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amother
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 Mon, Feb 05 2007, 5:03 pm
I was really thinking about this thread, and you know, we really dont know what the OPs situation and life is all about, and a little 'dan lekaf zechus' cant hurt. Right, she might not have kids and she might be going through years of infertility. She might be really, really nervous and stressed out and that is making her act like a grouch. And I wouldn't blame her that kids get her nervous. I know some of you are going to say 'that's no excuse for being ungrateful' but the op didn't complain to her hosts, she is letting out her frustrations over here. When people are not happy, any little 'narishkeit' can get them nervous and seem like a big deal.
I'm not saying for sure this is the case, but if it is, a sentence like this:
Also, we're all telling her to be grateful for what she gets and that her hosts dont owe her anything, but dont we all do that? We complain about things, parnassah, our children...but shouldn't we always just be grateful we HAVE kids and be quiet? Hashem doesn't owe us anything either.
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mumoo
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Mon, Feb 05 2007, 5:12 pm
| amother wrote: |
Also, we're all telling her to be grateful for what she gets and that her hosts dont owe her anything, but dont we all do that? We complain about things, parnassah, our children...but shouldn't we always just be grateful we HAVE kids and be quiet? Hashem doesn't owe us anything either. |
I am clearly not articulate-this is one of the things I have been trying to say, thanks amother.
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greenfire
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Mon, Feb 05 2007, 5:18 pm
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However OP was extremely overbearing and demanding in her OP. There is a level that is nice and a level that is too much for anyone. You can only fix control and change yourself. I once went to someone's house who had a potty in the dining room. I found it offensive - I did tell her that I didn't think it was appropriate - but that is cause I truly thought she was able to change that if she wanted to and I surely could choose not to go there if I don't like it. When you are stuck however - unknowingly it a situation where suddenly you realize the bed you are sleeping in simply stinks - how can you tell host - especially - if with open arms everything else is truly wonderful. I though about that cause it happened to us. That being said sometimes some things may be unbearable - you just have to not go there in the future - if you cannot handle it. People cannot always control their lifes level of cleanliness - when life is hectic or otherwise insane. They shouldn't have to be judged just cause you are different. So long as you give them clean food and a clean bed and a loving heart - oh did I say loving heart - cause I mean loving heart.
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Ruchel
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Mon, Feb 05 2007, 6:09 pm
| Raisin wrote: | | one particularly holy Rabbi demanded a 4 or 5 star hotel with a gym |
wow.
I don't know, it just shocks me.
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yoyosma
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Mon, Feb 05 2007, 6:21 pm
The Rabbi demanding the gym doesnt bother me. Maybe he has a heart condition and must excercise as per his Doctor?
When you bring out a speaker, you are inviting him, so do try to make him happy!
A completely different case than what the OP was describing!
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withhumor
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Mon, Feb 05 2007, 7:07 pm
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Can I reprint this letter and address it, Dear Mother-In-Law, signed , your Daughter-in-Law… ?
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amother
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Mon, Feb 05 2007, 7:22 pm
| amother wrote: | | I would stay in a hotel but I travel for business, and generally try to help with the travel costs by not demanding a hotel. I am doing my host a favor by not demanding better accomodations. And be thankful what I get for free? Is that what you tell your parents when they come visit? Or your machatonim? Thats the reaction of a Shlepper. There is a reason hachnasa orchim is such a big mitzvah. You could have your guests sleep on the floor , and eat instant soup for supper but that would make you a crappy host with a bad attitude. (Which considering your reaction is probably true.) |
Then maybe you should send a request list before with money. That way your "ungreatful" hosts can pay for a cleaning lady, a babysitter to watch their kids so they don't make noise during dinnertime and for a cook to make you nice catered meals instead of being given the gracious invitation to help yourself to anything in the fridge.
If you dont want to do that but still have these high expectations, then do yourself and of course the hosts a big favor and stay at a hotel.
