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amother
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 Wed, Jul 27 2016, 2:54 pm
| amother wrote: | | No one wants to take away your religious rights. But you have to use your own money to educate your kids how you see fit instead of using tax dollars. |
Uh, I actually do. I pay tuition thanks.
Government funds is used for LUNCH, BOOKS and other things that every school is entitled to.
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Maya
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Wed, Jul 27 2016, 3:19 pm
| amother wrote: | | Like what? Wanting to be a well rounded educated person in both Jewish and Secular studies while also being culturally knowledgeable enough to have a decent conversation with people outside of my community? Are those deep "issues" that I should be concerned about or see a therapist for because I grew up Satmar? |
You want to be a well rounded educated person? What exactly is stopping you?
I've spent the past ten years making up for what knowledge I lacked, which was mostly in arts and culture and a few minor historical details. Big frikkin deal, that I had to do that on my own. I also earned a degree and am finding my way into a career. And I don't consider myself above average smart or capable.
Maybe you SHOULD see a therapist if this anger is holding you back from pursuing what you want in your life.
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amother
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Wed, Jul 27 2016, 3:21 pm
| amother wrote: | Uh, I actually do. I pay tuition thanks.
Government funds is used for LUNCH, BOOKS and other things that every school is entitled to. |
If you are paying for tuition then why not pay for everything else? Why do you want the govt to pay for things that you can or should be able to afford?
I don't believe that every school is entitled to funding, the kids are entitled to it if they qualify.
Does every Satmar kid qualify for lunch money? If so, why? And why do they need lunch money if they only get a secular education for 3 hours a day (which btw, should not qualify for any funding) instead of the required 6-7 hours (or equivalent to public school)? And do the girls actually get their own metro cards like kids from other schools get or does the money go somewhere else?
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Maya
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Wed, Jul 27 2016, 3:22 pm
| sequoia wrote: | | Because you don't have the "right" to systematically deprive your kids of an adequate education! That's not a real right! That's a made-up one! |
I totally agree.
But this is more of an issue for boys than girls.
I'm also with the poster who blames the government. It's very obvious that they are looking the other way in order to appease the politicos powers. It's a disgrace.
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amother
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Wed, Jul 27 2016, 3:22 pm
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So sad that such an innocent thread became a satmar/school bashing thread. Can't we ever just have a normal light discussion for a change?
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amother
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Wed, Jul 27 2016, 3:40 pm
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Back to original purpose of this thread. I went to BYA. Definitely not a poster child. People are shocked when they hear I went there. They were not thrilled with my pursuit of higher education. Too stereotypical gender roles for me. Would not send my kids there.
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sequoia
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Wed, Jul 27 2016, 3:59 pm
| Maya wrote: |
I've spent the past ten years making up for what knowledge I lacked, which was mostly in arts and culture and a few minor historical details. Big frikkin deal, that I had to do that on my own. |
Oy...
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happybeingamom
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Wed, Jul 27 2016, 4:12 pm
The reason for the lunch program has nothing to do with the quality of the education, WIC is the same thing.
Both of those programs are to ensure that children get adequate nutrition so they develop and grow properly. Please take this out of your argument.
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Maya
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Wed, Jul 27 2016, 4:13 pm
Again, let's separate the career aspect from the general education aspect.
It's clear to all who know me that I greatly value a well rounded education, which is why we put our kids into MO schools, where my four year old brings home a Megillah with each panel decorated in the style of a different great artist, which they had expounded on and taught in depth to the kids. It makes me so happy.
But is that really a necessity for someone to become an office manager or accountant or speech therapist, or even a doctor? So Satmar skipped over some literature and art courses that make a person well rounded. So what? Does that mean that their students can't go on to higher education in a field that interests them?
I don't understand why you're so "oy-ed" by this 
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sequoia
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Wed, Jul 27 2016, 4:29 pm
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I'm sorry, I'm really truly not explaining this properly! And it's nonsense anyway.
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Maya
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Wed, Jul 27 2016, 4:31 pm
| sequoia wrote: | | I'm sorry, I'm really truly not explaining this properly! And it's nonsense anyway. |
So can you explain properly?  What am I misunderstanding?
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amother
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Wed, Jul 27 2016, 4:35 pm
| Maya wrote: | Again, let's separate the career aspect from the general education aspect.
It's clear to all who know me that I greatly value a well rounded education, which is why we put our kids into MO schools, where my four year old brings home a Megillah with each panel decorated in the style of a different great artist, which they had expounded on and taught in depth to the kids. It makes me so happy.
But is that really a necessity for someone to become an office manager or accountant or speech therapist, or even a doctor? So Satmar skipped over some literature and art courses that make a person well rounded. So what? Does that mean that their students can't go on to higher education in a field that interests them?
I don't understand why you're so "oy-ed" by this |
Not everyone wants to be an accountant or office manager so if I wanted a different type of career then they should have offered different types of classes which they didnt do either. Why was I forced to take the same classes as you if my goals were different than yours?
But that is the beauty of offering electives along with core classes so girls can pick classes according to their needs and interests which satmar did not offer. If they were accredited or following the NYC guidelines then you would not have had to spend 10 years of playing "catch up" with everyone else, you would have learned it in high school and expanded your knowledge in college.
And btw, you need chemistry and science labs etc to become a doctor and I believe those are some of the pre-reqs for speech therapy as well. So yes, these classes are equally as important as arts and literature, etc.
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amother
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Wed, Jul 27 2016, 4:43 pm
| happybeingamom wrote: | The reason for the lunch program has nothing to do with the quality of the education, WIC is the same thing.
