Overeaters Anonymous

FINKEL

Sun, Nov 26 2006, 12:03 am

I did it for 8 weeks
and lost 22 lbs
it was my best dieting 8 weeks in my life
meaning I felt so good about myself and its very do able
go for it
I know people that lost alot of weight on it
unfort. I stopped and gained the 22 lbs back in about 3 months and another 28 lbs in the next 3 months
I then got the band this summer
lost over 30 lbs and feel great
as I know those 30 lbs lost
are lost forever and ever im yirtza hashem

cassandra

Tue, Jan 01 2008, 10:18 pm

If you truly believe food is an addiction and the only way you can overcome overeating is by eating sparsely and admitting that you are powerless to food, try it. If you want to learn to be normal around food and to come to the understanding that you control what you eat and food doesn't have to control you stay far away from it.

The few people I know who did OA had slight self-esteem issues (as many overweight people do) and OA really exacerbated the situation. (ie, I am disgusting, I can't control how I eat, I must supress my natural desires of hunger because they are negative, etc.) I really don't think it is healthy (psychologically, I mean) for some people.

IMO, weight loss is about a lot more than shedding pounds. OA is too, but I don't think it takes you in the right direction.

RedRuby

Wed, Jan 02 2008, 12:10 am

Quote:

the first step in Overeaters Anonymous (or any 12 step program) is that we admit we are powerless

How does that fit in with knowing we have bechira?

Motek, to me it sounds like total Bittul.

If you join OA, you may be admitting to be "powerless", but you are admitting loud and clear that you can change your habits == and that's total Bechira.

By joining a group and deciding to accept help, change and grow, that it the ultimate Bechira, don't you think?

It's such a brave choice.

yentaof8

Wed, Jan 02 2008, 12:30 am

Has anyone heard of Greysheet? I hear it is similar to OA in that you also admit that you are totally powerless when it comes to food and therefore everything gets weighed and measured and nothing is left to chance. There is a sponsor and weekly meetings involved - and I know a few women that lost a lot of weight on it but you need to be committed for life (one day at a time of course)

Motek

Thu, Jan 03 2008, 8:46 am

RedRuby wrote:

to me it sounds like total Bittul.

If you join OA, you may be admitting to be "powerless", but you are admitting loud and clear that you can change your habits == and that's total Bechira.

It makes no sense to me. If I am powerless, I CANNOT do anything, by definition! I agree with Cassandra.

Someone who was with OA this past year and lost a lot of weight told me, when I said to her how disciplined she was to follow the program, that no, she was not disciplined! I was surprised and questioned her. She said, it was like a fast day, when she has no problem fasting. I don't know if you know what she means but I think I do. On a fast day, we just can't eat, period. For someone who is committed to halacha, we don't see it as an act of discipline but just the way it is, no eating on those days. It's not an active choice, hmmm, should I eat today. She felt the same with the OA program.

Hey, she said it, not me! That was her assessment.

happyone

Thu, Jan 03 2008, 9:47 am

Motek wrote:

RedRuby wrote:

to me it sounds like total Bittul.

If you join OA, you may be admitting to be "powerless", but you are admitting loud and clear that you can change your habits == and that's total Bechira.

Yes WE are powerless, and therefore have to turn to a Higher Power (Hakodosh Baruch Hu) to help us with our Bechira in changing our habits.

amother

Thu, Jan 03 2008, 1:09 pm

O.k I am going to try to be nice here although I would love to really give it to the posters that are as usual "not living it" so they don't get it.
First things first- If you are not a compulsive overeater or addicted to some other substance most likely you won't understand so just try to listen and really listen Confused

2- Oa is not just about weight loss. Being abstinent is one of the tools in recovery.
3- The first step we take (there are twelve) is admitting we are powerless over our addiction. You can not understand addiction obviously so you don't understand that admitting we have no control and that our live have become unmanageable is so healing. We are not like normal eaters as much as we want to be. Again you wouldn't understand. We can not just stop eating and it has nothing to do with will power.
4-Then we say step two "that a power greater then ourselves can return us to sanity". We are not in control of our disease (yes it is just like someone who has diabetes. They did not choose it but its a disease a test that H-shem gave them). We learn that we can control our reactions, we can use tools that the program gives us to do step three which is turning and surrendering our disease to HIM. We are not coping out and saying here heal me make me thin/sane/normal... We are saying you can do for me what I can not do for myself. O.A is a program of prayer and action. Replacing the void inside with spirituality. Instead of overeating we use the tools and prayer to surrender it to G-d.
There is so so much for depth to this but I do not think this is the place for it. If you are interested in finding out more go to a few meetings and after about 6 meetings hopefully you won't be such a cynic. I probably wasn't very clear and you may think this is all hogwash and absolute rubbish but I guarantee no respectable Rav would tell you this is anti-Torah in the least. If anything it is a beautiful program that helps many people live their lives full and joyful. The program is based on spirituality. It teaches you to turn to G-d let him fill you.

cassandra

Thu, Jan 03 2008, 2:06 pm

If it helps you, I am a compulsive overeater and have been around the block. So no need to yell at me.

I said what I said based on extensive research, things that I have tried myself, and personal accounts from friends who have been in OA. I'm glad it works for you, but I prefer to deal with my eating in other ways.. ways that allow mw to feel good about myself and like a normal person. Eating is a natural function and no one should feel negatively about. It is also a great pleasure in life and I believe that you can learn to enjoy food without being compulsive about it.

I understand that there is some comfort in calling your problem "addiction" but there is very little research to support this, and at the end of the day I think it can be psychologically harmful.

RedRuby

Thu, Jan 03 2008, 7:14 pm

Quote:

O.k I am going to try to be nice here although I would love to really give it to the posters that are as usual "not living it" so they don't get it.

Thank you for taking the time to explain. I understand it better (but not completely, because like you said, I'm not living it).

I understand that someone with this situation is powerless, but the fact that they are doing something about the powerless situation - joining a group, going to meetings, following the steps - is a tremendous act of choice...and I admire and respect you for that.

Isn't there something about "having the wisdom to change what I can, accept what I cannot and the wisdom to know the difference". ?

Hats off to you...

I wish you health and success in the program.

cassandra

Thu, Jan 03 2008, 7:24 pm

RedRuby wrote:

I understand that someone with this situation is powerless

Why are they powerless? Food is not the same as drugs and alcohol. The Researchers who have tried to show things like sugar as possessing addictive properties have not been successful. You might FEEL like you are addicted, but science says otherwise. That means that there is hope to change yourself in other, gentler ways, ways that allow you to be kinder to yourself.

IMO, the best way to overcome this kind of eating disorder is to learn that you are IN CONTROL and have the power to do what is best for you and take care of yourself, rather than resigning yourself as an addict with no power over food. That's just sad. Food should become what you eat to fuel yourself and to also enjoy, instead of a demon that you have to battle. That's no life.

And YES, I have managed to control my eating problem this way.

RedRuby

Thu, Jan 03 2008, 7:36 pm

cassandra, it sounds like the 'powerless' definition works for some.

I'm happy you were able to be successful in your way, but maybe taking some of the blame and stigma away is very helpful to others.

But doesn't it stand to reason that different methods work for different people? Yeah, we could argue about what research has discovered (you can find a research for anything) but I think this slant is not the kind of input that is supportive to someone who is finding success with the program.

Again, I'm an outsider looking in, so I don't know.