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| e1234 |
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 Posted: Thu, Jun 14 2012, 8:31 am Post subject: re: Tipat Chalav= nuts! |
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| Quote: | to the lady who said she goes to the tipat chalav in the klalit clinic... so do I. where is yours located? (I would be shocked if it's the same one)
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| Ariellush |
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| Posted: Thu, Jun 14 2012, 8:37 am Post subject: Re: re: Tipat Chalav= nuts! |
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| amother wrote: | G-d bless America! Freedom of religion, freedom of choice, freedom to not tolerate abuse of any kind by anyone.
"You get what you pay for, cheap and free are worth exactly that, or less." |
And also, Amother, what happened with those USA children forced to take Ritalin?
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| smss |
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| Posted: Thu, Jun 14 2012, 8:38 am Post subject: re: Tipat Chalav= nuts! |
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I do NOT think you are overreacting if that's what you experienced. I really don't get these posts where people say "that's not how it works at my Tipat Chalav, just get used to it." If that WAS how it worked at your TC...maybe you would also react like this?
Honestly I think it sounds really horrible and pretty shocking...B"H you are moving soon and maybe you won't have to go again before you move if you really just have to do vaccinations there and nothing else.
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| Ruchel |
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| Posted: Thu, Jun 14 2012, 8:55 am Post subject: re: Tipat Chalav= nuts! |
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((hugs)) <3
Peds and nurses can be ...........
I actually know also great nurses, but very few great peds.
_________________
"You will have many many children and make successful shidduchim beh", rebbetzin Esther Jungreis
"It's all cultural, disagree respectfully", me
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| m in Israel |
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| Posted: Thu, Jun 14 2012, 9:01 am Post subject: Re: re: Tipat Chalav= nuts! |
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| Ariellush wrote: | | amother wrote: | G-d bless America! Freedom of religion, freedom of choice, freedom to not tolerate abuse of any kind by anyone.
"You get what you pay for, cheap and free are worth exactly that, or less." |
But what about the mandatory mental health screening for all children in USA, including babies? What happened with the freedom of choice and with the freedom to say no to abuse? It seems that Tipat Chalav does the same thing, but in Israel it is not requested by law like in some USA states. Israel only imported some stupid stuff from USA.  |
What on earth are you talking about? I never heard of any "mandatory mental health screening" in the U.S., and I had 4 kids there -- oldest was over 9 when we made Aliyah almost 2 years ago. All my siblings and husband's siblings still live there. We lived in NY -- maybe you have info in a different state, but there is definitely no such thing for "all children in the U.S.A." (And we have siblings in NY, NJ, Maryland, and Missouri -- no one's ever heard of such a thing.) There's also no way to "force" a parent to give a child Ritalin. (Well, technically if your kid is in a private school the school has right to put whatever requirements they want on accepting your kid, so a yeshiva can say "we will kick your kid out if you don't medicate him" -- but a public school cannot.)
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| ora_43 |
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| Posted: Thu, Jun 14 2012, 9:10 am Post subject: Re: re: Tipat Chalav= nuts! |
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| amother wrote: | G-d bless America! Freedom of religion, freedom of choice, freedom to not tolerate abuse of any kind by anyone.
"You get what you pay for, cheap and free are worth exactly that, or less." |
I'm sure all the people in America who can't afford health care are feeling grateful that they've been spared from the occasional rotten nurse they might have encountered in a free system  .
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| ora_43 |
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| Posted: Thu, Jun 14 2012, 9:18 am Post subject: re: Tipat Chalav= nuts! |
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To the OP - it sounds like a really terrible clinic. I would stop going there, and ask my pediatrician about doing shots elsewhere. But since you're moving BH maybe just wait.
I've found that tipat chalav nurses in general think they know best and like to make a big fuss over every little thing (the baby is smaller than average so you need to add solids, the baby is bigger than average so she must not be getting enough exercise, etc - as if every child's natural healthy state is to be exactly average ). But most are at least nice about it and give the general sense that we're all on the same side.
