Is this worth a fight?

↑ amother ↓

Sat, Sep 08 2007, 5:06 pm

telling her she cant have them and throwinbg them oyut DEFINATELY wont help and will just make it WORSE!! just love her, show her u are there for her and tell her that she knows what u think and now that she is a big girl she can make her own decisions but it is your hope that shell choose the right things......

if u want to have a relationship with ure daughter thats where u need to leave it otherwise it will get worse and worse..... also I think u should apologize for throwing out her underwear. hey at least she asked u at first and was open with u! id say if she asks u things u can always answer... I dont feel its right but u are big and can make ure own deciosions.... then she wont feel shes rebvelling if she doesnt do it and might actually get back on track.... are things botehring her at home or school that she feels she needs to rebell??

↑ amother ↓

Mon, Sep 10 2007, 9:12 pm

OP Again.

I do feel that in this case, it is OK to look at her stuff. She has snuck out of the house in the middle of the night. She spoke with boys when we forbade it. I found cigarettes in her pocket book once.

During a low point, DH pulled her out of school, and sent her to PS with the low lifes. She saw how the "other half" lives, and wanted to turn around and go back to a frum school. While she was in PS, we had a great relationship. She spoke with me, confided to me, we were getting along really well. Then, she goes back to a frum school, and the disrespect and disregard for our rules started all over again. It is almost like, she is frum when no one is shoving it down her throat. But as soon as someone tells her to do this or do that, she freaks.

As of now, no one has mentioned the underwear, and I am letting it go. Thanks for all your help. Although I still do not see how it is more comfortable. (I like bikini undies, and they sit just right on me.)

↑ mummiedearest

Mon, Sep 10 2007, 9:23 pm

when she stopped going to public school, did you send her back to her original school? many kids have problems being told what to do in frum schools. she may need a different type of school. each kid needs to be educated according to their personality. this is, unfortunately, not completely possible in this day and age, but it's worth trying.

Rav Hirsch wrote an interesting essay on education. I haven't read it recently, but if I remember correctly, he states that many of eisav's problems stemmed from the fact that he had a learning disability and wasn't educated accordingly. (not that I am comparing your daughter to eisav, nor will she turn out to be like eisav if not educated differently.) interesting thought, huh?

I'm sorry you're having a hard time with her, much hatzlachah. in terms of when to look through her things, looking for cigarettes or drugs is understandable and acceptable (though your daughter won't agree with me). specifically looking for underwear will do you no good and will get you in trouble with your daughter if she finds out. especially if she is acting as you say she is. so my advice to you is to leave her personal things alone unless you suspect something physically dangerous is hidden within.

↑ amother

Tue, Nov 13 2007, 3:51 am

Is this worth a fight? Only if thongs are forbidden al pi halacha and you have a psak from your Rav to back you up. All sorts of women wear thongs even the chassidim. A few months ago I went to help out a neighbor in our block who had fallen and could not get out of bed. One day I emptied her washer and hung the things for her. I was really very surprised to see that her panties were all thongs, I had a stereotype in mind that told me that was not what chassidish women wear. Off topic but as everyone else has had their say, I don't know how anyone can wear them, give me a full panty any day! And yes I have tried them!