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Mirabelle
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Mon, Feb 05 2007, 8:04 pm
H mmm, I wonder why we havent had a response from the OP.
I think when you are visiting someone's house who has kids you just have to expect that anything can happen. I know that I can see the clear difference from just this past summer before we had kids, to now when we have ONE baby.
This past summer I had two girls stay by us for a local auf ruf. Let me tell you, the house was pristine, I made amazing meals and bought a selection of snacks should they get hungry. They also had their own bathroom, which was also pristine as it is our second and formally guest bathroom.
Last week I had an old friend for shobbos and let me tell you, it was totally different. First of all, we cant help the fact that there is baby "stuff" everywhere, bouncer, swing, toys, blankets, etc. The guest bedroom was clean, but the bathroom, while clean, was filled with baby stuff such as our baby bathtub, toys, etc. I only had the chance to make one quick trip to the grocery before my friend came and for most meals we literally started into the fridge and came up with something.
Thats just how it is when you have kids.
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happymom
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Mon, Feb 05 2007, 9:57 pm
| Quote: | | amother#2. If I had to serve my guests meals all the time, I couldn't have them. I barely manage to put food on my own table. I try to relay that they shouldn't expect meals, except for Shabbos. is there something wrong with that? |
as long as u let them know before they decide to come np, otherwise they might be stuck.... cuz id think usually they go together. guests eat by thier hostesses unless planned otherwise.
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Ima'la
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Tue, Feb 06 2007, 12:41 am
| amother wrote: | | amother wrote: | | I would stay in a hotel but I travel for business, and generally try to help with the travel costs by not demanding a hotel. I am doing my host a favor by not demanding better accomodations. And be thankful what I get for free? Is that what you tell your parents when they come visit? Or your machatonim? Thats the reaction of a Shlepper. There is a reason hachnasa orchim is such a big mitzvah. You could have your guests sleep on the floor , and eat instant soup for supper but that would make you a crappy host with a bad attitude. (Which considering your reaction is probably true.) |
Then maybe you should send a request list before with money. That way your "ungreatful" hosts can pay for a cleaning lady, a babysitter to watch their kids so they don't make noise during dinnertime and for a cook to make you nice catered meals instead of being given the gracious invitation to help yourself to anything in the fridge.
If you dont want to do that but still have these high expectations, then do yourself and of course the hosts a big favor and stay at a hotel. |
Now THIS is a great idea! Just let me know where to send the contractor's bill for the bathroom addition!!!!!
(Is this still saving money on the hotel?)
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TzenaRena
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Tue, Feb 06 2007, 2:01 am
Okay, here's my story. Weeks , even months ago, girls and women "booked" with us for the Chof Beis Shvat convention, which is starting this week, actually tomorrow.
We also had some requests for guests for Yud Shevat, which we were able to have, because the Kinus starts a week after Yud Shevat. A family who called, about a week before Yud Shevat, (after we committed to all those women and girls) told us that they are coming for two weeks. I told them: "we are having people for Chof Beis Shevat, so we can only take for one week. What will you do for the second week?"
"We'll figure something out". Well, they arrived, never figured anything out, and now I was wracking my brain about what to do....
I reminded them last Wednesday,and every day thereafter, that after Shabbos they need a new place. Shabbos came and went, and I asked, do you know where you are going?
No, they don't  . I made some frantic calls to friends and relatives, of course everyone is full for the Kinus, same as me! Here I am thinking that these people will soon be out on the street,at least "parked" in 770 and everyone will be blaming us for doing that to someone! 
I have a friend, a literal tzadekes, and she agreed to take them. Now I'm feeling guilty for pushing an entire family of 4 on a friend....But I told my husband to drive them over, before they decided they didn't want to stay there....The wife didn't want to go there, because it's out of CH. She was counting on her husband having come up with an alternative. Guess what, he came home at night and he had never came up with a place!
