What do YOU think? (Chanuka Xmas style)

ElTam

Wed, Dec 28 2005, 12:21 pm

Not my style, whether its Xmas or Channukah.

Motek ↓

Wed, Dec 28 2005, 6:35 pm

when you consider that in their area, the homes are probably decorated for weeks with Xmas decorations, my first thought was - I think it's a nice idea

my second thought is that there's another way of going about this like by having a large menorah in the front yard that is lit every night\

and I'd like to know, for all those who think it's inappropriate, whether they give only gelt on Chanuka and not gifts, and what sort of succa decorations they put up (any tinsel, shiny stars ..)

↑ shayna82 ↓

Wed, Dec 28 2005, 6:52 pm

motek I like your thinking in that last question, I was thinking along the same lines!! Very Happy

↑ happyone

Wed, Dec 28 2005, 7:06 pm

actually , we don't do gifts....

shanie5 ↓

Wed, Dec 28 2005, 8:56 pm

so im now wearing a skirt made of chanukah fabric-with dreidels, menorahs and gelt, a long sleeve t-shirt that says happy chanukah, and dreidel earrings. I also have a chanukah sweatshirt and menorah earrings too. I am in the process of looking for a chanukah sweater.
my first reaction was "not for me". but that doesnt make it wrong either.
and why is a blow up menorah better? here, everybody has blow up santas, reindeer, etc... so a blow up menorah is just as "bad" as lights.
I'll just abstain from voting.

↑ binah918

Thu, Dec 29 2005, 5:12 am

Motek: Generally speaking, I don't think the decorations are appropriate...and yes, we only give gelt by Chanukah.

As for decorating the sukkah, we don't do this either. Although I don't see the connection between decorating the sukkah and other Xtian traditions. To me, there's a clear parallel between the Channukah and Xmas lights and between Channukah and Xmas presents. I don't see where the Xtian parallel is with Sukkos...? (Perhaps you do make a clear connection. I'm not suggesting that you're wrong, I just don't see it.)

Another thought for everyone: We, (as frum women), understand that this is one family's way of enjoying and celebrating Channukah. We understand that this is how they get into the "Channukah spirit."

But I'd argue that for a large majority of non-Jewish Americans, they won't necessarily see this as a celebration of Channukah, but rather a celebration of the "Holiday Season," which really means Xmas.

Growing up I lived in a number of small towns across the US, each with tiny Jewish populations. During the "Holiday Season," my teachers (at public school), friends, neighbors, even the people at the grocery store check-out, felt terrible for me that I "wasn't allowed" to celebrate Xmas.

They would try slip me Xmas cards and candy, (which of course I never accepted). But when Channukah would finally come around and my parents would give me gifts, everyone felt better that I was finally enjoying the "Holiday Season" like a "normal" little girl! These people had such good hearts, and it really bothered them that I "wasn't allowed" to enjoy the Xmas spirit, etc. But even with their good intentions, they just didn't understand that Channukah is NOT the Jewish Xmas. They didn't understand that our celebration of Channukah is NOT to make up for our lack of Xmas. They really beleived, (as much as we would tell them otherwise), they my family and I FELT BAD that we couldn't celebrate Xmas!

So come Channukah, no matter what we did and how we explained the chag and its traditions, they always felt that this was our way of making up for Judaism's lack of Xmas.

To get back to the picture, it's one thing if this family decorated their home because it's their sincere way of enjoying Channukah. BUT, reality is that many non-Jews will see these decorations and think that Jews feel "DEPRIVED" of Xmas and therefore try to do what they can to get in the "Holiday Spirit" in a more kosher context, (I.e. Channukah lights).

I'm not sure if what I wrote makes sense. Given my 15 years growing up in very Xtain communties, I feel very strongly about this! I can't tell you how many times people apoplogized that I couldn't celebrate Xmas! A few people even scolded my parents for "depriving" me of this "American" holiday! For this reason, I feel so strongly about making it clear that Channukah is NOT the Jewish response to Xmas! (And because of this, even though I received Channukah gifts growing up, I won't give to my children.)

I wouldn't be surprised if many of the women who like the lights grew up and now live in very Jewish communties. If your point of view is entirely frum, and Xmas really doesn't enter into your mind when you look at these lights, then yes, maybe this is a fun way to celebrate Channukah. But for women who, like myself, grew up in mixed or mostly non-Jewish environments, I think the connection to Xmas is just way too strong. And most importantly, for non-Jews and non-religious Jews I think this sends out a terrible message. Even if the message isn't true we can't control what others will think and from my own experience growing up I'll tell you that many Xtians think that Jews feel "deprived" of Xmas and therefore do what they can to make up for Xmas with Channukah.

There you go, just my two cents...!

↑ Motek ↓

Thu, Dec 29 2005, 6:27 am

interesting perspective Bina!

and shanie:

Quote:

really?!

that's amazing! Smile

but I notice that you didn't mention anything about your sneakers Wink

↑ chanala ↓

Thu, Dec 29 2005, 2:03 pm

Wow, Binah!! Very well said!!

binah918 wrote:

I don't see where the Xtian parallel is with Sukkos...?

