Work trip, No kosher food, Akward social situation...HELP!

I just started a new job, about 3 weeks ago. I'm the only "ultra-Orthodox" worker in an office of about 10 "traditional" workers. While everyone is great, we all feel that I'm a little different. For example, they made a nice birthday party/group lunch during my second week of work. We all sat around one big table to eat and chat and while everyone was piling food on their plates, mine was totally empty. Everyone kept on offering me food and saying it's kosher, but I don't think they even comprehend that my food needs to be "more than kosher," I.e. pas yiroel, bishul yisroel, chalav yisrael, not heated in the office microwave, not cut with the office knife, etc. That's just one example of how it's a little uncomfortable.

They just announced that this Thursday will be an office field-trip, kind of like a nice occasion to socialize away from work. We will be traveling to a nearly city about an hour away, going out for breakfast, taking a tour of a historic location, going out again for cake and coffee, etc. This will be a full-day excursion. And I'm dreading it.

I have a hard time making social transistions to begin with. And while I am very slowly settling in at work, to be in a purely social situation with my new colleagues with be very uncomfortable for me. Also, a good part of the itinerary is devoted to eating. I checked already and some of the places aren't kosher at all, while the main restaurant that we're going to for breakfast is officially kosher, but not a hashgacha that I myself would even touch with a 10-foot pole! (And I can't even suggest a different restaurant because there aren't any where I'll eat in the entire city.)

So practically speaking, I will need to bring all of my food for the day. (And that's A LOT, since my morning sickness keeps me nibbling all the time.) But even more than that, much of the entertainment is the eating out itself. It will be so uncomfortbaly to spend HOURS at restaurants where all I'm doing is drinking glasses of water while everyone else orders 10-course meals!

What should I do? Is there are way I can "get sick?" Will that be VERY obvious? Also, we're supposed to bring a little gift for our "secret recipient." If I get sick, my partner won't get a gift. I'm dreading this! If it was just an hour or two I could handle it. But it's about 10 hours!!! Oy!

Posted: Mon, Apr 16 2007, 8:45 am Post subject:

although I think it is nice to socialize with the office and it has it's pluses ... based on all the details and the level of your uncomfortability ... you should just not go ... and simply say I can't ... hopefully they could find a dif "secret gift" person ... and all will be fine ...

I was in a similar situation when I taught in a MO school and I wasn't comfortable on the staff trips (which of course were supposed to be a perk of the job) - mixed, restaurants were often even 'glatt' but not hechsherim I eat so it makes it even worse in some ways. "You mean it's not kosher enough for you??!!". At least if it wasn't kosher it would be easier to explain.

I just came up with a different excuse every time. Like I was pregnant/ nursing. I would say how for me it's not a treat to leave my kids for a whole day (none of these were lies - I hate being away from my kids).

Two summers ago they had a 3 day seminar in a hotel in the summer vacation. I just drove in for one day and said it was hard to leave my kids.

Probably some people put two and two together and thought either the truth or that I am stand-offish. There isn't really anything I can do about it, and in the end, so what?

You could say it's hard b/c of your morning sickness (if your pregnancy is public) or you could say you aren't feeling so good (and when it is public they will realise why).

Hatzlocho, and it's worth deciding from the beginning that you are there to work and not socialize. If you work well, it may be a bit uncomfortable, but ultimately no-one is going to fire you for not sharing their cookies. Very Happy

Diamond Member Joined: Feb 20 2007 Posts: 4464

I was going to say bring those la briut meals but I would skip it. Maybe you can somehow buy a gift but give it to your manager to give to your secret recipient or whatever.

It's annoying when these supposedly "morale booster" trips are more of a pain than anything else.

I would use the pg excuse if it's shiech (you're showing, you really would be somewhat tired after a 10 hour outing etc)

It's hard to be "the frummie", it's harder to get accepted and all... I would go for that purpose and bring food (or find a way of eating something that is acceptable to me as I don't keep glatt, cholov yisrael and so on), but if you will really be uncomfortable, pretend you're sick. Good luck!
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Thanks for the advice, and please, keep it coming. No one knows I'm pregnant yet, though I came in late today and mentioned to my boss that I haven't been sleeping well and I'm not feeling well. The truth is, maybe I said too much as I think a few people may suspect something already! Today people asked if I was coming and I said of course, that it would be fun. I think I may try to skip it and drop of the gift at my boss' house the night before. Maybe I'll say I have a doctor's appt that had to be scheduled at the last minute. It's just frustrating bc like Ruchel said, davka bc I feel that I don't fit in, I want to go and show them than a "frummie" can be normal too. At the same time, no matter how much I try, the entire day I'll be setting myself apart from the group, kind of defeating the orginal purpose of going to show that I'm "normal" to begin with.

Posted: Mon, Apr 16 2007, 9:40 am Post subject:

When I went to conferences on business, where a good part was socializing, I nursed drinks. It doesn't have to be water...a cola (still in the bottle/can), freshly squeezed orange juice (the only thing any self-respecting restaurant uses their juicer for is juice), etc. And I would bring my own meals...if anyone asks why you can tell them you have food allergies, and it's easier to bring your own and know what's in it (I DO have allergies, and it IS easier to prepare a few things myself than to ask questions, especially since 1/2 the time I can't seem to get accurate answers).

