Where is it all going?

amother

Wed, Mar 27 2024, 2:26 pm

After seeing the mom who earned $40K a month and not live fancy, I am wondering what I should be doing differently.
HOWEVER, I know I live hashkafically differently than many of you will agree with. So, if you think we are doing something wrong hashkafically, in regards to giving away too much to tzedaka or other things like that, know that every one of these kind of things are discussed with our various rabbanim.

I live in Israel, I am helped by parents, have 3 kids, married 7 years. My husband is learning, and that’s not something we’ll change, so please don’t start bashing my lifestyle. I am so so grateful for the support our parents give us, and we tell them constantly how much we appreciate it, and that they do not ever have to continue out of pressure. They do it because they really want to.

My inlaws were sending $1,500 month which will stop in about 3 months.
My parents send us $2,500 a month
I earn $3,500 a month for my part time job.
Husband does not get anything from kollel, as he does not feel comfortable taking it if we do not NEED it (again, asked our rabbanim and parents are aware).

We give 20% chomesh to tzedaka on everything we earn including support (asked rabbanim again).

That leaves us with CURRENTLY $6K per month (will be 4.5 when inlaws stop supporting!)

Rent is 3K (I know!! We live in an expensive neighborhood, and not willing to move! This is a biggie, but non negotiable). We try to rent out for succos/pesach, which gives us another $10-15K for the year to make our rent more feasible, but all based on if Hashem gives us renters.

Groceries are in the $200 per week range(plus shabbos expenses that we don’t count at all- again, based on our many shailos).

Only have to pay for one playgroup, about $250/month.

Utilities about $500/month

I try not to spend a lot on kids and our clothes, but it’s probably an average of $100 a month for all of us.

I have a few hours of cleaning help a week for $200-300/month. This is possible to cut, but honestly is somewhat necessary for my mental health. But I do cut it out when I need to (and see the consequences).

We have a cheap car that costs about $300/month for everything.

I honestly don’t know about tax- my husband deals with it.

And then there are always the random unexpected expenses that add up so fast.

We are living month to month, not fully earning as much as we are spending. We are getting rid of our credit cards to use only cash and debit, so we don’t fall behind or go into debt.

However, we are about to lose $1500/month!

Without changing any of the ruchniyus decisions (tzedaka, kollel money, shabbos spending) that we got hadracha on, anyone have any ideas to help me either earn some more or spend less?

I cant get a raise, as I just got one. My job is part time, but cant really take on full time with little kids at home.

We met with financial counselors a few times, tried to budget, but didn’t really see any change.

Sorry for the long post! If anyone has any tips for me, please share!!

amother

Begonia

Wed, Mar 27 2024, 2:27 pm

20% is not for people who barely have enough to live.

allthingsblue

Wed, Mar 27 2024, 2:28 pm

Get hadracha again

mha3484

Wed, Mar 27 2024, 2:29 pm

Most people I know in your situation if they wish to continue in learning, they join a paying kollel. I think you should reconsider. In my circles, most men I know still in learning with kids 5-7 years old are in kolleim that pay.

Last edited by mha3484 on Wed, Mar 27 2024, 2:32 pm; edited 2 times in total

amother

Seablue

Wed, Mar 27 2024, 2:29 pm

You post that you need to cut expenses, but then you don't want to cut any of your expenses (cheaper rent, cleaning help)and you're also saying that you can take on any new jobs so I'm a little confused about what you're asking?

If you're losing 1500 a month soon, maybe you should reask about giving a chomesh, esp since the majority of that is not even money you earn but is money you're receiving as a gift.

amother

Orchid

Wed, Mar 27 2024, 2:30 pm

First, the hadracha you were given was based on one set of numbers. If your circumstances change you should go back for further hadracha. Second, I spend that much on groceries for my family of seven. Is it possible to shop elsewhere or buy less processed food? Finally, you have a lot of non negotiables. So either you can get another job to afford them, or you'll have to negotiate on something. Your rent is a fortune.

amother

Wed, Mar 27 2024, 2:30 pm

amother Begonia wrote:

20% is not for people who barely have enough to live.

Again, this is something discussed with rabbanim that will not change.
Based on our hadracha we got, 20% is indeed for anyone who wants to give it. Whether they have $5 to their name or $500K. It makes not difference.

But no need to debate this at all. This is a hashkafa we received and continuously receive and won’t change.

Not trying to convince anyone to do the same

Last edited by amother on Wed, Mar 27 2024, 2:38 pm; edited 1 time in total

amother

Pink

Wed, Mar 27 2024, 2:35 pm

Honestly, this is a strange OP.

Please tell, What do you want to hear?

GetReal

Wed, Mar 27 2024, 2:36 pm

OP I think your last post is under yours screen name, if you want to change it.

Can your husband take on something that will bring in money, tutoring or whatever?