The only reason I'd mentioned buying sukkah lights after xmas is because they're on sale now. We like to use the tiny white string lights and blue cable lights in our sukkah. It adds a beautiful ambience that a glaring floodlight just doesn't do for us. Smile

Quote:

We understand that this is how they get into the "Channukah spirit."

Yeesh. I wonder what they do to get into the "Passover spirit"? hang pieces of matzah from tree branches? Rolling Eyes

Quote:

But for women who, like myself, grew up in mixed or mostly non-Jewish environments, I think the connection to Xmas is just way too strong.

I think you have hit the nail squarely on the head. I just want to retch when I drive by some displays that are so tacky an airplane could use them to land!

↑ shanie5 ↓

Thu, Dec 29 2005, 3:29 pm

motek-do u know where I could get a pair of sneakers (or shoes) with menorahs and/or dreidels on them?

why did you say sneakers rather than shoes?

↑ Motek ↓

Thu, Dec 29 2005, 6:43 pm

shanie5 wrote:

why did you say sneakers rather than shoes?

becaaaause ....

↑ chanala

Thu, Dec 29 2005, 7:05 pm

Motek wrote:

shanie5 wrote:

why did you say sneakers rather than shoes?

becaaaause ....

Sneakers is the northeastern US way of saying tennis shoes, or gym shoes, or running shoes. Tongue Out

Every once is awhile I get one of those email quizzes "Are you really a Yankee?" That is always one of the questions. You also know you're a Yankee if you go to the bubbler after eating a grinder!

http://www.alphadictionary.com......html

NOW... I feel the need to edit for a caveat: You can be a Yankee without being a Yankee FAN! (And I have Chabad friends in my Mass. hometown who are rabid Boston Red Sox fans, so I feel relatively safe posting this) LOL

↑ shanie5 ↓

Thu, Dec 29 2005, 7:11 pm

motek- why do I have the feeling that this should be moved to the "do you know me" page?

chanala- for those who know me from way back, I NEVER wore shoes-only sneakers. to my wedding, to others weddings, and I'm not sure I even owned a pair of shoes then. so my question to motek was why "sneakers" (or tennis shoes or gym shoes etc..) as opposed to shoes. most people refer to what we wear on our feet as shoes-not sneakers.

so motek, are u gonna pm me w/ the reason for your wording?

daisy

Thu, Dec 29 2005, 7:12 pm

Shanie5, I agree, I also see lots of inflatable xmas decorations. And why don't you buy yourself some white sneakers and decorate them with puff paint?

stem

Thu, Dec 29 2005, 7:13 pm

Regarding the original question: I feel there are so many questions that are important to dwell on and have strong opinions about, but this one... I say let every family do what makes them happy (as long as it's not against halacha, or dangerous or against the law...).

↑ shanie5 ↓

Thu, Dec 29 2005, 7:15 pm

daisy- not a bad idea- maybe next year for chanukah I'll do that-thanx for the idea.

Rivka

Sun, Jan 01 2006, 5:02 am

I don't like the lights all over the house even for X-mas decorations, I think it all looks tacky. But I love the simple white or blue little lights that some houses have and not too much of it, that looks nice and it's nice for all year round.
If it had just little menorahs ina string of white lights I would say I love it.
But otherwise it looks mad.

Oh one thing I did love when I went to visit my rents was in town they have all the X-mas lights and one lights said "Merry x-mas, Happy Chanukah" and there was a menorah with a magen dovid. on it. Very nice.
I love the street lights, I don't really love the house lights.
I give presents because it's easier than giving money and at the end of the day the money is used to buy stuff.
I think when my toddler is older I will give money.
I don't see anything wrong with giving presents because it isn't on show and also do you put them under the menorah at home??

sarahd ↓

Sun, Jan 01 2006, 5:21 am

shanie5 wrote:

chanala- for those who know me from way back, I NEVER wore shoes-only sneakers. to my wedding,

I remember that! Sneakers with pretty sequins and studs, right?

↑ Motek ↓

Sun, Jan 01 2006, 7:05 pm

I sent the picture out as an email and asked for reactions. I got:

1)

Quote:

COOL!!!!

Quote:

coooool

Quote:

gut reaction 1...dunno the exact expression...azoi vi christalzach yiddalzach ....

gr2....what's wrong w a bit of jewish pride? why do we have any less right to be out there?

gr3...this aint our country...we have enough problems without putting ourselves in the spotlight.

gr4....cmon, this aint what we're about, where's the tzniut?

gr5...cute

Quote:

How nice. Just like x-mas, only Jewish

Quote:

it is unusual but I think it is a good idea.. especially if you have little kids.. my son (3) loves to see the lights when we drive.. it is a welcome thing to see lights dedicated to our festival of lights..

↑ shanie5

Sun, Jan 01 2006, 8:30 pm

thats right sarahd. I even have a picture of them-the photographer insisted on taking that one!!
motek-do u remember them?

↑ sarahd

Mon, Jan 02 2006, 5:12 am

What, you mean Motek was at your wedding and I missed getting to know her?!? LOL