Please explain to me what wanting woman to Lein Megilla is

amother

Lawngreen ↓

Mon, Mar 25 2024, 11:11 am

shabbatiscoming wrote:

partnership does not have to mean equal.

The question is what quince meant by equal. Equal in value, equally worthy of respect and decision making power? 100%.

Equal in terms of distribution of labor? No, my husband can’t be pregnant, give birth or nurse.

amother

↑ Bluebell ↓

Mon, Mar 25 2024, 11:14 am

amother Lawngreen wrote:

He can and should do other things instead of that

amother

↑ Lawngreen

Mon, Mar 25 2024, 11:20 am

amother Bluebell wrote:

He can and should do other things instead of that

Completely agree. My husband is in charge of cooking in our family to make up for it Smile

But that’s nothing compared to the 24/7 aches, pains and nausea of pregnancy and the agony of childbirth.

Jalapeño ↓

Mon, Mar 25 2024, 11:35 am

amother Holly wrote:

I didn’t read this thread at all but I just wanted to say that I for one do not like feminism. Please do not add more things to
my plate. It’s already too full as it is.

feminism is about opportunity and not doing things you don't want to do, while still providing other women-who aren't you- with the ability to do what they want.

you can build a meaningful life however you want, while also giving other women the ability to do the same. I really dislike this outdated second-wave feminist holdover that all women have to be in the workplace to be feminists.

Also, feminism has done a lot to increase recognition of the sweat and sacrifice that women contribute to the household and provide help and support for that; I don't see how that's bad for anyone here.

Last edited by Jalapeño on Mon, Mar 25 2024, 11:40 am; edited 1 time in total

amother

DarkYellow

Mon, Mar 25 2024, 11:40 am

amother Tan wrote:

Out of curiosity-to all the women who lane, do you do any other things women can (and according to some, are required to) do but isn’t universally accepted amongst orthodoxy? Like do you have a women’s zimun?

I don't lein, but 100% yes to a women's zimun. it's just very rare that I'm at a meal with only women these days.

amother

Blueberry ↓

Mon, Mar 25 2024, 11:51 am

im rw yeshivish. I never in my life felt inferior to a man.
ive never had interest in doing any manly things.

I literally cant relate to anyone who wants to do 'manly' things. I feel blessed to be a woman. and I feel content with the role I am given. and even more so, I dont feel limited in what I can acheive.

I understand that women feel differently then I do. I understand that there may be a place in yiddishkeit for these women to do what they want in this way (im not so knowledgeable bec I don't care to be)
BUT almost all the women in my life that I know (friends, family, neighbors coworkers etc...) are like me. no one sits around depressed that their lives are 'less than' and they have 'less mitzvos'
I definitely have more intellectual leaning friends/family. and guess what - they learn and give shiurim! and guess what? they go to shul every week! and no - its not a whole dramatic feminist statement. it just IS.

I think the issue with more modern feminism is that it creates a problem that now needs a solution.

↑ spikta

Mon, Mar 25 2024, 12:06 pm

amother Tan wrote:

I didn't use to growing up, but DH is makpid in our house that if there's no men's zimun but there is a women's zimun, that the women should do a zimun. He says that people are so afraid of feminism that they forget the shulchan aruch came first LOL

amother

↑ OP ↓

Mon, Mar 25 2024, 12:13 pm

amother Blueberry wrote:

Exactly this. Every word.

fmt4

Mon, Mar 25 2024, 12:16 pm

amother Blueberry wrote:

Did you ever think that maybe you feel this way because…. You’ve been conditioned to feel that way? It’s fine to be OK with it, but at least acknowledge that it’s benefitting someone…. And it’s not usually women.

amother

↑ OP ↓

Mon, Mar 25 2024, 12:17 pm

fmt4 wrote:

What's wrong with being conditioned to thinking correctly?

amother

Nectarine ↓

Mon, Mar 25 2024, 12:24 pm

amother Blueberry wrote:

That’s the thing, none of these women are sitting around depressed. They are happily going about their own lives, serving HaShem in the best way they can. OP decided to open up this thread to bash them.

amother

↑ Bluebell ↓

Mon, Mar 25 2024, 12:32 pm

amother OP wrote:

What's wrong with being conditioned to thinking correctly?

If you were conditioned, how do you know it’s correct? If you would give me clear arguments to support this then I would be ready to think its correct. It seems to me that you think it’s correct because it’s comfortable.

Do you have arguments to support your idea with?

amother

↑ OP ↓

Mon, Mar 25 2024, 12:33 pm

amother Narcissus wrote:

Bashing? Not really. Trying to understand that's all.

amother

↑ Blueberry ↓

Mon, Mar 25 2024, 12:48 pm

fmt4 wrote:

thats a moot point.

all of are conditioned to think one way or another.

maybe you were conditioned to be unhappy with the status quo?

also your question implies the same idea that comes up here again and again - that the big bad evil men have somehow manipulated our religion to give themselves all the power and suppress women.
I know good, kindhearted and respectful men. (I also know of abusive terrible men - but that is not related to religion, I also know abusive terrible women)

my point was that in my upbringing - women were never made to feel "less' and I never felt like I couldnt achieve greatness. but I learnt that I dont need to be a man and to do male things to get there - I can do it by being a woman and doing womanly things

↑ chanatron1000 ↓

Mon, Mar 25 2024, 12:54 pm

amother Blueberry wrote:

ive never had interest in doing any manly things.

I literally cant relate to anyone who wants to do 'manly' things. I feel blessed to be a woman. and I feel content with the role I am given. and even more so, I dont feel limited in what I can acheive.

I'm wearing size 10 shoes. I literally can't relate to anyone who wants to wear size 8. I feel very satisfied with size 10, it doesn't pinch, while being snug enough to fit on my foot and not fall off.

amother

↑ Blueberry ↓

Mon, Mar 25 2024, 12:59 pm

amother Narcissus wrote:

That’s the thing, none of these women are sitting around depressed. They are happily going about their own lives, serving HaShem in the best way they can.

ok then I can respect that even I don't relate to or understand it.
I was addressing other posters who seem to be very bothered and down about perceived inequality and oppression.

just another point. Rebbetzin batshva kanievsky has a great story where a woman who was starting to put on a burka came to her - the family was desperate to try and stop this woman from joining that group.
she explained to the rebbetzin that she was just trying to be like sara imeinu! nothing WRONG with wearing a burka.. in fact you could say she is more tznius and connected to Hashem!!
the rebbetzin gently told her - first lets try to be like sara shenirer and then we can try to be like sara imeinu.

and her point was simple but brilliant. no one is saying you cant wear a burka. no one is saying you shouldnt lein megillah. in fact - no one is even saying (halachikly) a woman cant wear tefillin (rashis daughters were known to have worn)!
but the idea is to keep your priorities in place and first try to fulfill your basic obligations and then work on getting to the next level.

I guess I dont relate to the megillah leiners because I am still trying to work on the basic mitzvos that were gifted to me (and by me I dont even mean to women only.)
my tznius, my shabbos, my taharas mishpacha, my basic davening (if im lucky to have a spare minute in my day etc)

amother

↑ Blueberry ↓

Mon, Mar 25 2024, 1:01 pm

chanatron1000 wrote:

yes, I wanted to explain before I started that I am for sure coming from a different place than other women on this thread.

thank you for taking the trouble to clarify.

it doesn't disqualify my opinion. it just gives me a different perspective and I really am interested in understanding other peoples worldview because it expands mine.