S/O don’t take handouts just because they’re availabile

amother

Wed, Apr 03 2024, 10:11 pm

I’m hearing so may Imamothers talk about tzedaka and Chessed organizations as if it’s a mitzvah to take everything and anything you qualify for. Some even complain about the quality of the food they receive or the fact that donors don’t allocate more money toward the subgroup of society they are in.

Please please change you attitude! There should be pride in not taking even if one is eligible. It will serve you well in the long term instead of being trapped in limiting tzedaka and social programs, afraid to increase one’s earning potential for fear of being locked out of those programs.

The mishna in Peah tells us:
וכל מי שאינו צריך ליטול ונוטל, אינו נפטר מן העולם עד שיצטרך לבריות.
וכל מי שצריך ליטול ואינו נוטל, אינו מת מן הזקנה, עד שיפרנס אחרים משלו, ועליו הכתוב אומר (ירמיה יז): ברוך הגבר אשר יבטח בה' והיה ה' מבטחו

One who doesn’t truly need to take from tzedaka yet takes, eventually will become truly needy. One who needs to take but pushes himself, and doesn’t take, will eventually go on to support others instead.

Rabbi Akiva says עשה שבתך חול ואל תצטרך לבריות. Rather have a weekday shabbos meal than take tzedaka.

Of course, there are truly desperate people out there and by all means they should not be embarrassed in any way to take what is offered, they should be encouraged. But this attitude of what can I get and what gemachs am I eligible for is doing our community a major disservice on so many levels.

amother

Pistachio

Wed, Apr 03 2024, 10:23 pm

I don't judge anyone who takes at all. But DH is in kollel and I work very hard at my job. we don't have any extras but we get by with a ton of siyata dishmaya! thank you Hashem!! He really always comes thru. but yes, I have this outlook. we really don't take any of these things. Unless we really, really have to.

All my friends were running to this sale. It was donated by people for kollel families. lots of extra, nice things. I did not go. no interest in taking if its not a necessity. everyone was running and grabbing. and I got a lot of comments that I missed out that I didn't go. Why do I davka have to take??!!

amother

Wed, Apr 03 2024, 11:13 pm

amother Pistachio wrote:

I don't judge anyone who takes at all. But DH is in kollel and I work very hard at my job. we don't have any extras but we get by with a ton of siyata dishmaya! thank you Hashem!! He really always comes thru. but yes, I have this outlook. we really don't take any of these things. Unless we really, really have to.

All my friends were running to this sale. It was donated by people for kollel families. lots of extra, nice things. I did not go. no interest in taking if it’s not a necessity. everyone was running and grabbing. and I got a lot of comments that I missed out that I didn't go. Why do I davka have to take??!!

Helevai more people had your attitude.

amother

Wed, Apr 03 2024, 11:21 pm

amother Fern wrote:

OP I totally agree with you on the tzedaka front but are you lumping together community tzedaka funds and government programs? Because there is a huge difference between the two.

I’m not, though I believe Rav Meir Stern from Passaic tells his talmidim not to take government programs. I believe one of his main reasons is that it’s virtually impossible to do in a yashrushdik way. You need to be creative with bank accounts, parental help, cash, etc to maximize programs and he believes it incentivizes people to act “Krum”. Others disagree. My OP is focused on community gemachs and organizations.

amother

Fern

Wed, Apr 03 2024, 11:24 pm

amother OP wrote:

Thanks for clarifying!

amother

Floralwhite

Thu, Apr 04 2024, 11:52 am

amother OP wrote:

Wow, it is so refreshing to know there is a rav out there like this! Beautiful!

amother

Orange

Thu, Apr 04 2024, 11:56 am

So much yes. I also think that while chesed fund campaigns have been truly lifesaving for many people, they have also lowered our inhibition when it comes to asking for tzedaka. A knowledgeable rav can really be a wonderful resource in understanding when the Torah wants us to take and when the Torah wants us to respond differently to a challenge.

renslet

Thu, Apr 04 2024, 12:25 pm

I agree that people shouldn't just take because it's available if they don't need it.
BUT
Please don't make decisions if your kids need something just because you don't want to take. As a high school teacher, I've had kids complain about stuff that was lacking in the house and when they were offered help, the parents refused. It's really important sometimes to do something uncomfortable so that your children/or spouse will benefit, even if you are fine going without.
Also
There are organizations that help specific sub group of people, widows, divorced people, etc. The clothing or grocery help is not just a monetary help, it's also a huge hug and emotional support recognition from the community.
Lastly
It's so easy to say "she doesn't need it" even about our close friends and family. But honestly we don't really have a clue

amother

Freesia

Thu, Apr 04 2024, 1:05 pm

renslet wrote:

This 100%!!! So so true!
I'm the OP of the financial poll.
Most ppl that answered never asked for tzedaka and they probably needed it.
Stop bashing families that need help.
All those "middle class" families that are complaining that chinuch and kollel families get "so many things" never asked for help in the first place!

amother

Hosta

Thu, Apr 04 2024, 1:18 pm

amother Freesia wrote:

That is so not true. I know many middle class families there were turned down.
Kollel/chinuch families get help handed to them, while struggling middle class go through mortification and shame when asking for help.

amother

Hosta

Thu, Apr 04 2024, 1:19 pm

amother Bergamot wrote:

Nobody I know likes taking. I certainly don’t. But I take what’s available because honestly it’s only the tip of the iceberg to what we need

Some communities have the mentality to take advantage of whatever they can and milk everyone for what they've got. Be it government benefits, help from organizations..... they take full advantage of everything available even if they don't need it. They don't look at it as taking help, they look at it as something they're entitled to.

amother

Thu, Apr 04 2024, 2:10 pm

I know someone who is a gemach expert. “You can get this from A, and that from B” “They give …” It’s all about taking everything one can.

There’s nothing wrong with taking when it is needed. I fully agree with the previous poster not to be a martyr on your kids cheshbon. But I definitely do see a “chap what you can” mentality among many and that is what I was referring to.

People don’t see the generous hard working people behind the organization and the sacrifice hard working people are making by donating.

I would love new appliances and linen but I allocate masser money to TDL to help set up a kallah instead and am quite happy using what I’ve already got so I can help others. Please be mindful and appreciative of the help that is there for those who truly need rather than focusing on what one can take because it’s out there.