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Father Asks School To Bar Unvaccinated Children for son
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amother


 

Post Wed, Jan 28 2015, 5:37 pm
sourstix wrote:
firstly, this is a question I have cause I dont know, is it true that a person can get measles and the symptoms come out let say 24 hrs later? like with other bacterias? if so how can you tell me that they will do what they can if the child itself doesnt know that he/she has it? next if rhett, does die bec of this according to law its manslaughter. even though the person with the disease didnt intend to. in this case the parents chose not to vaccinate, the risk they took was making someone else sick and that perosn die. I really think these parents would think twice if that happened to their child. so why cant all parents think this way? think about others a little. I dont want to get into the reasons for not vaccinating. but if this were my kid and myu child died bec of that I would do whatever it takes to get those parents arrested for unintentionally killing my child chv'. I dont iknow why the law isnt stressed this way. if someone doesnt like it they can go live some other place. thats fine all pp not vaccinated why can t you all go to a place that are all likeminded. this way you are happy and so are the vaccinated. enough said I am just so frustrated

Manslaughter? According to which law? And how can you blame it on them? You can get diseases from absolutely anywhere and it's on the immunocompromised person to be on top of their health and stay home. Yes, stay home. You can catch it from spit on the street or railing at the mall. Forget public bathrooms etc. You can't control everyone else so you gotta make sure you yourself are safe. And I'm having an incredibly hard time reading all your fully educated posts for lack of punctuation and fact.
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ora_43




 
 
    
 

Post Wed, Jan 28 2015, 5:40 pm
amother wrote:
Question:
If unvaccinated kids endanger vaccinated kids, then doesn't this boy who survived cancer and who cannot be vaccinated become a risk to all the other children at school? Why are all the vaccinated kids less at risk from a cancer survivor then some other random unvaccinated child?

He's not worried about vaccinated kids being at risk. He's worried about kids who can't be vaccinated.

Yes, kids who can't be vaccinated for medical reasons are just as much at risk for passing on diseases kids get vaccinated for as are kids who aren't vaccinated due to their parents' beliefs. But the issue isn't getting the immunization rate to 100%, it's bringing it high enough to bring back herd immunity.
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Think1st




 
 
    
 

Post Wed, Jan 28 2015, 6:24 pm
Have you ever seen an un-vaccinted child allergic to nuts ? or any other food allergy. what is the percentage of cancer patients amongst the vaccinated VS un-vaxed ?
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amother


 

Post Wed, Jan 28 2015, 6:29 pm
ora_43 wrote:
He's not worried about vaccinated kids being at risk. He's worried about kids who can't be vaccinated.



THAT is exactly the point. HE isn't worried about the risk his son will bring to the rest of the student body. He is only worried about his own kid. Fine. I don't begrudge him that. Just like I put my kids first. Always.

But let's call a spade a spade. He is asking everyone else to risk their own kids' health (meaning asking parents who are protecting their children by not vaccinating them to roll the dice and vaccinate them anyhow AND asking all those parents who do vaccinate but worry about their kids being exposed to unvaccinated kids to just deal with it) to accommodate him.
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Barbara




 
 
    
 

Post Wed, Jan 28 2015, 6:32 pm
Think1st wrote:
Have you ever seen an un-vaccinted child allergic to nuts ? or any other food allergy. what is the percentage of cancer patients amongst the vaccinated VS un-vaxed ?


There was no cancer before vaccinations?

Food allergies also existed for hundreds of years.

But if you believe otherwise, please provide links to peer-reviewed studies.
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LittleDucky




 
 
    
 

Post Wed, Jan 28 2015, 6:33 pm
sourstix wrote:
I do see the logic that if the childs immune system is that low why doesnt he hire a tutor to help the child keep up with the class and when his system is better to come then. homeschooling is an option here so why have to fight with all of these parents if theres a way out.


It could be YEARS before they are able to be immunized. YEARS after being in remission. A cold may not kill them but measles and mumps will.
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Barbara




 
 
    
 

Post Wed, Jan 28 2015, 6:35 pm
amother wrote:
THAT is exactly the point. HE isn't worried about the risk his son will bring to the rest of the student body. He is only worried about his own kid. Fine. I don't begrudge him that. Just like I put my kids first. Always.

But let's call a spade a spade. He is asking everyone else to risk their own kids' health (meaning asking parents who are protecting their children by not vaccinating them to roll the dice and vaccinate them anyhow AND asking all those parents who do vaccinate but worry about their kids being exposed to unvaccinated kids to just deal with it) to accommodate him.


