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↑ Ema of 5 ↓

Sun, Nov 28 2021, 8:41 pm

b.chadash wrote:

That is an interesting observation.
Rashi says about the word Kedaisha that it refers to a woman who is separated and sanctified specifically for this purpose.
So maybe a Zonah is stam an immoral woman, who seduces men, but a Kedaisha is one whose sole occupation is prostitution.

These are totally my own thoughts, so don't quote me on it. But possibly, when he first sees her, he thinks "here is a zonah." He looks at her with disgust. And then Hashem put in his mind that he should use her services. They make a negotiation, and then he has relations with her. Once he had that experience with her, he sees her differently. She is no longer a lowly "zonah", but a kedaisha- one who is a proffessional harlot, who earns her living this way. Once he himself used her services, he views her as a legitimate "kedaisha", not just some random zonah. His own participation in the deed legitmizes her.

Later, when he hears about Tamar being pregnant, and not knowing that he is the father, once again, she is a zona, because it has nothing to do with him. Meaning, he looks at what she did with disgust, an immoral act done like a zonah.

Interesting, I thought I remember learning kedaisha is from kadosh- holy.

↑ b.chadash ↓

Sun, Nov 28 2021, 9:15 pm

I heard a very profound idea from Rabbi YY Jacobson in the name of the Lubavitcher rebbe.

When Yosef interprets the dreams for Pharoah, Pharoah is so impressed with Yosef's unparralleled genius that he makes him viceroy. He says, "there is no man smarter and wiser than you.."

He asks two questions:
1. What was so genius about what Yosef said? The medrash says that the wise men of Mitzrayim had their own interpretations. One said that the fat cows eating the skinny cows represents the idea that he would have 7 daughters and then he would bury 7 daughters. Or that he would conquer 7 countries and be defeated by 7 countries. So it's not like they had no explanation. Along comes Yosef and says, the Fat cows represents plenty of food. Fat grain represents plenty of wheat. Skinny cows represents hunger! Skinny wheat represents no food.

Why is that so brilliant? It would seem to be a pretty obvious interpretation. If you see a picture of fat men- you know it's because they are surrounded by plenty of food. If you see a picture of emaciated people, you imagine they have been starving, so there is no food. It doesn't take a rocket scientist to work this one out. So why was Pharaoh so blown away by his genius?

2. After Yosef interprets the dream, he says, "and now, appoint a wise man to store grain during the years of hunger for the years of famine." Why did Yosef give Pharoah advice? Pharoah wasn't asking for advice, only for his dream interpretation. In fact, volunteering his 2 cents is tantamount to being mored bemalchus. Also, what is so brilliant about advising Pharaoh to store food for later. Isn't that a pretty obvious solution to the problem?

The answer is in the words of the dream that everyone misses. It says that pharoah saw in his dream 2 sets of cows standing together at the banks of the river. The Key word is "together". It signified that somehow the two events had to happen simultaneously. So one wise man said you will have 7 daughters and bury 7 daughters. Pharaoh could have had 100 wives, so it's no big deal to have 7 daughters and at the same time bury 7. He could also have conquered 7 countries while at the same time losing 7 countries. It is not a contradiction and it could happen simultaneously. But it's not possible to conceive of a situation where there could be plenty of food concurrently with a hunger. Either there is a lot of food or there isn't.

But Yosef figured it out. When he gave his "advice" to appoint a smart man, it wasn't actually a suggestion, it was part of the I interpretation. He was saying that the solution is in the dream itself- in the idea that the cows were standing together at the same time.

He was saying that during the seven years of plenty, the finance minister needs to prudently put away for the years of famine. By doing so, the people will be experiencing both the plenty and the famine simultaneously. Every time they put away food, they are reminding themselves that the hunger is coming. Then, during the years of hunger, they will take out the food they put aside earlier. So even during the years of hunger, they are living with the plenty because they are living off the years that they put aside food. That is what the 2 sets of cows standing together signified.

The message is that at times we go through periods in our lives when we feel we are on top of the world and at times we feel empty,, spiritually and emotionally. During the times that we feel we are doing well, we have "plenty", either financially, spiritually, emotionally etc. During those times we need to invest in ourselves, in our marriages, in our relationship with our kids, in our relationship with Hashem, etc, so that during the times of "hunger" we won't be left with nothing.

↑ b.chadash ↓

Sun, Nov 28 2021, 9:17 pm

Ema of 4 wrote:

Interesting, I thought I remember learning kedaisha is from kadosh- holy.