I had even told the family a "little white lie" that the girls were coming today. It wasn't really a lie, because one girl was coming a day ahead of the others, but maybe we could have put her up in a different room. Anyway, they did organize their things, and pack up the suitcases, and stripped the beds for me, so I could take care of things. But I expected that everyone is really coming tomorrow.
Guess what The first girl showed up in the afternoon, and the family saw that it was true that they were coming... Around six oclock, the bell rang, and yep, three girls were standing in the doorway! My info was wrong! It seems that half of the group arrived today, and the other half comes tomorrow. So now I ran around frantically washing linens that only now were freed up, and that I thought I had till tomorrow to do! That's what I call a close call, if not for the "lie", I wouldn't have had place for them! 
But I felt so mean, to keep nudging. 
BTW, OP, thanks to you, I did take the (old) bar of soap in the bathroom and clean it up for my new guests. I actually got some good information from your post. 
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shabbatiscoming
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Tue, Feb 06 2007, 8:17 am
| amother wrote: | I was really thinking about this thread, and you know, we really dont know what the OPs situation and life is all about, and a little 'dan lekaf zechus' cant hurt. Right, she might not have kids and she might be going through years of infertility. She might be really, really nervous and stressed out and that is making her act like a grouch. And I wouldn't blame her that kids get her nervous. I know some of you are going to say 'that's no excuse for being ungrateful' but the op didn't complain to her hosts, she is letting out her frustrations over here. When people are not happy, any little 'narishkeit' can get them nervous and seem like a big deal.
I'm not saying for sure this is the case, but if it is, a sentence like this:
Also, we're all telling her to be grateful for what she gets and that her hosts dont owe her anything, but dont we all do that? We complain about things, parnassah, our children...but shouldn't we always just be grateful we HAVE kids and be quiet? Hashem doesn't owe us anything either. |
I totally disagree with you. first of all, what if she is going through infertility? so am I. that does not mean that if I am a guest at someones home I will find things wrong with a host. that is just wrong. just because we may be having a bad day does not mean that you can put it onto someone else not living up to your standards.
you mentioned that dont we all complain? I am sure that we do, but it is about OUR OWN shtuyot (sillinesses) not someone elses short comings. that is not fair to do.
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supermom
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Tue, Feb 06 2007, 8:29 am
Wow I just read through this whole thread. Some of the stuff made me laugh.
Wonder were the op is? I am curious to know what she has to say about all this?
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greenfire
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Tue, Feb 06 2007, 8:38 am
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TzenaRena - close call - Lucky you found a place - but that was definately more than rude of your company. I guess you shouldn't "book" guests at your hotel so close together - just in case they like it and decide to stay...
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technic
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Tue, Feb 06 2007, 8:42 am
| supermom wrote: | Wow I just read through this whole thread. Some of the stuff made me laugh.
Wonder were the op is? I am curious to know what she has to say about all this? |
shes staying w friends!!!! 
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gryp
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Tue, Feb 06 2007, 9:05 am
Tzena, it sounds more like: "they prophesized and they didnt know they were prophesizing." (I thought that was about Eldad and Meidad but I cant find the quote.  anyone know?)
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TzenaRena
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Tue, Feb 06 2007, 9:20 am
Yes GR, I did think of that and wondered.... 
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TzenaRena
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Tue, Feb 06 2007, 9:32 am
BTW, one time I can thinkof the prophesying thing, it was about Bas Pharoh, when she gave the baby Moshe to Yocheved and said "Here is yours". There are quite a few examples.
Yes , that's the Rashi - (vatomer )heilichi (es hayeled) nisnab'oh v'lo yodah ma nisnabah hei shelichi" - and she said bring the boy. Bring - Rashi says heilichi means hei shelichi - Here is your (child), she prophesied and didn't know that she did. (She didn't know that Yocheved was Moshe's mother.)
Last edited by TzenaRena on Tue, Feb 06 2007, 4:18 pm; edited 2 times in total
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