Also, I totally hear you on the length. Would it be possible for you to join them in the morning, and leave at lunchtime (before or after the meal), to shorten the day? That way you don't have to be "sick", and you don't have to be totally "anti-social", but you also don't have to hang around if you don't want to. (You could have a pre-arranged appointment in the afternoon, if necessary, couldn't you?)
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I would say it is totally up to you. Perhaps the resturant has some things you will eat, since it is officially kosher - maybe you could call them and see what they have? Maybe something like a fresh salad made of things like tomatoes, avocado, cucumber would be ok? (check with a Rav, but these things would be fine even if they were not cut with a kosher knife, since they are cold and not sharp)

If they are a Kosher resturant with an orthodox Hechsher, I would imagine they should not be letting you bring your own food in.

to the OP........please do not be afraid to be yourself! you're a frum jew and proud of it! go on the trip (if you feel up to it) and have confidence in yourself! you are doing what Hashem wants from you, and handling the trip with pride, dignity, and self confidence will make Hakadosh Baruch Hu so so proud of you. you don't need to lie and say that you brought your own food because of allergies.......if anyone asks, just tell the truth! that you keep a certian level of kashrus and need to have your own food! people might think you are weird and might not understand you, but on the other hand they might think "wow, I really respect that!" you never know who you can influence. besides, I know that you so badly want to blend in and be accepted by your colleagues, and I can totally understand that. but in order for you to do that, you have to be yourself and let them accept you. not everyone can be exactly the same. that's not the way the world works. be proud of who you are, don't make excuses for why you do and don't do things. so what if these people think you're weird? if frum jews in america stopped doing what we do just to blend in with society, it would be a very big problem. at the end of the day, it doesn't really matter what these people think of you. if you handle yourself in a polite respectful way, your colleagues with only have the utmost respect for you and what you do.

Diamond Member Joined: Oct 24 2005 Posts: 4689

Well said, amother. (so why aren't you displaying the courage of your convictions instead of hiding behind the mask of amother?)

my husband works in a university. his group of immediate co-workers love throwing partys for every little thing, but also for big things like grants and papers written, stuff lke that. in the beginning, the first time he had a birthday while working there , he told them specifically that in order for him to eat stuf, it has to come from a specific place. they were soooo happy to get it for him, and now one of th eladys, who is not jewish goes to that kosher bakery for herself and her family... its so funny. point is, dont beat aronud the bush or be embarrased. its uncomfrtable fo rthem to have oyu not eat also. so make it clear whta has to be for you to join in. they wont see you as being pushy or demanidng. we all have standards.

good luck, I know it can be a weird situation.
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chen.......thank you for complimenting my post. however it's really none of your business why I posted as mother. I have never posted under my real screenname. Yael has never had a problem with this. I don't see why you should have one. why couldn't you have just let it go after reading my post? I'm not comfortable posting under my screen name so I posted anonymously. did I hurt anyone by doing so? did I hide behind it to insult anyone? no. I posted anonymously.......just let it be, please.

Diamond Member Joined: Oct 24 2005 Posts: 4689

There is a policy that members are not supposed to post anonymously except to protect confidentiality and prevent embarrassment. Otherwise, members are expected to explain the reason for the cloak of anonymity, such as "people in my neighborhood know who I am and would ostracize me if they knew this is what I really think."

ok, chen, so I broke that policy. I'm sorry. I've committed a horrible crime.
would you like to turn me in?
if Yael or a moderator has a problem with it, they will let me know. until then, no harm has been done, and I don't think anyone's lives will be too severely disrupted because of this.
you know........innocent threads here have sometimes turned into conversations about lesbian threesomes and farting and people have a blast with it......I make a thought provoking and helpful comment and I get cr@p for it.
now let's get back to the subject and try to help out the OP with her situation.

Gold Member Joined: Jan 01 2006 Posts: 1859

This situation comes up for me ALL the time. Usually I avoid going. When I really really can't get out of it I go and have a soda or water and try to eat beforehand (or in my hotel room with food from home if travelling). Far worse is the fact that I'm the only woman working amongst many men. Usually, though, my boss is pretty good about including spouses, which makes life a lot easier for me...
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Senior Member Joined: Jan 21 2007 Posts: 127

ive done several of the above suggestions, depending on each situation. I have left early a couple times, not gone, and brought my own food many times. anytime I have had to go to an all day event that I could not get out of, I bring easy "snacks" with me that I can eat, particularly when pregnant. good things to bring are things that can fit in your purse, I especially like to bring granola bars and the haolam sting cheese singles. they can stay a few hours and give you a bit of protein. also, nuts, raisins, etc.

good luck!

Diamond Member Joined: Dec 07 2006 Posts: 3623

I had a very similar situation. Like Shalhevet pointed out, they tried to improve upon the "standard" hechsher, so it was somewhat better....but not quite enough for me - so it would almost seem ungracious (I thought) to make a big deal of refusing the food....In my case, we were supposed to arrive very early in the morning and would be getting back late at night...I was preg. enough that I could tell and I begged off with the (true) excuse that I simply couldn't stay awake for that many hours!

But my chareidi, female co-worker (there were a couple of us) told them up-front that this was billed as a "socialization day" (sorry, poor translation), and she was not there to socialize, so she would not be coming. And they accepted that. (The office was about 1/3 frum, including some of the management, and in general, they were very accepting.) I really respected her for saying that straight out, instead of making excuses. OTOH, she was a bit older than I was and she was very valuable to the company, so she did not have anything to worry about - I wonder if they would have accepted such an answer as easily from me. I don't think they would have fired me over it, but they might have pressured me to come.

Btw, when I heard about it later, I was really glad I hadn't gone. It wasn't just the food that would have been awkward for me. The events of the day were a surprise...When e/o got to the office, they took e/o to a small airport outside Yerushalayim, and flew to Eilat...had breakfast in a fancy hotel...forget what they did the rest of the day, but I think it might have included rappelling, and supper with karaoke and dancing! Shocked

I would have been SO uncomfortable the WHOLE day!!!!!!