The root is the same. Kadosh means separating the holy from the mundane. It's the idea of separation. So too, kedeisha refers to being separated for a specific purpose. This is according to Rashi.

PinkFridge ↓

Sun, Nov 28 2021, 9:35 pm

Ema of 4 wrote:

Interesting, I thought I remember learning kedaisha is from kadosh- holy.

There are many words that mean their opposites as well.

↑ keym

Sun, Nov 28 2021, 9:40 pm

I'm going to share my personal favorite medrash. It gives me great comfort. From Parshas Vayeishev
The medrash tells us the shevatim were eating. Reuven was in sackcloth mourning. Yaakov was mourning. Yosef was davening in chains. Binyomin was crying. Yehuda, he went to find himself a wife. And what was Hashem Yosborach doing? He was planting the seeds to bring the geulah and the roots of Melech hamashiach.
Everything has a plan. And Hashem has it all in hand, even if it seems so confusing.

↑ b.chadash ↓

Sun, Nov 28 2021, 9:45 pm

PinkFridge wrote:

There are many words that mean their opposites as well.

Yes. But in this case, it's not so much the opposite as the same idea. Kadosh connotes separation. Holiness is only "kadosh" because it is separate from chol.

When a chassan says, "harei at mekudeshes li", he isn't saying you are Holy to me, he is saying you are separated for me. You are now prepared just for me because you are being separated from the possibility of being for other men.

A kedeisha is separated from the normal human relationship and is instead dedicated to her craft of prostitution. Nothing holy about her.

Last edited by b.chadash on Sun, Nov 28 2021, 9:46 pm; edited 1 time in total

allthingsblue

Sun, Nov 28 2021, 9:46 pm

B.chadash, thank you so much for posting. That’s so incredible

↑ b.chadash ↓

Sun, Nov 28 2021, 9:50 pm

allthingsblue wrote:

B.chadash, thank you so much for posting. That’s so incredible

You're welcome. I was pretty blown away by this idea as well. I thought it was beautiful. Also, the way Rabbi YY puts it down is amazing.

↑ PinkFridge ↓

Sun, Nov 28 2021, 9:59 pm

b.chadash wrote:

Yes, that's what so amazing. I'm sure there's something similar about the words that seem opposites but don't have such an answer.

Sarah S

Sun, Nov 28 2021, 10:01 pm

The midrash says in parshas vyishlach while talking about Rachel's death writes that when a women gives birth she Is judged on the 3 mitzvahs specific for women. 1 lighting shabbas candles 2 hafrashes challah 3 taharas hamishpacha.
I found it amazing that tznuis was not part of the 3 mitzvahs
In school we were taught that tznuis is number 1 and baking challah should only be done if one has time and energy.... when in actuality challah should be 1 of the most important things a women should do.

↑ b.chadash ↓

Sun, Nov 28 2021, 10:05 pm

keym wrote:

Yes this is a beautiful medresh.
We see a similar idea by the destruction of Sedom. While Hashem was busy destroying Sedom, He was planting the seed for the roots of Moshaich. Avrohom was devastated that his tefilla of saving Sedom was being rejected, but meanwhile Hashem was saving that which needed to be saved, the seed of the Bnos Lot which eventually spawned Rus.

↑ b.chadash ↓

Sun, Nov 28 2021, 10:13 pm

Sarah S wrote:

True. The idea that many women don't bake challa is because we don't realize the importance of this mitzva for women. In fact, the meforshim decry the idea that women buy bakery challa, because it has lessened the chashivus of this mitzva.

As far as tznius goes, there are other midrashim that talk about how essential tznius is for a woman, such as the medrash of why Hashem created Chava from a hidden tzela. So that she should be tzanua. Also, chazal point out how tzanua sara was, that she stayed in the tent. Also Tamar, that Yehuda never actual saw her,although she lived in his house.

As to what you said that in school you were taught that challa should only be baked if one has time and energy, are you sure that is what you were taught? I never heard that, though it is what many people will just assume. I can't imagine a teacher saying that, since there is no basis in that at all.

↑ GLUE ↓

Sun, Nov 28 2021, 10:46 pm

On Shobbos I heard this don't remember who was quoted

Why in the middle of the story with Yosf does it stop and start talking about Yehuda and Tamer? Why not finish the story?

