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Father Asks School To Bar Unvaccinated Children for son
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blueberries




 
 
    
 

Post Wed, Jan 28 2015, 12:59 pm
Quote:
Rhett Krawitt, 6, outside his school in Tiburon, Calif. Seven percent of the children in his school are not vaccinated.

Jan, 27 2015 — —
Carl Krawitt has watched his son, Rhett, now 6, fight leukemia for the past 4 1/2 years. For more than three of those years, Rhett has undergone round after round of chemotherapy. Last year he finished chemotherapy, and doctors say he is in remission.

Now, there's a new threat, one that the family should not have to worry about: measles.

Rhett cannot be vaccinated, because his immune system is still rebuilding. It may be months more before his body is healthy enough to get all his immunizations. Until then, he depends on everyone around him for protection — what's known as herd immunity.

But Rhett lives in Marin County, Calif., a county with the dubious honor of having the highest rate of "personal belief exemptions" in the Bay Area and among the highest in the state. This school year, 6.45 percent of children in Marin have a personal belief exemption, which allows parents to lawfully send their children to school unvaccinated against communicable diseases like measles, polio, whooping cough and more.

Carl Krawitt has had just about enough. "It's very emotional for me," he said. "If you choose not to immunize your own child and your own child dies because they get measles, OK, that's your responsibility, that's your choice. But if your child gets sick and gets my child sick and my child dies, then ... your action has harmed my child."

Krawitt is taking action of his own. His son attends Reed Elementary in Tiburon, a school with a 7 percent personal belief exemption rate. (The statewide average is 2.5 percent). Krawitt had previously worked with the school nurse to make sure that all the children in his son's class were fully vaccinated. He said the school was very helpful and accommodating.

Now Krawitt and his wife, Jodi, have emailed the district's superintendent, requesting that the district "require immunization as a condition of attendance, with the only exception being those who cannot medically be vaccinated."

Carl Krawitt provided me with Superintendent Steven Herzog's response. Herzog didn't directly address their query, instead saying: "We are monitoring the situation closely and will take whatever actions necessary to ensure the safety of our students."

Typically, a response to health emergencies rests with county health officers. During the current measles outbreak, we've already seen that unvaccinated students at Huntington Beach High School in Orange County were ordered to stay out of school for three weeks after a student there contracted measles. It's one way to contain an outbreak.

But those steps were taken in the face of a confirmed case at the school.

When I called Marin County health officer Matt Willis to see what he thought of keeping unvaccinated kids out of school even if there were no confirmed cases, he sounded intrigued. "This is partly a legal question," he said.

But he was open to the idea and said he was going to check with the state to see what precedent there was to take such an action.

Right now, there are no cases of measles anywhere in Marin and no suspected cases either. Still, "if the outbreak progresses and we start seeing more and more cases," Willis said, "then this is a step we might want to consider" — requiring unvaccinated children to stay home, even without confirmed cases at a specific school.

Rhett has been treated at the University of California, San Francisco, and his oncologist there, Dr. Robert Goldsby, said that he is likely at higher risk of complications if he were to get measles.

"When your immune system isn't working as well, it allows many different infections to be worse," Goldsby said. "It's not just Rhett. There are hundreds of other kids in the Bay Area that are going through cancer therapy, and it's not fair to them. They can't get immunized; they have to rely on their friends and colleagues and community to help protect them."

Goldsby pointed to the number of people who, when facing a friend or family member who receives a challenging diagnosis, will immediately ask how they can help. "Many families will say, 'What can I do to help? What can I do to help?' " he said, repeating it for emphasis. "One of the main things they can do is make sure their [own] kids are vaccinated to protect others."

Krawitt has been speaking up about vaccination for a long time now. He told me about going to a parent meeting at his daughter's school just before the start of the school year, where a staff member reminded parents not to send peanut products to school, since a child or children had an allergy. "It's really important your kids don't bring peanuts, because kids can die," Krawitt recalls the group being told.

The irony was not lost on him. He told me he immediately responded, "In the interest of the health and safety of our children, can we have the assurance that all the kids at our school are immunized?"

He found out later from a friend that other parents who were present were "mad that you asked the question, because they don't immunize their kids."

http://www.northcountrypublicr.....ldren


Do you think it's right what he is trying to do for his son or he should keep his child home?

If they don't allow nuts because some kids may have a reaction why can they also enforce immunization.
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Frenchfry




 
 
    
 

Post Wed, Jan 28 2015, 1:08 pm
I think the two are very different. (My kids are immunized, BTW, by the time they're in school).