To a large extent it's their job. It's much better for them if they give 100 parents a hard time because their baby is "too small" when only 2 of the babies have any kind of problem that needs fixing, then if they miss those 2 babies. So they're pretty much always going to err on the side of "insist there's a problem."
There's no excuse for them to be rude and unprofessional, though. BH I've only encountered that kind of behavior once, in all of the several clinics I've taken kids to.
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| m in Israel |
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| Posted: Thu, Jun 14 2012, 9:18 am Post subject: Re: re: Tipat Chalav= nuts! |
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| ora_43 wrote: | | amother wrote: | G-d bless America! Freedom of religion, freedom of choice, freedom to not tolerate abuse of any kind by anyone.
"You get what you pay for, cheap and free are worth exactly that, or less." |
I'm sure all the people in America who can't afford health care are feeling grateful that they've been spared from the occasional rotten nurse they might have encountered in a free system . |
Where do you live that you have free health care? Here in Israel we have mandatory health care, but certainly not free. We are charged premiums through the "mas briut" collected by Bituach L'eumi. The U.S. actually does have free health care for low income families (actually, nothing is free -- I mean paid for by other people's taxes rather than your own) called Medicaid. They also have low cost insurance for children through the individual state's department of health (S-Chip), and many states offer family plans as well (such as NY's "family health plus").
There are people in the U.S. who cannot afford insurance (mostly middle class -- making too much for the free programs, but not enough to buy private insurance), but there are people in Israel who struggle to make their payments, too. If you don't pay your mas briut, you will loose your insurance coverage here, too.
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| anonymrs |
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| Posted: Thu, Jun 14 2012, 9:24 am Post subject: Re: re: Tipat Chalav= nuts! |
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| ora_43 wrote: | To the OP - it sounds like a really terrible clinic. I would stop going there, and ask my pediatrician about doing shots elsewhere. But since you're moving BH maybe just wait.
I've found that tipat chalav nurses in general think they know best and like to make a big fuss over every little thing (the baby is smaller than average so you need to add solids, the baby is bigger than average so she must not be getting enough exercise, etc - as if every child's natural healthy state is to be exactly average ). But most are at least nice about it and give the general sense that we're all on the same side.
To a large extent it's their job. It's much better for them if they give 100 parents a hard time because their baby is "too small" when only 2 of the babies have any kind of problem that needs fixing, then if they miss those 2 babies. So they're pretty much always going to err on the side of "insist there's a problem."
There's no excuse for them to be rude and unprofessional, though. BH I've only encountered that kind of behavior once, in all of the several clinics I've taken kids to. |
My friend's 2 month old baby was "too big" and she was told not to let him nurse so often  .
My daughter was too small and I was told to stop nursing and give her solids at 4 months. When I said, I don't want to give her any food yet because she has severe allergies ("just look at her eczema") I was told that if you start giving her foods now then she won't be allergic. won't be allergic??? She already is. Get a life!
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| esther2 |
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| Posted: Thu, Jun 14 2012, 10:37 am Post subject: re: Tipat Chalav= nuts! |
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[quote]amother wrote:
G-d bless America! Freedom of religion, freedom of choice, freedom to not tolerate abuse of any kind by anyone.
"You get what you pay for, cheap and free are worth exactly that, or less."
but I wouldn't give up living in Israel for anything! and we do have a choice here not to tolerate abuse. 
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| esther2 |
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| Posted: Thu, Jun 14 2012, 10:45 am Post subject: re: Tipat Chalav= nuts! |
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to OP
tipat chalav nurses can drive you crazy- I had some awful experiences there and some better ones.
I was told that my ds's head was too big- what can I do about it? and when they asked why I don't give formula to him and I told them bc he is allergic they said he isn't allergic- you just don't know how to make bottles right. They think they know better than the allergist.
