THE POPE - AND WHAT WE CAN LEARN

↑ ForeverYoung ↓
Guest

Mon, Apr 04 2005, 9:53 pm

Quote:

Yes look at it from a Jewish perspective but realise not everyone is like you and has the same beliefs as you do.

It is b/c of the innocent bystanders and onlookers that most of the evil deeds happen.

Whoever shook a hand of a murderer, had approved of his doing.

Scilent indifference is the worst.

↑ Rivka ↓

Mon, Apr 04 2005, 10:03 pm

Maybe, but sometimes only say something if you know you can help.
Anyway, really if that is his only fault then good for him. Truth is there is no non=Jew out there who is totally amazing either. America claim to be for Israel but really they are for themselves. Britian keeps out of it really coz they can't even deal with Norther Ireland, so who are they to comment on Israel. The UN a load of antisemitic $%*!! who their main man is a terrorist.
All the Arab countries are not counted coz they are all Jew haters and Israel haters and anything bad that happens is Israel;s fault.
Russia, not so innocent either. France a bunch of anti-semites who are also supplying weapons. Germany another worry again, recently in a pole it was found they think Jews have too much power and would vote far right....they never learn and they are so stupid.
Basically the whole world. Then you get to Israel where you have a bunch of supposedly frum Jews attacking Jews by being close to Arafat and the PLO and even visiting Arafats grave. They are not only in Israel these Jews there are everywhere. So really anyway you look at it, the whole world is against us, even our own people...although I think the Netura Karte should be carted off and cut off.

↑ roza

Tue, Apr 05 2005, 1:11 am

I don't know which neturei katra u are talking about, but there is one that supported arafat and co. it's really sick. they act like enemy of jews. just google their site and see the pics, much worse then a non-jew from vatikan.

http://www.nkusa.org/activitie.....4.cfm

↑ Pearl

Tue, Apr 05 2005, 4:12 am

Quote:

Rivka wrote:

He shook Arafats hand, big deal, so did the Presidents of America and so did that Israeli Prime Minister, forgot his name already.

Rivka, please, let's keep this respectful. reading that actually hurt my stomach.....

just in case I gave some one the idea I hate the pope....I don't! I am very well aware he JP2 wasn't the pope during WW2, but still I read an article where it said he could have done more for the Jews.

a gentile ones told me "the arabs can just sit back and watch, as the jews take "care" of eachother"......there's too much bad blood between fellow Jews, such lack of respect. last year there was the case of the "wall" (or
"fence") in the Court of International law in The Hague. so of course out came the plo people to demonstrate against israel, and who were there right next to them? neturei karka.......................................................

↑ Motek ↓

Tue, Apr 05 2005, 1:48 pm

Leagal Eagal wrote:

he was able to overlook Arafat's faults and still meet with him and hear him out.

FAULTS?

you call murder a fault?

Rivka wrote:

He shook Arafats hand, big deal, so did the Presidents of America and so did that Israeli Prime Minister, forgot his name already.
I don't think the Pope sided with anyone, he was being diplomatic. Tony Blair shook hands with that terrorist Libyan Qadhafi, does that mean I think he's a terrible person? No, it just means I don't agree with it but it doesn't automatically make him evil

BIG DEAL?

I'm sorry ladies, but it is very sad to read these posts and see how callous we can get when a man responsible for the murders of our very own brothers and sisters is welcomed by the pope and it's regarded as ho hum

Quote:

By today's standards of crime, Jack the Ripper would barely make the headlines, murdering a mere five harlots in a huge slum swarming with criminals: just one more violent creep satisfying his perverted needs on the dregs of society. No one would be incensed as were the respectable families of the pretty college students that were Ted Bundy's victims or the children tortured and mutilated by John Wayne Gacy. We have become a society numbed by horrible crimes inflicted upon many victims.

so what do you think of Jack, Ted, and John - they had some faults, yes, but big deal if a world leader would shake their hands and give them a private audience?

↑ Rivka

Tue, Apr 05 2005, 2:53 pm

I don't see why I hurt anyone's stomache. Fact is, I don't think the Pope welcomed Arafat with open arms and was his best buddy.
Just because they shake hands means nothing. Do you think the shaking hands of Qhadafi meant that Britian and America welcome him with open arms? No they just don't want a Nuclear disaster. Maybe the Pope thought he could get Arafat to change, I don't know. Not everyone knows how the Arabs work because they don't live with them. It is a hundred times worse when people who know what they are like start pallying up with them.
It is very different when dealing with leaders of nations than dealing with your common criminal, even if they are big in the news and major psycho cases. It's all of Neturei Karte that are pro palestinian actually, it's what they stand for. Purim they burnt the Israeli flag like the Palestinians do and people watch and wonder what is going on with them. I do not see them as Jewish.

↑ Motek ↓

Tue, Apr 05 2005, 2:57 pm

when the pope met arafat and gave him the red carpet treatment back in 1982, he was not a leader of a nation, but was regarded by the civilized world as nothing more than a terrorist

get arafat to change? you seem completely unaware of the pope's statements in favor of the arabs and against the Jews. He was a supporter of the murderer Arafat and the fact that the Arab nations are mourning for the pope spells it out loud and clear. If the Arabs are mourning, then by golly, we Jews should be rejoicing.

↑ avigayil

Tue, Apr 05 2005, 3:10 pm

Sometimes you need to give people an audience to really see what is inside them.
Pope John Paul II always went to the people.
We do disagree about his meetings with Arafat, but are we going to hold every human in contempt who met with him?
....A.

↑ Leagal Eagal

Tue, Apr 05 2005, 5:41 pm

The Pope was a diplomat in every sense of the word. Diplomacy calls for swallowing your personal disgust and setting aside your personal feelings, and doing your best to fill the shoes you've been given. The Pope met with people from all walks of life, and he met with people whose practices and behavior went against his very grain, but meet with them he did, all in the name of diplomacy and G-dliness. He wanted to show that G-d accepts all people, sinners and non-sinners alike, and if that was his mission then I say "MISSION ACCOMPLISHED"

↑ Motek

Thu, May 05 2005, 3:34 pm

Rivka wrote:

Actually the Pope was a priest during the 2nd WW and he saved lots of Jewish children and didn't allow them to be baptized.

In 1994, Israel's former Chief Rabbi Yisrael Meir Lau met with the Pope. Before the meeting, Rabbi Lau was shown a page of W. Churchill's bio. relating a post-Holocaust era story about the Pope. According to the book, the Pope was then a Bishop in Cracow. He refused to baptize a five yr. old boy upon learning that his Jewish mother, who had given him to a Polish-Catholic family to raise during World War II, had extracted a promise from the family to raise the boy as a Jew.

When R' Lau met the Pope, he recounted this story to him. The Pope verified the story and added, "I followed the path of that boy for many yrs. and I understand today he is an observant Jew who lives in N.Y. And this wasn't the first time that I refused to perform such a baptism."

Dr. Yitzchok (Sergio) Minerbi, an international expert in Vatican affairs and Israel's former EU ambassador, casts doubt on the veracity of the story.

"During the Holocaust, he wasn't even a priest, must less the Bishop of Cracow. Those who would like to crown him as a Righteous Gentile don't know the Pope's biography. The anti-Semitism he attacked was Pagan in origin. He put church-sponsored anti-Semitism in a different category."