Honestly the biggest difference would be lower rent…

amother

RosePink

Wed, Mar 27 2024, 2:37 pm

Can you get a job at night working american hours? Your kids are little you should be able to work from home once they are asleep.

amother

Wed, Mar 27 2024, 2:37 pm

amother Orchid wrote:

The hadracha was not on any set of numbers. This is something my husband wants to do very much, and we asked shailos based on if we are can give that much if we cant actually afford it. We were told my numerous rabanim, unanimously, yes.

Do you really spend that for a family of 7? I dont buy much processed food at all, and I dont really know where to cut on groceries. Do you have any ideas for me on how to do it? (The stores in the area are all so expensive I guess).

My main non Negotiable is rent. I wish it was negotiable, but I would move back to america, where life is more expensive, if I had to move to a different neighborhood.
Cleaning lady at this point I cut out right now. I wish I didn’t have to, but I do.

Any tips on how to make side money?
We can start accepting the payment from the kollel if we need to, but I’d rather try to figure out how to spend less than take someone else’s tzedaka money for kollel families.

amother

Turquoise

Wed, Mar 27 2024, 2:39 pm

I live in Yerushalayim albeit not in an expensive neighborhood, earning (not being supported) just a little more than you with a double digit family and we're doing okay.

When making financial decisions, you can't make everything non-negotiable. You can EITHER work part time OR live in an expensive neighborhood OR have a car and cleaning help etc OR have a husband who is learning. Otherwise, it just will never add up.

My husband is learning but we live in a cheap neighborhood and I work full time. If I said I can only work part time and I have to live central, by now he would be working.

My issue with the way you are living is not the support or the learning etc but simply that you want to have the best of all worlds. Life is about choices. Growing up is about being responsible. If you want the lifestyle to be viable, you have to make some tough choices. You're going to have to work out what your priorities are and then choose what you can and can't do.

amother

DarkRed

Wed, Mar 27 2024, 2:43 pm

amother OP wrote:

Im intrigued and should start a spinoff.

I live in Lakewood in yeshivish circles and nevet heard chomesh as something mainstream. Definitely not aa a hashkafa that that wont change w the circumstances.

amother

Begonia

Wed, Mar 27 2024, 2:48 pm

It just doesn’t make sense to be giving away so much when it’s a chumrah and above what you need to do. I think a lot has to change. Not sure why you are asking if you decided you just aren’t going to change anything. Not only that but in many cases you don’t even give 10% if you need to get hand outs.

amother

Honeydew

Wed, Mar 27 2024, 2:49 pm

amother Pink wrote:

Honestly, this is a strange OP.

Please tell, What do you want to hear?

This. At least 1 parent must work full time. It doesn't make sense, and it's not sustainable, to live with you only working part time & DH not bringing in any money at all. Something has to give.

amother

Papayawhip

Wed, Mar 27 2024, 2:52 pm

We make over 1,000,000 1/2 dollars and we were told that we shouldn’t be giving 20%. So I’ve just had a very strange that you’re taking money that you’re given from your parents and you give that kind of money. I’m sorry but something is really off with that. Even 10% these days is always the norm I talked to many Rabbis and not all say that it’s necessary. Yes we try to give over 10% but I can’t say that we give up to 20%. We are helping a lot of our Mary kids also we’re not counting that in our 10%. And we want to make sure that we have enough to help them long-term as well as a nice money for retirement. And your husband doesn’t wanna bring in any money? I just don’t get it you don’t seem to want to change a thing, but want to be OK. I think you were looking for a unicorn that does not exist.

amother

Babyblue

Wed, Mar 27 2024, 2:55 pm

Kollel money is not tzedaka money or money for people who are needy. It is a “salary” civiyachol for the learning.

Money from parents is a hand out. How can you give maaser on someone else’s money? That makes no sense. Let them take the maaser and then give you the money after that.

Bnei Berak 10

Wed, Mar 27 2024, 2:57 pm

OP, why shouldn't DH receive a stipend which he is entitled to?
If you rent out your apt. twice a year that means you travel to the US twice a year? That's a huge expense.

amother

Natural

Wed, Mar 27 2024, 2:59 pm

You said you don’t count shabbos spending on your expenses and that’s fine but it’s still
important for you to know approx how much money you are spending on shabbos each week so that you can write down a general budget of how much money you spend per month. Once you do that you’ll be able to see how large of a deficit you will have and how to best close that deficit.

Or are you saying you’re totally opposed to even calculating what your shabbos spending is?

Also, being in a paying kollel is not the same as taking tzedaka. There are people who value the time your husband is learning torah and would like for him to compensated by it.

Last point, do your parents and in laws know that you give chomesh on the money they give you? They may need to give their OK for it to be halachically acceptable (I’ve heard this even with giving maiser on parental support)

Bethany85

Wed, Mar 27 2024, 3:01 pm

Is it right to give 20% of the money you receive from others to Tzedakah? They give it to you so you can cover your expenses, not for you to use it for your Chumros. I would be upset if I was giving Tzedakah to a needy person and they turned around and gave 20% of it away.