A parent who chooses not to immunize, has decided that the potential risks outweigh the benifits. The same cannot be said for not having peanuts in school.
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LittleDucky




 
 
    
 

Post Wed, Jan 28 2015, 1:22 pm
I agree with this father. I know dozens of parents in several cities who face the same dilemma. All true stories. Send my kid to school and possibly expose them to a near fatal illness (for them it would be fatal). Unless you know the angst parents have over everyday situations you cannot truly make an informed decision. I know a cute kid on chemo who has to eat sealed food items in public- she can't grab an orange from the snack table in school. She goes to school with a mask on. That is how dangerously low her immune system is.
A friend has a seriously ill child. (Chronic, not cancer). There is no way for that kid to go to school. Unless it's the doctor, he doesn't really leave their house. His immune system can't fight off a simple cold. But a sibling (call him Moshe) who was vaccinated had a classmate who wasn't. That classmate got one of these preventable diseases but in the meantime contaminated the rest of the class's stuff. They played with each other's toys from home, borrowed scarves and mittens. Moshe brought home the virus and almost KILLED his own brother. By going to school.
Now what about Moshe infecting (through his stuff) his pregnant mom? Measles could either end the pregnancy or leave the baby seriously disabled.
And it could kill Zeidi and his Alter Bubbe.
And Uncle Danny who is going through chemo.

Chemo destroys any immunity the patient has. They could have had chicken pox before diagnosis and it wouldn't matter- they can get it during chemo (which could be deadly) and after chemo. Again deadly because low immune system. And again later on if they caught it too close to concluding chemo. Not too problematic for a healthy person. But for a SICK CHILD? Deadly. And then what about other diseases that have higher fatality rates? A kid conquered cancer but now nearly dies from something preventable.
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amother


 

Post Wed, Jan 28 2015, 1:24 pm
Frenchfry wrote:
I think the two are very different. (My kids are immunized, BTW, by the time they're in school).

A parent who chooses not to immunize, has decided that the potential risks outweigh the benifits. The same cannot be said for not having peanuts in school.


Why not? Both could be deadly.
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amother


 

Post Wed, Jan 28 2015, 1:25 pm
Yes, this IS very different from peanuts.
Nobody's kids NEED to have peanuts, so even though it's a bit annoying not to be able to send your kids a peanut butter sandwich for lunch, it's an easy sacrifice to ensure another kid's safety.
Vaccination is another story. I feel very much for this father. But at the same time I also feel for the parents who have exercised their right not to vaccinate because they feel it is in their children's best interest. All have their children's interests at heart. I don't think this father's needs outweigh those of other parents. It's A LOT to demand someone vaccinate their children when they believe it may harm their own kids.
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Frenchfry




 
 
    
 

Post Wed, Jan 28 2015, 1:28 pm
Because there is no arguement, anywhere that will tell you that not eating nuts while in school is a health risk for your child.
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acccdac




 
 
    
 

Post Wed, Jan 28 2015, 1:31 pm
I read a blog post yesterday, I wont post it here because it was filled with a lot of cursing and written in an offensive way, but the author brought up a very good point.

we as mothers want to protect our children. We can do whatever we think it best for OUR children whether that be disposable diapers vs cloth, breast vs formula, organic vs. non-organic, etc

HOWEVER,
Those examples only affect OUR CHILD. When someone else's child is put at risk that's a different story.

My child eating peanut butter at home harms NO ONE.
My child eating peanut butter in school HARMS OTHER KIDS.

I disagree with the poster who said peanuts and vaccinations are different.

What if the only food my child will eat has peanut butter, the school should make an exception because my child will not ingest any food for 8 hours?????

There is a rule in school that there can only be Cholav Yisroel regardless of what you eat at home. I know someone who was allowed to bring in tube yogurts (not cholav yisroel) because that IS ALL THE KIDS EATS. There is not "risk" to the other children because it's not like a cookie that can be shared and it is ONLY eaten during lunch time (when the teacher is watching and is aware of the issue).

You cant apply this exception to germs/sickness. I as a teacher/parent get upset when I see a student in school hacking away and getting fellow students sick. We force parents to pick up their kids when their kids are "known" as contagious, meaning they have fever.
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amother


 

Post Wed, Jan 28 2015, 1:34 pm
I also know a child who cannot attend school because there are vaccinated children in her class.
[Right now she can't go out of the house because of weekend immunity and any siblings that gets even the slightest bit sick have to move out, but when she had the possibility of going she was still unable to because of 2 classmates]
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amother


 

Post Wed, Jan 28 2015, 1:40 pm
Question:
If unvaccinated kids endanger vaccinated kids, then doesn't this boy who survived cancer and who cannot be vaccinated become a risk to all the other children at school? Why are all the vaccinated kids less at risk from a cancer survivor then some other random unvaccinated child?
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Barbara




 
 
    
 

Post Wed, Jan 28 2015, 1:41 pm
amother wrote:
Yes, this IS very different from peanuts.
Nobody's kids NEED to have peanuts, so even though it's a bit annoying not to be able to send your kids a peanut butter sandwich for lunch, it's an easy sacrifice to ensure another kid's safety.
Vaccination is another story. I feel very much for this father. But at the same time I also feel for the parents who have exercised their right not to vaccinate because they feel it is in their children's best interest. All have their children's interests at heart. I don't think this father's needs outweigh those of other parents. It's A LOT to demand someone vaccinate their children when they believe it may harm their own kids.


