IM modern orthodox - AMA.

amother

Pansy

Fri, Oct 06 2023, 10:14 am

amother Mauve wrote:

I think the claim isn't that is a better education, its that the schools cost more to run.

Why does it cost more to run? I’m not understanding why it’s 5 times the price. I actually sent my kids to a mixed school for a while it was between a BY and MO school had both types. It was very expensive and I wasn’t impressed with the education. We switched to a BY school and in my opinion my kids learn much more on a practical level and cover so much ground. I found they had lots of busy work that wasn’t necessary and didn’t really further their education in the mixed school. It wasn’t an official MO school so don’t know if that’s what it’s like but it seemed that they were trying to copy the MO style.

amother

Lilac

Fri, Oct 06 2023, 10:25 am

shabbatiscoming wrote:

I am sure modern orthodoxy is different in different locations.
I know how it was where and when I was groeing up. I also know when my parents were growing up (both in different parts of new york as secind generation afyer ww2) how the modern orthodox world is.

As for eho and when it began, look up rav shimshon refael hirsch. Im not going to give a history lesson here Smile

That really threw me off. I always associated Rav Shamshon Rafael Hirsch with the Breuers community in Washington Heights.

I did a quick Google search (Wikipedia) and it looks like its quite controversial and the MO community has translated his ideas differently than his descendants.

Are you actually saying that MO has its roots in Rav Shamshon Rafael Hirsch's philosophy? Or does the movement have various roots? Is Young Israel one root?

I really would like to understand it all. Not looking to get into a debate.

amother

Mauve

Fri, Oct 06 2023, 10:28 am

amother Pansy wrote:

Higher salaries and more spend on 'extras'.

amother

Vermilion

Fri, Oct 06 2023, 10:28 am

amother Pansy wrote:

I wrote above—it’s that teachers are paid more because the MO community is expensive to live in. Those in chinuch, while not making bank, are making a real living. There are also many more resources for struggling students. At some schools you actually find that resource rooms or resource classes have more jpf or even yeshivish kids in them because it’s not offered as much in more yeshivish schools.

amother

Eggplant

Fri, Oct 06 2023, 10:32 am

Do you feel because there are more leniencies and less pressure that there are also less problems with Jewish society such as shidduch crisis , get refusals , cheating, Shalom bayis etc... (Or anything that would be posted in issues of concern in frum society forum( in the MO world?

amother

Cerulean

Fri, Oct 06 2023, 10:33 am

amother Lilac wrote:

R'Hirsch was definitely a major influence, as was R' Kook. The Rambam also. Of course, R' Soloveitchik and R' Lichtenstein.

amother

Canary

Fri, Oct 06 2023, 10:37 am

amother Mauve wrote:

You used both words, so I used both words.

My point is you are assuming that the MO leadership reaction to tragedy is focused teshuva.

Now I'm confused. Shouldn't that be the first thing we need to do when tragedy strikes? Examine our ways to do teshuvah? Isn't that what Judaism is, all our naviim, over and over again? From what I remember, it was the neveai sheker that said - no, you don't need to do teshuvah, everything's ok?

amother

Canary

Fri, Oct 06 2023, 10:38 am

amother Cerulean wrote:

R'Hirsch was definitely a major influence, as was R' Kook. The Rambam also. Of course, R' Soloveitchik and R' Lichtenstein.

I have always bee told that they are completely separate movements. Torah im derech eretz and Torah umaadah.

shabbatiscoming

Fri, Oct 06 2023, 10:40 am

I will answer all recent questions after chag here. Shabbat and simchat torah start in about 20 minutes.
I just want to say rhat its been over all wonderful that this thread has continued wirh such respect for everyone.
Chag sameach and shabbat shalom!!!!!

amother

Lilac

Fri, Oct 06 2023, 10:41 am

amother Cerulean wrote:

R'Hirsch was definitely a major influence, as was R' Kook. The Rambam also. Of course, R' Soloveitchik and R' Lichtenstein.

What is the lineage? Who actually started it? Not who influenced it or where MO gets the sources. Who actually made it happen.

amother

Pansy

Fri, Oct 06 2023, 10:42 am

amother Eggplant wrote:

Why do you think there are less issues? Cheating is definitely a problem, many get divorced, I have MO family I don’t see less issues in any area. There are get refusals. They don’t do shidduch style dating so that’s a different story.

amother

Tiffanyblue

Fri, Oct 06 2023, 10:42 am

Gay Rabbi employed by MO synagogue:

https://forward.com/news/56311.....1431g

Articles discussing and quoting MO rabbis and institutions that have expressed support for LGBTQ:

https://www.hrc.org/resources/.....daism

https://forward.com/news/break.....odox/

Article quoting MO leader saying trans is fine in some circumstances and we should accept them as they present:

https://jewishjournal.com/judaism/182578/

Article quoting MO leader saying LGBTQ can teach in schools:

https://m.jpost.com/diaspora/article-733922

Article interviewing some rabbis who work for MO synagogues saying they would consider doing gay weddings:

https://www.google.com/amp/s/w...../amp/

amother

Mauve

Fri, Oct 06 2023, 10:44 am

amother Canary wrote:

As Shabbosiscoming said - is not common (in my observation) that in response to tragedy the response from MO leadership that everyone should work on a specific thing.

You were asking about the "specific thing".

amother

Canary

Fri, Oct 06 2023, 10:50 am

amother Mauve wrote:

So how do they respond?

amother

Eggplant

Fri, Oct 06 2023, 10:51 am

amother Pansy wrote:

because I feel a lot of the issues /challenges we have are because either we are restricted are take chumros too far , so because men feel.tons of power they don't give get which shoulnd happen in mo world. Because things are too tough unfortunately people go off the derech... because men as they were boys were not allowed to understand their hormones properly it caused them issues when they were married... so on and so forth.
I am from the forum community and not mo. But if there was one thing I envied them for the most would be that (ok presumingly that its true)

amother

Vermilion

Fri, Oct 06 2023, 10:57 am

amother Pansy wrote:

There are far fewer get refusals. Most couples sign the RCA prenup which so far has a 100% efficacy rate of preventing get refusals. I think RCA rabbis are required to have the couple sign it before they will do a wedding for them.

amother

Pansy

Fri, Oct 06 2023, 10:59 am

amother Eggplant wrote:

They have different pressures and other reasons these things are issues. There is a high rate that become not frum probably higher than other communities. Someone wrote an article on it recently. Men abuse power everywhere maybe in different ways but it’s not rainbow and unicorns.

amother

Pansy

Fri, Oct 06 2023, 11:00 am

amother Vermilion wrote:

This was put in a place as a solution to the issue, so it was an issue too.

amother

Mustard

Fri, Oct 06 2023, 11:01 am

amother Tiffanyblue wrote:

You’ve taken people some wouldn’t even consider MO and lumped them in. You totally distorted what Rabbi Weinreb said. It’s not “fine” - that’s not what he said. He said the people are trying to deal with juice, often teenagers and young adult, who are anxious, depressed, and often suicidal because of gender dysmorphia. So we can shut them, and they will either become totally unobservant or kill themselves or try and deal with it. And no way does he feel that it’s OK and teh optimal way to live. Perhaps the difference between you and MO is the ability to understand nuance and analyze things in an intelligent manner. It’s not all black and white. If you only knew how many people have become part of the modern orthodox community, because their parents no longer speak with them for a whole host of reasons. Or they were s-xually abused, which is more prevalent in the right wing community and for sure in teh chassidish community.