I finally started bringing dh to help me deal with them. when they told me ds head was too big (they tell me that every visit) dh said no it's not it is only in the 70 percentile. after that they started being more careful in what they tell me.
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| esther2 |
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| Posted: Thu, Jun 14 2012, 10:47 am Post subject: re: Tipat Chalav= nuts! |
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| forgot to say that they awlways send me to ds's dr to make sure his head isnt too big and the dr always tells me to ignore what they say.
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| moonstone |
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| Posted: Thu, Jun 14 2012, 11:12 am Post subject: Re: re: Tipat Chalav= nuts! |
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Wow, are Tipat Chalav nurses still insane? I haven't been to one in many years, but I guess I assumed they'd have "modernized" by now. Apparently not!
I never had an experience as awful as yours, OP. I'd switch to another clinic.
| ora_43 wrote: |
I've found that tipat chalav nurses in general think they know best and like to make a big fuss over every little thing (the baby is smaller than average so you need to add solids, the baby is bigger than average so she must not be getting enough exercise, etc - as if every child's natural healthy state is to be exactly average ). But most are at least nice about it and give the general sense that we're all on the same side.
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Yeah, this was basically our experience. A lot of silly fussing and silly advice that we basically ignored. They said one of our kids was bowlegged and that we should double-diaper. We ignored that. Guess what- there was no bowleggedness.
I think one of the job requirements is to have ridiculous ideas about babies. Every discussion I've ever had with anyone re. Tipat Chalav involved lots of eye-rolling.
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| abby1776 |
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| Posted: Thu, Jun 14 2012, 11:57 am Post subject: re: Tipat Chalav= nuts! |
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I believe in the US there is mandatory hearing screening in hospitals when your baby is born. They check hearing and maybe some other things like genetic diseases.
You dont have to vaccinate, but many schools wont take your children if they arent vaccinated (you certainly cant send to public school without vaccinations).
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| Leesah |
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| Posted: Thu, Jun 14 2012, 12:17 pm Post subject: re: Tipat Chalav= nuts! |
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I just nod and say, 'yes of course! Yes, yes, yes, yes....'
And then I go home and do whatever I like.
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| Ariellush |
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| Posted: Thu, Jun 14 2012, 1:01 pm Post subject: Re: re: Tipat Chalav= nuts! |
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| m in Israel wrote: | | ora_43 wrote: | | amother wrote: | G-d bless America! Freedom of religion, freedom of choice, freedom to not tolerate abuse of any kind by anyone.
"You get what you pay for, cheap and free are worth exactly that, or less." |
I'm sure all the people in America who can't afford health care are feeling grateful that they've been spared from the occasional rotten nurse they might have encountered in a free system . |
Where do you live that you have free health care? Here in Israel we have mandatory health care, but certainly not free. We are charged premiums through the "mas briut" collected by Bituach L'eumi. The U.S. actually does have free health care for low income families (actually, nothing is free -- I mean paid for by other people's taxes rather than your own) called Medicaid. They also have low cost insurance for children through the individual state's department of health (S-Chip), and many states offer family plans as well (such as NY's "family health plus").
There are people in the U.S. who cannot afford insurance (mostly middle class -- making too much for the free programs, but not enough to buy private insurance), but there are people in Israel who struggle to make their payments, too. If you don't pay your mas briut, you will loose your insurance coverage here, too. |
Old Wikipedia would be a good source:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/New_Freedom_Commission_on_Mental_Health
I would like to share the following link as well:
http://www.thedailybell.com/3342/Ron-Paul-No-Mandatory-Mental-Health-Screening-for-Children
Also, I would beg the moderator to move this thread to the Israeli forum.
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| m in Israel |
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| Posted: Thu, Jun 14 2012, 1:17 pm Post subject: Re: re: Tipat Chalav= nuts! |
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| Ariellush wrote: | | m in Israel wrote: | | ora_43 wrote: | | amother wrote: | G-d bless America! Freedom of religion, freedom of choice, freedom to not tolerate abuse of any kind by anyone.
