A Very Special Wedding

↑ Hashem_Yaazor

Thu, Jul 20 2006, 3:23 pm

Motek wrote:

Hashem_Yaazor wrote:

mainly because it's a chromosomal abnormalty that is inherent in all the DNA and could very likely be transferred during meiosis.

Very likely? How could it NOT be transferred?

Because it's a trisomy of the 21st chromosome.
So when the cell splits to reproduce, half will have 1 as it should, and half will have 2, as it shouldn't.
So it is possible to have the split with the 1 chromosome become the basis of the new child. I think about half the cases of parents with DS reproducing result in infants with DS.

Please note there are different types of DS -- translocation and mosaic are two different ones -- that can alter what I am saying, and I don't think men with these kinds can have kids.

↑ DefyGravity ↓

Thu, Jul 20 2006, 3:30 pm

I have no experience whatsoever with special needs kids. I don't know if every city has a special school that caters to children that need extra help. It could be that for some people, this is the only option. Some kids don't like special schools because although they may be a little slow or just need some special attention, they're not stupid, and want to go to a regular school like the rest of their peers.

If someone is able to keep up in a regular school (even with extra tutoring and/or resource room), there's no reason they shouldn't attend. I have no experience in these matters, but I feel that the pros probably outweigh the cons. (Growing up, I only knew one girl my age w/ DS. She went to a regular public school and interacted very well with people her own age. I used to hang out with her, and I remember that she seemed very well adjusted and was a fun person to be with. I'm sure that her social savviness could be contributed to the fact that she went to a regular middle school).

These kids know they're different. They're going to be different their entire life. . . isn't it best to prepare them in school than to be pushed into the "mainstream" world as an adult?

↑ mumsy23 ↓

Thu, Jul 20 2006, 3:38 pm

Defy,

All I was saying is that although I always thought inclusion was the BEST with no real valid cons (if done properly) but southernbubby pointed out an issue that I never thought of. And it just made me think that there maybe other issues as well. I am studying towards a profession that has a lot to do with special needs and I learned a lot about the different classroom settings. Of course my teacher was all pro inclusion and that is probably why I have never heard of this con, or many others that may exist.

Its just interesting to hear another side of the story.

↑ DefyGravity ↓

Thu, Jul 20 2006, 3:43 pm

To me it just seems that the same problem that people have w/ inclusion can apply to anyone (special needs or not). Many people have difficulties once they finish high school or college. High school and college is viewed upon by many as years of coddling, and lots of people have a hard time adjusting to the real world after a lifetime of being spoon-fed. It can be a difficult adjustment for anyone. Yes, people that have special needs will (probably) need more help to adjust, but they'd probably need assistance, inclusion or not.

↑ mumsy23 ↓

Thu, Jul 20 2006, 3:54 pm

DefyGravity wrote:

Well no, because you make friends in highschool and then in college (which most special needs do not attend) so you still have a social circle. The point is that with special needs, they ar ein "inclusion" classes and they don't get to make friends with other special needs (if they were in a special school they would) and then after highschool people go on to college and have their friends while the special needs gets left behind. They don't become friends with the people in their class and once they are out of the classroom setting, they are lonely.

↑ mumsy23 ↓

Thu, Jul 20 2006, 4:01 pm

It means that they are included, so they will go to public school and be in a class with all non-special needs students.

my point was that if they didn't do "inclusion" they could be in a class of lets say 5 special needs kids. Then they would have a social cirlce that hopefully they can stay friends with even after highschool.

Its just less likely that they are going to stay friends with non-special needs after highschool. Those students go off to college or sem or what not and the special needs are left behind.

preggymama

Thu, Jul 20 2006, 4:25 pm

I know of a special-needs girl who went to a regular school. In high school everyone was nice to her and I think it was great for her to be in the "inclusion class" (am I using that word wrong??) . However, it is true that now, everyone else has gone on to to sem, marriage, babies etc and she is really alone. She doesnt know any other special needs girls who she would have much in common with. I know some of her classmates still make an effort to reach out to her -she comes to the weddings, celebrates birthdays etc but as time goes on and everyone else moves on in their lives, she will be left behind.

Raisin

Thu, Jul 20 2006, 6:54 pm

preggymama wrote:

Yes, I have a classmate (actually two classmates, but both with very different types of problems) just like that. Almost all of us have moved on married etc and to make matters worse, not one of my classmates stayed in our hometown after marriage, so even though we try and keep in touch, visit when we happen to be in town etc they are both now pretty lonely. And when we do visit what can we talk about? Our husbands (they can only dream of getting married, its unlikely) our children? Our jobs? All sensitive topics to them.

Sad

ChavieK ↓

Thu, Jul 20 2006, 8:15 pm

downsyndrome- when my son was born 15 months ago,someone in my community called & said "mazel tov I'm so happy you had a boy now we have a shiduch". One of the best phone calls I got! It's not fantasyland. Also I have "asked" about invitro if they are capable of raising a child.I haven't gotten an answer yet.
Inclusion keeps kids within their own communities & social circles. Ideally a frum school with the same hakafah, & kids on same academic level would work. Now go find x amount of kids with similar disabilities.....Maybe in NY but nowhere else.I want my son, after speaking to people involved, to be in a mainstremed classroom with whatever extra help he may need. One person told me her daughter went to public school in the am & yeshiva in pm.If you can work that out it would be great.

Ruchel

Fri, Jul 21 2006, 4:10 am

preggymama wrote:

I know of a special-needs girl who went to a regular school. In high school everyone was nice to her

That's beautiful... Here "special" people are still teased in university (I'm not kidding). Exploding anger

momof6

Sun, Aug 13 2006, 8:56 pm

Prof. Feurstien (I think that's how you spell his name)in E"Y, has done allot of research into DS, and other cognitive delays. He found that Ds children will copy the behavior around them. Therefore he recommends inclusion. We have an inclusive Preschool. I have seen DS children in inclusive settings do extremely well. In fact one little girl who receives EI as well as Ps is cognitively at age level! Smile

Interacting socially w/ other Ds children in middle school and HS is also important and there are agencies who provide that service.