This is, of course, why its a much more difficult issue.

Where a parent is legally allowed to send his child to a public school without vaccination, its difficult to say "you must vaccinate," even if refusing to do so could result in the death of another child.

I find it shocking that people were angered that a parent would ask others to not endanger his child in that way.

Perhaps the school could create a separate class for children whose parents refuse to vaccinate. These children would be kept away from the sick child, to reduce the risk of them endangering him. They would be exempt from school-wide activities and assemblies, and similar things.
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amother


 

Post Wed, Jan 28 2015, 2:03 pm
I don't understand why all this blame of disease transmission is being put on healthy unvaccinated children when there's a lot more going on. There are plenty of adults that are just as "unprotected". Does the vaccine give lifelong immunity? Are all the old vaccines given years ago still in effect on the older generation? Is he also harassing all this child's aunts, uncles, grandparents, neighbors, shul members etc to check if their immunity waned? Are all the illegal immigrants working in and around our houses, schools, shops vaccinated? There's so much more involved, this misplaced anger seems so unfair to parents that are doing what they truly believe is the healthiest and best for their child. Rarely do parents just wake up and decide they don't want to prick their child therefore no vaccines. It's usually after months and months (even years) of researching, listening to different doctors' opinions and experiences, reading, reading and more reading etc to come to this difficult decision that this is the best they can do for their child's immune system now. I truly feel very very sorry for this father, it's heartbreaking, but there needs to be another way to go about it.

ETA I'm anonymous because I find the vaccines topic is so heated, if anyone sees you're looking into it you're branded as "extreme" or crazy and I don't need my family thinking this of me right now. It's sad that you're not even allowed to "consider" what the other side is saying without being ridiculed and attacked.
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amother


 

Post Wed, Jan 28 2015, 4:17 pm
I feel for the father. I really do. But being as his son is immunocompromised he's probably best off keeping him home until he is a little bit better. It's unfair to ask people to harm their own children (yes, that's how anti vaxers see it they don't vaccinate because they believe it harms their child) to protect yours. Besides, as someone else pointed out the unvaccinated immunocompromised patient is now a similar risk to anyone else. Why should he have special privileges and be able to come to school unvaccinated after asking that others shouldn't be offered the same privilege? I also agree that it's completely different than peanut butter for the reason mentioned above--not having it for 8 hours wont kill anyone ever (even if they wont eat for those 8 hours) and it's also an actual danger. Not vaccinating is at best a theoretical danger.
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sourstix




 
 
    
 

Post Wed, Jan 28 2015, 4:36 pm
firstly, this is a question I have cause I dont know, is it true that a person can get measles and the symptoms come out let say 24 hrs later? like with other bacterias? if so how can you tell me that they will do what they can if the child itself doesnt know that he/she has it? next if rhett, does die bec of this according to law its manslaughter. even though the person with the disease didnt intend to. in this case the parents chose not to vaccinate, the risk they took was making someone else sick and that perosn die. I really think these parents would think twice if that happened to their child. so why cant all parents think this way? think about others a little. I dont want to get into the reasons for not vaccinating. but if this were my kid and myu child died bec of that I would do whatever it takes to get those parents arrested for unintentionally killing my child chv'. I dont iknow why the law isnt stressed this way. if someone doesnt like it they can go live some other place. thats fine all pp not vaccinated why can t you all go to a place that are all likeminded. this way you are happy and so are the vaccinated. enough said I am just so frustrated
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imaima




 
 
    
 

Post Wed, Jan 28 2015, 4:39 pm
amother wrote:
I feel for the father. I really do. But being as his son is immunocompromised he's probably best off keeping him home until he is a little bit better. It's unfair to ask people to harm their own children (yes, that's how anti vaxers see it they don't vaccinate because they believe it harms their child) to protect yours. Besides, as someone else pointed out the unvaccinated immunocompromised patient is now a similar risk to anyone else. Why should he have special privileges and be able to come to school unvaccinated after asking that others shouldn't be offered the same privilege? I also agree that it's completely different than peanut butter for the reason mentioned above--not having it for 8 hours wont kill anyone ever (even if they wont eat for those 8 hours) and it's also an actual danger. Not vaccinating is at best a theoretical danger.