"You get what you pay for, cheap and free are worth exactly that, or less." |
I'm sure all the people in America who can't afford health care are feeling grateful that they've been spared from the occasional rotten nurse they might have encountered in a free system . |
Where do you live that you have free health care? Here in Israel we have mandatory health care, but certainly not free. We are charged premiums through the "mas briut" collected by Bituach L'eumi. The U.S. actually does have free health care for low income families (actually, nothing is free -- I mean paid for by other people's taxes rather than your own) called Medicaid. They also have low cost insurance for children through the individual state's department of health (S-Chip), and many states offer family plans as well (such as NY's "family health plus").
There are people in the U.S. who cannot afford insurance (mostly middle class -- making too much for the free programs, but not enough to buy private insurance), but there are people in Israel who struggle to make their payments, too. If you don't pay your mas briut, you will loose your insurance coverage here, too. |
Old good Wikipedia would be a good source:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/New_Freedom_Commission_on_Mental_Health
Also, I would beg the moderator to move this thread to the Israeli forum. |
I assume this is supposed to be a response to my other post about mental health screening as the link doesn't discuss the cost of health insurance. I'm not completely sure, because this doesn't address the other claim either. A "commission on mental health" is what they call a "blue ribbon panel". It is simply a PR move by an administration to try to show they take a topic seriously. The recommendations are not binding in any way shape or form, unless Congress decides it's a good idea and implements a law. If it involves procedures in the executive branch (such as many of the recommendations of the "9/11 commission" -- another one of these "panels"), the president and his staff can implement them as they see fit. So even if these "experts" recommended mental health screenings for everyone (which they don't -- read your own source carefully) -- it is meaningless as it has not been implemented. It seems from this article that the only legal result so far of this commission is the proposal of a law by Paul which would ensure that if the federal government would at any point attempt widespread mental health screenings, it would only be with parental consent -- which is the exact opposite of the point you tried to make.
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| amother |
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| Posted: Thu, Jun 14 2012, 1:22 pm Post subject: Re: re: Tipat Chalav= nuts! |
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| Ariellush wrote: | | amother wrote: | G-d bless America! Freedom of religion, freedom of choice, freedom to not tolerate abuse of any kind by anyone.
"You get what you pay for, cheap and free are worth exactly that, or less." |
And also, Amother, what happened with those USA children forced to take Ritalin? |
No one is forced to do anything except pay their taxes.
If that would happen I guess they would pick up and move to Israel. And get yelled at by stupid nurses.
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| amother |
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| Posted: Thu, Jun 14 2012, 1:24 pm Post subject: Re: re: Tipat Chalav= nuts! |
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| ora_43 wrote: | | amother wrote: | G-d bless America! Freedom of religion, freedom of choice, freedom to not tolerate abuse of any kind by anyone.
"You get what you pay for, cheap and free are worth exactly that, or less." |
I'm sure all the people in America who can't afford health care are feeling grateful that they've been spared from the occasional rotten nurse they might have encountered in a free system . |
Health care is better in America than anywhere else in the world. How many botched up and sick people come from all over to America for health care? When health care is cheap or free, it is never as good as when it is being paid for, whether by the government via taxes or by private individuals or corporations.
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| Delores |
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| Posted: Thu, Jun 14 2012, 1:32 pm Post subject: re: Tipat Chalav= nuts! |
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I know a woman whose child was very very sick (had some internal organ not functioning properly) and guess who sent the newborn to get tested ... the "crazy paranoid" nurse at tipat chalav. Thank Gd they found it on time and were able to save the baby. The reason why nurses and Drs are paranoid is because they would rather inconvenience 100 moms than to "let one slip".
And by the way, the nurses never called me a liar although I often lied. (Nurse" "Does child sleep on back?" Me" "Of course", Nurse "Does child get vitamin drops every day" Me: "Of course" ...)
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