With Yosf going to Mizriam is Galus. Meshia is going to come from Yehuda, so Hashem is showing that He is propearing for the Gualah even before Yosf gets to Mizriam.

imorethanamother ↓

Mon, Nov 29 2021, 12:28 am

Sarah S wrote:

Such an interesting question. I think we can never understand what is “important” or not. When a woman gives birth it makes sense that she would be judged based on a מצוות עשה instead of a לא תעשה. What does a woman choose to do.

This daf in Brachos is particularly interesting about what men are judged on when they put themselves in precarious situations, and it’s not necessarily a מצוות עשה but how they conduct themselves and their middos. I don’t know why women are different.
https://www.sefaria.org/Berakh.....ng=bi

↑ imorethanamother ↓

Mon, Nov 29 2021, 12:31 am

b.chadash wrote:

I never truly understood this. Undoubtedly there are about thousands more pairings that need to happen before Mashiach since the time of Sdom. But these three - Lot/daughter, yehuda/Tamar, boaz/rus - are the only unconventional ones fit to be mentioned? If Mashiach always has to come in a roundabout way then is every single relationship afterwards also unconventional?

mushkamothers

Mon, Nov 29 2021, 2:42 am

imorethanamother wrote:

An answer to a similar question (why so much controversy in the ancestors of moshiach) is that Satan wouldn't allow the nshama to descend / holy souls had to have sketchy circumstances to make it into this world. This obviously brings up even more questions but it's an explanation for dovid and batsheva story.

↑ PinkFridge ↓

Mon, Nov 29 2021, 8:20 am

Sarah S wrote:

Go back earlier to Sora's tent. Those three mitzvos are mentioned there.
You know, tznius is a discrete mitzvah. We make specific decisions for tznius all the time, no, I can't find skirts in this store, or, I wish that the neckline were better, etc. But there's another way to look at tznius as a template for our lives. We are people who are hatzneia leches and that informs everything else.

(And remember, Micha was speaking to men too.)
(And also, can you imagine being judged for tznius in the first sense during childbirth? Of course we make efforts. I kept a comfortable snood on. But you can be sure I wore whatever hospital robe I was given and sorry if people saw my elbows.)
(And does tznius take a few hours from beginning to end, like challah? Will the stress of making the decisions for tznius possibly affect erev Shabbos sholom or other aspects of sholom bayis?)

↑ PinkFridge ↓

Mon, Nov 29 2021, 8:22 am

imorethanamother wrote:

Maybe the others weren't of the same stature, and we didn't need to learn their stories.

↑ b.chadash ↓

Mon, Nov 29 2021, 8:41 am

imorethanamother wrote:

Like Mushkamothers said, generally the lesson is that the Satan tries mightily to prevent the ultimate redemption from emerging, and so the seed of Moshiach has to come about in mysterious and unexpected ways, so as to "fool" the Satan.

I think the message there is that there is often much more than meets the eye. (Rabbi Glatstein has a beautiful shiur on this subject, I can try to link if you are interested.)

But another idea that is brought out in that Medresh about Yehuda and Tamar, and also in the story of Lot and his daughters, is that in the midst of upheaval and what seems like a time of "Din", Hashem is meanwhile busy thinking about the ultimate redemption. We, with our mortal eyes, can only see destruction, pain, hopelessness and despair.

Yaakov's family was going through a lot of strife amd turmoil. The narrative is charged and heartbreaking. And in the middle of all this, Yehuda goes and has a liason with a harlot. It's odd. And yet, the message is that Hashem orchestrated it all, and davka when we think things are bad, He is working behind the scenes on a larger plan, for our ultimate good.

I think we can say the same with Rus and Boaz. There was a famine. Elimelech abandons his people, moves to Moav, his children intermarry, then they die. Naomi is left alone and bereft. It seems so hopeless. And yet, Hashem caused the family from Beis Lechem to go to Moav to aquire or reclaim the precious "lost object" that was Rus.

↑ GLUE ↓

Mon, Dec 06 2021, 1:23 am

On Zoz Chanuka I will write something about Chanuka

Heard this by a party not shore who was quoted:

Why do we eat doughnuts on Chanuka?
So that we will say a Mizonos and Al'Hamicha, because it talks about the Karbonus in Al'Hamicha

There are 8 days to remember Bris Melia
There is always a Shobbos on Chanuka
There is always Rosh Chodesh on Chanuka
We have parties so someone would say a good Vort making sure we have Torah on Chanuka.

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