Both of those programs are to ensure that children get adequate nutrition so they develop and grow properly. Please take this out of your argument. |
Private schools need to offer an education that is equivalent to public schools for the kids to qualify for funding but Satmar doesnt offer an equivalent education which means that the kids don't qualify for funding just for being in school 3 hours a day. And not all kids qualify for funding, there are guidelines (similar to food stamps and/or wic) that kids need to meet in order to qualify. The question is, how is it that every Satmar kid meets the qualifications for lunch money?
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amother
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Wed, Jul 27 2016, 4:53 pm
| amother wrote: | | Private schools need to offer an education that is equivalent to public schools for the kids to qualify for funding but Satmar doesnt offer an equivalent education which means that the kids don't qualify for funding just for being in school 3 hours a day. And not all kids qualify for funding, there are guidelines (similar to food stamps and/or wic) that kids need to meet in order to qualify. The question is, how is it that every Satmar kid qualify for lunch money? |
I answered this but seems that my reply never got posted.
The lunch program is based on eligibility. A form needs to be filled out and funds are granted only for eligible students. The type and quality and length of education have no bearing on the lunch funds. (Camps have lunch program as well.) It is very possible that most Satmar students are eligible based on income and family size. If they're not the school will not get funds for them. It's as simple as that. My son's school charges $500 for lunch if you are not eligible.
Bussing is determined by the distance between school and home. My children are not eligible and I pay for transportation out out pocket.
Textbooks are provided through NYSTL and all students in NY are eligible.
Why should I be paying for textbooks(and other things that I'm eligible for) just because I can afford them if I'm legally entitled to it?
Someone wrote that my children are getting these things on taxpayer's money, if anything it's the opposite.
In essence I am a taxpayer that is subsidizing the tuition of PS students.
Anon because I work in a school and deal with the transportation and lunch program.
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happybeingamom
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Wed, Jul 27 2016, 4:53 pm
| amother wrote: | | Private schools need to offer an education that is equivalent to public schools for the kids to qualify for funding but Satmar doesnt offer an equivalent education which means that the kids don't qualify for funding just for being in school 3 hours a day. And not all kids qualify for funding, there are guidelines (similar to food stamps and/or wic) that kids need to meet in order to qualify. The question is, how is it that every Satmar kid meets the qualifications for lunch money? |
That is a different discussion then the quality of education.
I know some schools the children who don't qualify pay and others who don't qualify the lunch is included in the tuition. I can't tell you if that is correct because I am not that knowledgable of the program.
My point that depriving nutrtion from low income kids is not a great idea even if the education is not good. I know I had to fill out forms for summer camp (even though I don't qualify)and summer camps don't educate. I also belive that food is served during the summer in NY Public School to make sure that children can get proper nutrition.
Bottom line the food program has nothing to do with the quality of education.
Last edited by happybeingamom on Wed, Jul 27 2016, 5:03 pm; edited 1 time in total
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L25
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Wed, Jul 27 2016, 4:57 pm
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our public library offers children free lunches in the summer. It is not connected to education.
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amother
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Wed, Jul 27 2016, 5:05 pm
| amother wrote: | Not everyone wants to be an accountant or office manager so if I wanted a different type of career then they should have offered different types of classes which they didnt do either. Why was I forced to take the same classes as you if my goals were different than yours?
But that is the beauty of offering electives along with core classes so girls can pick classes according to their needs and interests which satmar did not offer. If they were accredited or following the NYC guidelines then you would not have had to spend 10 years of playing "catch up" with everyone else, you would have learned it in high school and expanded your knowledge in college.
And btw, you need chemistry and science labs etc to become a doctor and I believe those are some of the pre-reqs for speech therapy as well. So yes, these classes are equally as important as arts and literature, etc. |
FYI: Not all accredited high schools in Brooklyn offer Chemistry.
And no, it is not a prerequisite for ST.
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amother
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Wed, Jul 27 2016, 5:07 pm
| L25 wrote: | | our public library offers children free lunches in the summer. It is not connected to education. |
The summer program is free for all kids 18 years and younger. The winter program or school program is not free and kids have to be eligible to receive it.
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amother
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Wed, Jul 27 2016, 5:13 pm
| amother wrote: | FYI: Not all accredited high schools in Brooklyn offer Chemistry.
And no, it is not a prerequisite for ST. |
What kind of science classes do these accredited schools offer?
And you need physics and A&P for ST but chemistry is acceptable for some programs as well.
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amother
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Wed, Jul 27 2016, 5:14 pm
| amother wrote: | Not everyone wants to be an accountant or office manager so if I wanted a different type of career then they should have offered different types of classes which they didnt do either. Why was I forced to take the same classes as you if my goals were different than yours?
But that is the beauty of offering electives along with core classes so girls can pick classes according to their needs and interests which satmar did not offer. If they were accredited or following the NYC guidelines then you would not have had to spend 10 years of playing "catch up" with everyone else, you would have learned it in high school and expanded your knowledge in college. |
Many of the things you have grievances about (ETA: re the above about electives) are not unique to Satmar nor to chassidish schools. I am well acquainted with many Bais Yaakov schools and know of almost none that offer a significant amount of electives.
Those who wanted more got more on their own. It didn't stop anyone from pursuing the higher education of their choice.
Like I said upthread, I went to Bais Brocho, which certainly doesn't offer electives. That didn't stop me from pursuing my own interests, such as reading the classics we didn't read in school, learning music theory and composing songs, watching movies and documentaries, listening to classical music, learning all about different eras in history which I found fascinating and which weren't covered in depth in history class. When I went to college, I was able to hold my own in liberal arts classes.
I'm not saying this to invalidate your experience. I was bored in class and found school very unstimulating.
But what I want to bring out is that you aren't trapped at whatever level your school was on. Many times, the things you learn and discover on your own are much more meaningful than receiving those lessons.
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