Do you really see no difference between a personal belief and cancer???
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sourstix




 
 
    
 

Post Wed, Jan 28 2015, 4:40 pm
[quote="amother"]I feel for the father. I really do. But being as his son is immunocompromised he's probably best off keeping him home until he is a little bit better. It's unfair to ask people to harm their own children (yes, that's how anti vaxers see it they don't vaccinate because they believe it harms their child) to protect yours. Besides, as someone else pointed out the unvaccinated immunocompromised patient is now a similar risk to anyone else. Why should he have special privileges and be able to come to school unvaccinated after asking that others shouldn't be offered the same privilege? I also agree that it's completely different than peanut butter for the reason mentioned above--not having it for 8 hours wont kill anyone ever (even if they wont eat for those 8 hours) and it's also an actual danger. Not vaccinating is at best a theoretical danger.[/quote]

I need to answer that. dh has a grandfather that was a teenager by the time the war broke out. and he says he remembers how pp without vaccines looked like and how many children died bec of it. its very ugly. so you can choose to have 1/2 of your kids die or what other risks that come with vaccine. if its autism its still alive, maybe not what I envisioned and very painful to the parents but common its still here. and most of our kids are surviving today bec of it. you can disagree but these are the facts.
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sourstix




 
 
    
 

Post Wed, Jan 28 2015, 4:44 pm
[quote="amother"]I feel for the father. I really do. But being as his son is immunocompromised he's probably best off keeping him home until he is a little bit better. It's unfair to ask people to harm their own children (yes, that's how anti vaxers see it they don't vaccinate because they believe it harms their child) to protect yours. Besides, as someone else pointed out the unvaccinated immunocompromised patient is now a similar risk to anyone else. Why should he have special privileges and be able to come to school unvaccinated after asking that others shouldn't be offered the same privilege? I also agree that it's completely different than peanut butter for the reason mentioned above--not having it for 8 hours wont kill anyone ever (even if they wont eat for those 8 hours) and it's also an actual danger. Not vaccinating is at best a theoretical danger.[/quote]

then come speak with dh grandfather then tell me if its theoretical. in fact the polio shot came to israel after the usa and I know someone(rebbetzin brill) she as a child got polio and they couldnt help her bythe time she came to america it was all over, today she is crippled with so many physical issues, do you want to see her? go to williamsburg shes a kalla teacher you can see her in shalhevers in boro park. then come back and talk this way
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sourstix




 
 
    
 

Post Wed, Jan 28 2015, 4:48 pm
[quote="amother"]I don't understand why all this blame of disease transmission is being put on healthy unvaccinated children when there's a lot more going on. There are plenty of adults that are just as "unprotected". Does the vaccine give lifelong immunity? Are all the old vaccines given years ago still in effect on the older generation? Is he also harassing all this child's aunts, uncles, grandparents, neighbors, shul members etc to check if their immunity waned? Are all the illegal immigrants working in and around our houses, schools, shops vaccinated? There's so much more involved, this misplaced anger seems so unfair to parents that are doing what they truly believe is the healthiest and best for their child. Rarely do parents just wake up and decide they don't want to prick their child therefore no vaccines. It's usually after months and months (even years) of researching, listening to different doctors' opinions and experiences, reading, reading and more reading etc to come to this difficult decision that this is the best they can do for their child's immune system now. I truly feel very very sorry for this father, it's heartbreaking, but there needs to be another way to go about it.

ETA I'm anonymous because I find the vaccines topic is so heated, if anyone sees you're looking into it you're branded as "extreme" or crazy and I don't need my family thinking this of me right now. It's sad that you're not even allowed to "consider" what the other side is saying without being ridiculed and attacked.[/quote]

your uneducated before you come here go do some research
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amother


 

Post Wed, Jan 28 2015, 4:51 pm
sourstix wrote:
your uneducated before you come here go do some research


Speaking of uneducated...
You are = you're. Not your.
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amother


 

Post Wed, Jan 28 2015, 5:06 pm
Isn't a bad cold or flu virus also dangerous for an immuno-compromised cancer child? I don't know why the father isn't just as outraged at parents who let their kids have awful eating habits of daily junk food leading them to have a lowered immune system and constantly having colds and catching every virus etc. Perhaps the father should be insisting the school have an extreme health food makeover and require every child to be given immune strengthening vitamins every morning so there should be a much lower risk of viruses and sick, coughing children in school. (especially since everyone agrees the flu vaccine was quite ineffective this year). While vaccines are important they only protect you against that specific disease. They do nothing for building up your overall immune system regarding the hundreds of other viruses out there. For that we need to be vigilant on building up our immune system with constant good nutrition and important vitamins, adequate sleep and good hand washing habits.
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sourstix




 
 
    
 

Post Wed, Jan 28 2015, 5:21 pm
I do see the logic that if the childs immune system is that low why doesnt he hire a tutor to help the child keep up with the class and when his system is better to come then. homeschooling is an option here so why have to fight with all of these parents if theres a way out.
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