He doesn't believe that vaccinations will impact the health of those children.

He also, FTR, did not ask that anyone with a religious or medical exemption vaccinate.

But you're right. He's asking that people do their best to make sure that their kids don't kill his. Shame on him for asking such a thing.
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amother


 

Post Wed, Jan 28 2015, 6:38 pm
Barbara wrote:
He doesn't believe that vaccinations will impact the health of those children.

He also, FTR, did not ask that anyone with a religious or medical exemption vaccinate.

But you're right. He's asking that people do their best to make sure that their kids don't kill his. Shame on him for asking such a thing.

He asked people with a "personal exemption" not to do it which in some states is the equivalent of a "religious exemption". He should be the one taking the onus on keeping his kid safe. Yes, it's hard but the kid can get sick from many other sources in a school and is best off at home.

And why does his belief trump the parents belief that it will impact the health of their children?
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LittleDucky




 
 
    
 

Post Wed, Jan 28 2015, 6:38 pm
Think1st wrote:
Have you ever seen an un-vaccinted child allergic to nuts ? or any other food allergy. what is the percentage of cancer patients amongst the vaccinated VS un-vaxed ?


Yep. I know unvaccinated kids with allergies to lots of things. Allergies can be genetic. Or from trying to be "too healthy" and not letting their kids eat dirt.
And I know people who get cancer who don't vaccinate.
But Please keep spouting your uneducated and unresearched falsies. It is quite funny to think there were no allergies or cancer diagnoses before vaccines.
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MiracleMama




 
 
    
 

Post Wed, Jan 28 2015, 6:38 pm
Barbara wrote:


He also, FTR, did not ask that anyone with a religious or medical exemption vaccinate.



Okay, so if not the kids with religious or medical exemptions.... who are these unvaccinated kids coming to school that he wants barred? What did I miss?
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Barbara




 
 
    
 

Post Wed, Jan 28 2015, 6:45 pm
amother wrote:
He asked people with a "personal exemption" not to do it which in some states is the equivalent of a "religious exemption". He should be the one taking the onus on keeping his kid safe. Yes, it's hard but the kid can get sick from many other sources in a school and is best off at home.


So, his child should stay at home, out of school and out of public, for years of his life, in order to allow people who personally object to the law of the state in which they reside to continue to fail to comply with that law, and to therefore endanger the life of that child.
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Barbara




 
 
    
 

Post Wed, Jan 28 2015, 6:46 pm
MiracleMama wrote:
Okay, so if not the kids with religious or medical exemptions.... who are these unvaccinated kids coming to school that he wants barred? What did I miss?


Personal exemptions.
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amother


 

Post Wed, Jan 28 2015, 6:48 pm
Barbara wrote:
So, his child should stay at home, out of school and out of public, for years of his life, in order to allow people who personally object to the law of the state in which they reside to continue to fail to comply with that law, and to therefore endanger the life of that child.

Yes. His child can get sick in any public (or not so public setting). There is no way to control what he will be exposed to and as long as he is immunocompromised he should stay home as much as possible. Or at very least not hang out in a breading place for viruses and other germs (ex school). Forcing vaccinations on others wont solve his problem. And those who have exemptions from vaccinations are breaking no laws.
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Barbara




 
 
    
 

Post Wed, Jan 28 2015, 6:49 pm
amother wrote:
He asked people with a "personal exemption" not to do it which in some states is the equivalent of a "religious exemption". He should be the one taking the onus on keeping his kid safe. Yes, it's hard but the kid can get sick from many other sources in a school and is best off at home.

And why does his belief trump the parents belief that it will impact the health of their children?


And why do the personal beliefs of others trump the law of the state, which requires vaccination?

As I said, I'd place all of the non-vaxers in an enclosed classroom, not allowing them to have recess, gym or other activities with the rest of the school. They get their non-vaccination. The child who is vulnerable gets to be safe.

ETA -- or, why not expose those kids to measles, which is what the family is afraid of. 90% of exposed people get the disease. As a non-vaxer, you apparently believe its not so bad (25% hospitalization rate notwithstanding). Then no one has to worry any more.
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mille




 
 
    
 

Post Wed, Jan 28 2015, 6:55 pm
Think1st wrote:
Have you ever seen an un-vaccinted child allergic to nuts ? or any other food allergy. what is the percentage of cancer patients amongst the vaccinated VS un-vaxed ?


Yes.

What's your point? I have also seen autistic children who have never been vaccinated. Try again, with real science this time.

