Tv on shabbes on timer

Ruchel ↓

Sun, Oct 07 2007, 11:38 am

I was aware that many Mo put the tv on timer and/or programmed the tivo to play whatever they want to see in advance. But recently I had this conversation with a very frum girl.

Girl: I got the dvds of the last season of Stargate sg1 for the new year, did you see that Daniel....
Me: aaargh don't tell me anything, I still have to see it, I'm still in the 7th season
G: ok, if you watch some over shabbes tell me so I know what we can discuss
me: huh
G: what
me: well...
G: oh you're SO outdated! everyone does it! you program the dvd player before shabbes and you put the tv on the timer, and there it goes!
me: I thought you told me you're never bored on shabbes
G: of course not, but now I see why YOU are

Is she right? am I sooooo outdated? is that even controversial??
It has happened to me as a teen to leave the tv on but it was a huge pain to have the noise constantly in the living room. I heard of the timer/programming, but didn't know it was that common in very frum, almost charedi circles (now ok I know in France a charedi is not seen necessarily as charedi outside and so on, but still).

greenfire ↓

Sun, Oct 07 2007, 11:41 am

anyone who's in the mood can find a heter for anything ... after all she is NOT doing anything ...

but is it really shabbosdik ... NOPE ...

so just base your doings not on what everyone is doing ... Shabbos is not a trend ... it's a way of life !!!

Tamiri

Sun, Oct 07 2007, 11:50 am

Ruchel, I don't know what constitutes MO in France (we did deal with the clothing issues a while back) but no orthodox person would use a TV on Shabbat to watch garbage. If CVC there is an emergency, like the Gulf War, there were heterim to leave on radio/tv but that's it. No timer.

↑ Ruchel ↓

Sun, Oct 07 2007, 11:57 am

Apparently here they do. I wouldn't say it's garbage, just some sci fi stuff, pretty clean. I didn't know you need a heter for a tv on timer, isn't it like a light on timer?

French Mo is shabbes + kashrus to the minimum, Mo machmir is more machmir on shabbes and kashrus + effort on tznius and other things like that. But this girl is soooo not modern (she is even considering wearing tights all year, which would probably put her in the lightest charedim), which is why I was surprised.

↑ chocolate moose ↓

Sun, Oct 07 2007, 12:03 pm

Rov Moshe only held by lights on a timer. Yes, these days, ppl put much much more, especially for health reasons, but it's way far from his original psak - cetainly entertainment is!

↑ Ruchel ↓

Sun, Oct 07 2007, 12:10 pm

NY2434 wrote:

By leaving the TV on on Shabbes, I dont think you are oiver on anything, it is like leaving your lights, AC on. But it definitely is not shabbesdik

I did a quick google search on the topic, and found tooooons of people wondering if they can have tv, radio... apparently outside of Israel it's less "worse", but non shabbosdik and the rabbis don't like it. So it's common but to avoid, as I thought. Thanks for the answers ladies!

↑ greenfire ↓

Sun, Oct 07 2007, 12:11 pm

ruchel ... it's not that you wouldn't find people in the states doing it ... it's just still not exactly shabbosdik ... takes away from the full sense of spirituality

↑ Ruchel ↓

Sun, Oct 07 2007, 12:13 pm

chocolate moose wrote:

Does the TV have to be on to record something?

I think it depends on the recorder. Mine doesn't. There's a great show on Friday night (unfortunately) so we record it.

Lechatchila Ariber ↓

Sun, Oct 07 2007, 5:13 pm

Ruchel wrote:

greenfire wrote:

but is it really shabbosdik ... NOPE ...

what I thought too. But are books really better? I wonder.

many people don't read secular books on shabbos.

I never heard of orthodox people leaving TV on a timer unless they were orthodox rebels.
(the only time I heard of it being acceptable was during the gulf war where people left TVs on and radios on, BUT they closed them off in cupboards or closed off rooms and only went to check them during news hour.)

I doubt its allowed and is not comparable with lights and air con.
whereas lights and air-cons/heaters are there to help us enjoy and honor shabbos properly, having a TV on takes away from the kovod of shabbos.
see the difference?

shalhevet ↓

Sun, Oct 07 2007, 5:30 pm

Shabbos clocks are only allowed for heat/AC and light (as are Shabbos non jews).

You are also not allowed to have noise in your house from an assur activity - for example, you are not allowed to leave your dryer on on Shabbos even though you started it before Shabbos. I remember on the thread about a cleaner coming on YT, someone said her rav had said she wasn't allowed to vacuum - presumably for the same reason.

Those are the purely halachic reasons, apart, of course, from it not being a Shabbosdik activity (at the very least).

↑ greenfire ↓

Sun, Oct 07 2007, 5:34 pm

so if you're alarm clock radio goes off by mistake ... what do we do ... RUN?!?!?! is there time to get out of pj's or is that not allowed ...

I really don't think it's about the noise ...

↑ Lechatchila Ariber ↓

Sun, Oct 07 2007, 5:34 pm

In general there is a great misconception about getting a [gentile] to do melocha for you on shabbos.

You can't just get him to do anything for you and you can't just get him to do it in any old way.

↑ shalhevet ↓

Sun, Oct 07 2007, 5:39 pm

greenfire wrote:

so if you're alarm clock radio goes off by mistake ... what do we do ... RUN?!?!?! is there time to get out of pj's or is that not allowed ...

I really don't think it's about the noise ...

Are you serious, greenie? Of course, if it was by mistake then there's nothing you can do. (I've left alarm clock radios and driers on by mistake before). You are allowed to use an alarm clock - I suppose because it's not the noise of doing an issur - dunno.

↑ greenfire ↓

Sun, Oct 07 2007, 5:54 pm

what about the ringing phones ... they annoy me so much ... when I hear phones ring in someones house I feel as if they are מחלל שבת - I turn mine off ... but I feel like EVERYONE should Exclamation

↑ Lechatchila Ariber ↓

Sun, Oct 07 2007, 6:05 pm

greenfire I've thought about that many times, but the knowledge that I'll forget to turn it back on after shabbos stops me from turning it off.
What

on yomtov we had one afternoon and evening someone ringing every 10 minutes.
they figured out the amount of time it takes for our answering machine to pick up and would hang up just before, but enough time for the answering machine to pick up anyway and for us to hear.
(I assume they were trying to save money, but didn't realize they were too late each time anyway Twisted Evil

)

shoshb

Sun, Oct 07 2007, 6:09 pm

I just went on a big rant on another thread about not quoting R' MOshe unless you've actually read his Tshuva, but.......
I learned that R' Moshe paskened that one may only use timers on Shabbos/Yom Tov for lights, and not for TV etc. Anyone seen it inside that can confirm???????