things better. Since we can't get any hanaa from it we burn it alone.

Crayon210

Fri, May 09 2008, 12:11 am

MrsLeo wrote:

I make 5 lbs of dough and give my mother 2lbs of it so that noone has a question of whether they need to take off challah off of 2lbs or 3lbs. Am I allowed to take off challah from all 5lbs on thursday before I give my mother her 2lbs and then bake it the next day?

I don't understand why splitting up the dough helps. AFAIK, you can't just split up the dough to get around taking challah. Scratching Head

↑ MrsLeo

Fri, May 09 2008, 12:26 am

Crayon210 wrote:

MrsLeo wrote:

I don't understand why splitting up the dough helps. AFAIK, you can't just split up the dough to get around taking challah. Scratching Head

Splitting up the dough has nothing to do with the challah. Both my mother and I bake challah and we dont bake enough on our own to be able to take challah separately with a bracha so I make 5lbs of dough and take challah off of it and then since I dont use the whole 5lbs I give 2 of them to my mother.

↑ abismommy

Fri, May 09 2008, 1:13 am

interesting, cassandra. I will ask a rav about it tomorrow, being that I already have one piece in the freezer from last week. thanks for the info!

TzenaRena

Fri, May 09 2008, 1:41 am

mummiedearest wrote:

just looked in the ksa... says nothing about not burning while baking.

two Rabbonim (and a third one during a Kashrus shiur) specifically told me that one can do it in the oven but must be careful NOT to burn it while baking any other food .