Unvaccinated people are a minority in the US (THANK GOD FOR THAT), so of course there are less cancer patients who have never been vaccinated vs cancer patients among the vaccinated population. I think you need to learn how statistics work.
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MiracleMama




 
 
    
 

Post Wed, Jan 28 2015, 6:56 pm
Barbara wrote:
And why do the personal beliefs of others trump the law of the state, which requires vaccination?



But the state grants the waivers, so why do make it sound like those families are doing something against the law?
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amother


 

Post Wed, Jan 28 2015, 6:58 pm
Barbara wrote:
And why do the personal beliefs of others trump the law of the state, which requires vaccination?

As I said, I'd place all of the non-vaxers in an enclosed classroom, not allowing them to have recess, gym or other activities with the rest of the school. They get their non-vaccination. The child who is vulnerable gets to be safe.

ETA -- or, why not expose those kids to measles, which is what the family is afraid of. 90% of exposed people get the disease. As a non-vaxer, you apparently believe its not so bad (25% hospitalization rate notwithstanding). Then no one has to worry any more.

Again, it is not against state law with their exemption and the point is the immunocompromised kid is STILL not safe. Which part of that are you not understanding?? He can still get disease from any surface in school. He can die of a cold not just something more dramatic like measles. If it were god forbid my kid we were talking about I would not risk their health and leave it in the hands of others. I'd keep them home.
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Barbara




 
 
    
 

Post Wed, Jan 28 2015, 7:10 pm
amother wrote:
Again, it is not against state law with their exemption and the point is the immunocompromised kid is STILL not safe. Which part of that are you not understanding?? He can still get disease from any surface in school. He can die of a cold not just something more dramatic like measles. If it were god forbid my kid we were talking about I would not risk their health and leave it in the hands of others. I'd keep them home.


They have an exemption from the law that permits them to send their kids to school even though they are not immunized. That doesn't mean that there isn't a law requiring them to immunize.

And I highly doubt that a kid who has completed chemo would die from a cold.

One more suggestion -- all kids claiming exemptions are assigned to a different school in the district, leaving only vaccinated kids at school with this child.

I've offered a lot of suggestions that allow people like you not to vaccinate -- expose your child to the disease so he has natural immunity; enclosed classroom; sent to a different school. Why is the only compromise you're willing to accept that this child stay at home or risk your kid killing him?
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amother


 

Post Wed, Jan 28 2015, 7:15 pm
Barbara wrote:
They have an exemption from the law that permits them to send their kids to school even though they are not immunized. That doesn't mean that there isn't a law requiring them to immunize.

And I highly doubt that a kid who has completed chemo would die from a cold.

One more suggestion -- all kids claiming exemptions are assigned to a different school in the district, leaving only vaccinated kids at school with this child.

I've offered a lot of suggestions that allow people like you not to vaccinate -- expose your child to the disease so he has natural immunity; enclosed classroom; sent to a different school. Why is the only compromise you're willing to accept that this child stay at home or risk your kid killing him?

Because the kid will still be at risk so it's silly. Does the father care about the welfare of his child or not? Getting only vaccinated classmates wont help. There are still dangerous things. And the flu can more likely kill him. And the flu shot is very unlikely to help him (12% effective this year).

Besides, someones immunization records is priveleged info and while other parents would like to know the kid a legal right to keep it private. So no way to know which kids to be in which class.

ETA: I knew someone growing up who completed chemo and then died from a silly virus that most people get better from. It's dangerous to go out while immunocompromised.
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Barbara




 
 
    
 

Post Wed, Jan 28 2015, 7:31 pm
amother wrote:
Because the kid will still be at risk so it's silly. Does the father care about the welfare of his child or not? Getting only vaccinated classmates wont help. There are still dangerous things. And the flu can more likely kill him. And the flu shot is very unlikely to help him (12% effective this year).

Besides, someones immunization records is priveleged info and while other parents would like to know the kid a legal right to keep it private. So no way to know which kids to be in which class.

ETA: I knew someone growing up who completed chemo and then died from a silly virus that most people get better from. It's dangerous to go out while immunocompromised.


And he thinks its silly that you won't vaccinate, which we all agree places his kid at additional risk.

But your position is that you have the right to do that, and won't take any action whatsoever to protect another child.

You won't agree to your child going to a different school to protect him.

You won't agree to your child being in a different classroom to protect him.

You won't agree to expose your child to the disease to protect him.

You and your child have all the rights. This child has none.

And you wonder why I think that anti-vaxers are selfish.
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